Talk me into it or talk me out of it.... Ongoing dilemna

[lowroadacres]

As I have written about many times over in a few threads we are wood heat users on a tight budget.

Right now we use a small drolet wood stove in the basement and an open fireplace on the main level.

Through discussion with a local retailer we have come across a nearly new Kingsman Ambassador fireplace insert.

Before you ask, no it is not an EPA unit but an older style "smoke dragon"..... But, it may be very inexpensive and it will be worlds better for heating than the existing fireplace which is beautiful but gobbles wood faster than a fitness model after a photo shoot.

We would do the install our selves and then be into heating our entire house with wood for far less money than purchasing a new insert.

Talk me into this or talk me out of it.....

pictures to come.

 

[ansehnlich1]

Sounds like a good deal to me as long as you do the install properly and to code. The other thing that I would consider is how easy is it to brush the chimney this 'smoke dragon' will be installed in? If it's easy access to the roof and the liner I'd go for it in your situation for sure.

 

[SKIN052]

I find it hard to talk you into a non EPA fireplace but if you are confident that it is your one and only option and it will not cost much to do then go for. If it is indeed going to cost you a couple hundred to install then save up and get something EPA. Just be safe foremost.

 

[SteveKG]

I honestly don't know what a "drolet" stove is. I certainly have not heard of every type of stove, so maybe I'm about to learn something. Happens all the time. So I can't answer or comment yet.

 

[ddug]

I'm not familiar with the drolet stove either but if it's safe and the deal is right I say go for it. We can't all drive Cadillac's (or in this case maybe I should say Prius) but that doesn't mean you have to walk.

Heat is important and any (safe) heat is better than none. Keep your eyes open and a better stove will likely fall into your lap down the road.

 

[BrotherBart]

Only if that chimney is gonna have a attached liner from the insert to the sky. Which is probably required there anyway.

 

[savageactor7]

meh...my advice is to pass.

 

[agartner]

Lots of folks here still burn non EPA "smoke dragons". Include me in that bucket as well, as there is nary an EPA certification on my old second-hand Kent that I bought second-hand for all of $200. Install it right and burn it right and you'll be lightyears ahead of that open fireplace.

 

[ansehnlich1]

Only if that chimney is gonna have a attached liner from the insert to the sky. Which is probably required there anyway.

Yeah, I'm gonna have to agree with BB on this too, doin' a 'SLAM' job ain't gonna cut it......gotta have that chimney lined from stove to top for sure.

 

[ckarotka]

Only if that chimney is gonna have a attached liner from the insert to the sky. Which is probably required there anyway.

Yeah, I'm gonna have to agree with BB on this too, doin' a 'SLAM' job ain't gonna cut it......gotta have that chimney lined from stove to top for sure.

+1 I had a slammer install for two years. The stove never performed right. Smoke in the house, poor draft, burnt like poo. Old stove with a liner will be better than none.

 

[Shari]

If I were you I would check with your local code enforcement office and your homeowners insurance company to see what they say before purchase. Around here it wouldn't be allowed.

Shari

 

[Backwoods Savage]

If you can put in the liner and all is safe go ahead. On the other hand, I hear oil and propane is selling really cheap now....

 

[lowroadacres]

Good feedback everyone. I was able to get the manual from Kingsman in spite of the fact that they have been sold and they only make gas and propane fireplaces/stoves now.

@ Everyone who says a liner from top to bottom..... ABSOLUTELY! As I child I still recall seeing a home in our community with only a concrete block chimney standing in the middle of a pile of ash. The issue was a poorly cleaned and badly installed slammer style installation.

We would be putting in a properly sealed block off plate. We would be using a duravent rigid insulated liner. There would be appropriate flashing and hardware at the exit of the chimney.

We are not rushing into this decision and to be honest dollars may even rule out this installation right now. One factor for us is the reality that we have access to nearly unlimited wood and we have lots of manpower in our family with my wife and I, our four children and the FIL and MIL who live on our acreage with us love to cut firewood.

Our WETT technician installer has already cleared this unit for us to purchase if we choose. Our new insurance company is very pleased with our WETT installer's expertise..... Which as you can read in my earlier posts is a huge relief. We are waiting to see the details about it as one of our biggest concerns and challenges is making sure that we still have a large viewing area to see the fire. Long story short, because some of you have been patient with me as I have told the story before, we have a large beautiful fireplace in a log home and we do not want to settle for a small view of the fire.

In many ways we might be better off waiting for a better unit to come along and in the mean time we should be trying to install a larger appliance in the basement. There is a good used Osburn 2400 in our local paper this week for a reasonable price that could be made to fit in our install in the basement.

The challenge there would be moving enough of the air into the rest of the house.

Our current stove is the Drolet Jasper. http://www.drolet.ca/product.aspx?CategoId=1&Id=265

It was very cheap on a clearance from Canadian Tire and to be honest I purchased it prior to knowing much about EPA and its benefits.

Our motto on situations like these is to aim at the ideal and to live in the real.

Right now we know that even with a small stove we are lowering our electricity costs substantially.

 

[SKIN052]

All in all, sounds like you are really thnking this through, good on you. keep us posted and stay warm.

 

[Jags]

Big jump from an open fireplace to an insert - even a smoke dragon. Bigger jump when the insert is EPA cert. Just stating the obvious. The smoke dragon could always be installed and then replaced at a later date with a better stove. You may even recoup some of the costs of the dragon if you choose to resell it.

 

[Stump_Branch]

seeing how over here money is streached thinner then that fitness model you spoke of, the one thing I considered was the amount of wood usage. While it may be cheaper upfront, you will have to spend more time, money, effort to keep that "smoke dragon" fed. it like saying I can buy an old truck for cheap, but I will burn twice as much fuel. at some point the newer more fuel efficent truck will always win out. I get my wood for free, myabe you do as well, but I still have to spend money to fuel the saw, replace chains, buy bottles of asprin etc. for my back, you get the point. The insert is a fixed cost, the wood you burn or should I say the amount of wood is varible. Try a lower cost insert, that was the only option for me as I needed to tax offset as well.

Either way it is a step up from a fireplace, just how much.

and I agree with the liner, its a must.

 

[lowroadacres]

One of the big factors for me will be the sizing of the liner. If I am correct the outlet on the insert may well be 8 inches.

This means that I am severely limited in the future as to which wood inserts I might uprgrade to in the future if we go with the proper liner.

I am still waiting on the details and photos from the vendor.

 

[Renovation]

gobbles wood faster than a fitness model after a photo shoot.

That's how they stay so slim?!

Sorry, as you were.