stores holding the bag

[Jigger]

The weather this year has been crazy. Here in the Northeast the temps. really haven't been all that cold. Christmas Eve day was 68 and today Christmas it got up to 64. Warm enough I pulled out my motorcycle and put a couple hundred miles on it.
Any way. I looked at my local Home Depot web site this past weekend. They showed they had 90 ton sitting. Well today while I was on my way home. I took a look. They received another delivery. Checked their web site again sure enough it is back to 150 ton. Locally I have Home Depot,TSC, and Lowes within a 3 mile radius. I checked on the others and between the three. There is well over 350 ton sitting on the ground. It appears that the big box stores pre purchase their orders. If that's the case. I wonder how much more is coming.
The longest night of the year just past us. So the days will be getting longer. As the sun gets higher in the sky the days will be warmer. Which means unless the weather starts cooling down the stores will be holding a lot of stock come spring.

 

[DDJR]

I noticed the tractor supply co. In Pittsfield ma has an immense stockpile of them too! I think there's going to be one heck of a sale this spring.

 

[billb3]

251, 117, 198 and 93 tons in the 4 Home Depot closest to me and that's just the $259 a ton stuff. Not inventoried online right now for some reason is the $299/ton that I know is in the closest store because I've walked by both skids several times in the last month. Usually someone has peeled/torn the covers down to see what brand is being offered but lately they've been untouched.
The people across the street had one or two tall skids that must have been a ton and a half ( judging from the height ) on a skid delivered on a no name flat bed with a fork lift.

 

[Peterfield]

251, 117, 198 and 193 tons in the 4 Home Depot closest to me and that's just the $259 a ton stuff. Not inventoried online right now for some reason is the $299/ton that I know is in the closest store because I've walked by both skids several times in the last month. Usually someone has peeled/torn the covers down to see what brand is being offered but lately they've been untouched.
The people across the street had one or two tall skids that must have been a ton and a half ( judging from the height ) on a skid delivered on a no name flat bed with a fork lift.

Noticed the same thing at Lowe's and HD's near me.

 

[BrotherBart]

They have to all be remembering a few years ago when it was warm right up until January. HD and Lowe's slashed prices on everything heating related in early January and the shelves cleared out. And a week later all hell broke loose weather wise and they were selling out of an empty sack. I loaded up on pipe stuff that year at HD. Some I knew I wouldn't need for a year or so. Got it for chump change. Lowe's had knocked D'Longhi oil filled radiators down to $17 apiece from $50. I backed the Suburban up to the door and told them to fill it up.

The local manager at HD was highly pissed when the weather changed.

 

[bags]

Just hope it stays warm for the good deals come spring and a reality check for the pellet producers and suppliers. But Bro Bart does have a point. We are not out of the weeds yet. Three more months to go at least.

They are all sitting on boat loads of skids around here too. They are not moving them and a few places have lowered prices or ran sales already this season here. I just found Somersets for $214 a ton. Hopefully, I'll be loading them up for below $200 a ton. Fingers crossed but I am not holding my breath......... YET!

 

[snikr]

If this crazy weather keeps up it looks like the pellets sellers might have a bit of leftover stock come spring. But as Bro Bart is right, we still have a ways to go yet.

 

[Funnydirt14]

Just hope it stays warm for the good deals come spring and a reality check for the pellet producers and suppliers. But Bro Bart does have a point. We are not out of the weeds yet. Three more months to go at least.

They are all sitting on boat loads of skids around here too. They are not moving them and a few places have lowered prices or ran sales already this season here. I just found Somersets for $214 a ton. Hopefully, I'll be loading them up for below $200 a ton. Fingers crossed but I am not holding my breath......... YET!

I'm with you. Greed has fueled the increase in pellets. It use to be they would blame it on higher oil prices and fuel costs to make the stuff. Now what are they blaming it on. It's not costing the pellet manufacturers any more to make pellets now then it did 10 years ago, but there profit margin has doubled and that's where the increase comes from. I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but unfortunately the cold is coming soon. I just hope in the mean time there is such a glut in pellet making material that they will have to lower the prices just like BIG OIL..............

 

[Lake Girl]

Big Oil effects pellet manufacture in a couple of ways ... with lowered oil production, they are not using as many pellets as absorbents in the field so more available for home owners for heating. Lowered costs due to cheaper gas/diesel in material acquisition and delivery.

 

[bogieb]

I'm with you. Greed has fueled the increase in pellets. It use to be they would blame it on higher oil prices and fuel costs to make the stuff. Now what are they blaming it on. It's not costing the pellet manufacturers any more to make pellets now then it did 10 years ago, but there profit margin has doubled and that's where the increase comes from. I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but unfortunately the cold is coming soon. I just hope in the mean time there is such a glut in pellet making material that they will have to lower the prices just like BIG OIL..............

Interesting theory that it doesn't cost any more now to produce pellets than 10 years ago. Worker's wages have gone up, employer sponsored medical insurance has gone up (as much as 73-80% depending on a couple of sources I checked real quick), property taxes most likely have gone up. Repair and maintenance costs usually increase as the age of equipment increases. But yeah, pellets cost the same to make . Oh, and a good amount of the trees harvested now are used for making roads into remote areas for various projects; energy of all types primarily, so even scrub trees that might have made it to a pellet mill ain't going there.

Not saying there isn't some greed out there (I honestly don't know - and am sure there is at least in some places). Not saying pellets aren't overpriced - I honestly don't know about that either. Just saying that if you think they can make pellets today, for the same amount as what they made them for 10 years ago, you need a bit of reality check.

 

[billb3]

With power plants like this one (albeit smaller ) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drax_power_station across Europe burning up biomass from continental America as fast as we can cut the trees down and build port facilities to handle the millions of tons of pellets and raw chip and sawdust materials they are ramping up their use of, I really wouldn't bank on pellet costs retreating in my lifetime.

 

[Funnydirt14]

Interesting theory that it doesn't cost any more now to produce pellets than 10 years ago. Worker's wages have gone up, employer sponsored medical insurance has gone up (as much as 73-80% depending on a couple of sources I checked real quick), property taxes most likely have gone up. Repair and maintenance costs usually increase as the age of equipment increases. But yeah, pellets cost the same to make . Oh, and a good amount of the trees harvested now are used for making roads into remote areas for various projects; energy of all types primarily, so even scrub trees that might have made it to a pellet mill ain't going there.

Not saying there isn't some greed out there (I honestly don't know - and am sure there is at least in some places). Not saying pellets aren't overpriced - I honestly don't know about that either. Just saying that if you think they can make pellets today, for the same amount as what they made them for 10 years ago, you need a bit of reality check.

I work at a stamping company that competes against companies in the U.S., China, India, Mexico, Indonesia and other low cost producers. Our customers come back to us for there products mainly for two reasons. One: We are the cheapest. Two: We have great quality. I don't dispute SOME of your facts, but not all of them. We have been able to maintain our price point because of improvements in Quality, Manufacturing procedures and Maintenance practices. Therefore our cost to produce has stayed the same or even lowered in some cases. These improvements in efficiency have kept our business super competitive against our competition, even when costs of insurance and raw materials have gone up. So to say I need a reality check. Please. I know better.............

 

[scajjr2]

Heared an ad for Aubuchon Hardware stores on a Boston sports radio station today advertising they had lots of pellets for sale (mentioned Green Supreme, Infernos, Currans and a couple others). Been listening to this station for years, first time I heard Aubuchon's advertising pellets. They even mentioned they had stoves and parts, no brands mentioned.

Sam

 

[bogieb]

I work at a stamping company that competes against companies in the U.S., China, India, Mexico, Indonesia and other low cost producers. Our customers come back to us for there products mainly for two reasons. One: We are the cheapest. Two: We have great quality. I don't dispute SOME of your facts, but not all of them. We have been able to maintain our price point because of improvements in Quality, Manufacturing procedures and Maintenance practices. Therefore our cost to produce has stayed the same or even lowered in some cases. These improvements in efficiency have kept our business super competitive against our competition, even when costs of insurance and raw materials have gone up. So to say I need a reality check. Please. I know better.............

Apples and oranges.

Pellet suppliers aren't competing against low cost, out of country suppliers of pellets, so have not had to figure other ways to save money, improve efficiencies etc. - and until this year, there has been no incentive to find those ways. So, their costs most likely have gone up. IF the trend continues that oil stays low, temps stay mild and people don't buy pellets, then many will probably go thru that exercise. And dollars to donuts, many of them won't make it or will go to where they can make money the least painful manner possible by changing dies (or whatever) and supplying other countries.

 

[Marina1327]

I noticed the tractor supply co. In Pittsfield ma has an immense stockpile of them too! I think there's going to be one heck of a sale this spring.

I hope so. I just checked the lowes by me. They have 3152 bags of pellets. Home depot has 67 tons in stock

 

[Peterfield]

A lot of newbies in the pellet selling business this year, locations where I never saw pellets being sold before. This simply tells you that folks are trying to cash in on the popularity of pellets, they just picked a bad year to do it. Just like any other commodity, if the market isn't there, the price has to drop or you're out of business. Happened with cigars. Got popular with the young set, $1.00 cigars became $4.00 cigars, and it wasn't because of a rise in maintenance costs, insurance, wages or otherwise, just pure entrepreneurship, and there isn't anything inherently wrong with that. Many cigar vendors went out of business when regular cigar smokers refuse to pay boutique prices for so-so cigars. Then came the fire sales on all these "premium" brands. It will get cold and ordinarily that would spell a buying frenzy for pellets but it's different this year, oil prices are are at 6-7 year lows and propane is selling for less that bottled water in many parts of the country. Should be interesting as we move into January.

 

[Funnydirt14]

Apples and oranges.

Pellet suppliers aren't competing against low cost, out of country suppliers of pellets, so have not had to figure other ways to save money, improve efficiencies etc. - and until this year, there has been no incentive to find those ways. So, their costs most likely have gone up. IF the trend continues that oil stays low, temps stay mild and people don't buy pellets, then many will probably go thru that exercise. And dollars to donuts, many of them won't make it or will go to where they can make money the least painful manner possible by changing dies (or whatever) and supplying other countries.

HaHa.........That's surprising that anyone living in the New England states feels as though they are not getting gouged by the pellet companies. I guess it's like the old frog in pot of slowly boiling water. You don't know it till it's too late.

 

[Peterfield]

Lowe's jacking up Green Supreme's to $299 a ton this year is all you need to know about gouging up here this year.

 

[bogieb]

HaHa.........That's surprising that anyone living in the New England states feels as though they are not getting gouged by the pellet companies. I guess it's like the old frog in pot of slowly boiling water. You don't know it till it's too late.

I got Presto's in the early fall from Lowes and delivery was $19. Total cost was less than the Currans and NEWPs (both worse pellets IMO) I had bought the previous 2 years - and those were without delivery. I am currently getting FSU's to supplement my stash for less than $5/bag at HD, which is the same as I paid last year.

Never saw the prices of pellets at the lows some people talk about, so I'm not having an issue. And pellets are so much less costly than running my propane boiler for heating only 3/5 of what the pellets heat in my house (yes, it is my particular circumstance - I'm not saying that is true for anyone else). However, still doesn't negate my original premise that there is an argument against the perception that they aren't spending more money to make pellets now than they were 10 years ago.

Ah well, you have your opinion based on your industry and I have my doubts in some areas, knowledge in a few other areas, and pure guesses in still more, so the reality is only truly known by the players, who certainly wouldn't give us the whole story regardless of what it is