You can argue with their choices all you would like. If consumers exchange their labor for those goods, they perceive value.
Taxing and tariffs
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He said nothing about value. He is talking about dangerous even poisonous products being sold here. And i am sure there are many more we never find out about.
Everyone knows Chinese (especially food) products can be sketchy. They still buy them. That means they perceive value in their risk/reward thought process...however skewed that might be.
Ok so there is a perceived value. That doesnt mean anything at all. And no not everyone knows the products are sketchy. They should but may just see the price.
And again he said nothing about value either real or perceived. He simply said that those products arent helping americans. Your argument of perceived value proves that. People are paying for perceived value but getting no real value. Therefore not being helped.
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Seasoned Oak
Minister of Fire
There no way dangerous food products should ever make it into the country. People dont carry testing kits to the supermarket nor should they need to. Thats a job for our own Food inspectors to make sure all the food made available for sale is safe, even domestic sourced food. Imported food especially anything from china should be tested rigorously and a big % of it as well. The cost of testing added to the import. Its the least our own Govt can do. And something the general population can not do for itself.
I agree with you with maybe a twist.
We should demand that companies place very clear product of origin labeling on their products. In many cases, this has been done. This way the consumer can make their own decision on what to buy.
I think the best push for safe goods comes from the consumer directly to the manufacturer/distributor, when it comes to goods from other countries.
There are TONS of canned goods coming from China. It is really gross and I'll have no part of eating that sh**.
as an example, a market I shop at has 5 very good looking garlic cloves in a mesh sleeve for $1.00. noticing the label has a "produce of China", I thought what the hell, garlic is garlic. later tripped upon an article stating the over use of chemicals and pesticides in certain Chinese grown veggies. decided from that point veggies are different from different areas. close to their farm raised shrimp and scallops. same with India, Vietnam, ect. won't go near them any more.
Seasoned Oak
Minister of Fire
They fight this tooth and nail cuz when people have a clear choice they dont want china or GMO anywhere near their food supply and rightfully so.
Not disagreeing, just trying to get my head around the aims of current policy. The consequences and blowback may be entirely different as you have noted. In the big picture it appears to be an existential conflict with China for global dominance. Your thoughts?
isn't that the age old cold war situation, "we will bury you!" wait , what if I don't want to be buried?https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...5766F7403189AA519E615766F7403189&&FORM=VRDGAR
in trade the only thing you can do is put up every barrier you can come up with, if you agree this aint fair .
got to admit I think this is the first time China has had a challenge that they fear, if they don't retaliate, they admit we can live not having you as a customer.I also think that their downplay is the US is just a minor annoyance.
do you trade with a retailer that doesn't give a flying #$%^ about you as a customer?
just some thoughts.
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Seasoned Oak
Minister of Fire
China is already out of ammo, if they want a trade war,they just dont buy from us near what they sell to us. Their economy is taking a hit already. Its in their own best interest to play fair but they have been playing us for so long it may be hard for them to change. Plus the whole macho thing where they dont want to appear weak. If we can get good trade agreements with all the major players we can get that GDP up even more and even more people working. At least until the debt bomb burys us.
AlbergSteve
Minister of Fire
AlbergSteve
Minister of Fire
the short list.
https://www.thebalance.com/trade-deficit-by-county-3306264
let's add this simple answer to , "what does it mean"?
https://www.thebalance.com/u-s-trade-deficit-causes-effects-trade-partners-3306276
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Sure. China is no doubt a very powerful nation. They are slowly stepping away from pure communism and entertaining this blend of capitalism and communism. It is an interesting thing, no doubt.
I don't see them as a violent threat to our nation..from a national security point of view. They are far away. They don't provoke us. We don't provoke them....it seems to be working and peace is a good thing.
There is no doubt they steal market share from us, but only what we allow them to take by moving factories and such. One of the biggest things driving their markets is their own markets. They are getting so big that (just like the US) they need to manufacture their own goods for themselves. That doesn't hurt our markets or impact us.
I worry much more about the states in the US that that don't work to keep businesses going, thriving and moving in. I don't mean incentives, I just mean less red tape.
So what are the actual reasons behind escalating a trade war with China? It doesn't seem like this will help us in the long run.
per Doug's linked article:
"An ongoing trade deficit is detrimental to the nation’s economy because it is financed with debt. The United States can buy more than it makes because it borrows from its trading partners. It's like a party where the pizza place is willing to keep sending you pizzas and putting it on your tab. This can only continue as long as the pizzeria trusts you to repay the loan. One day, the lending countries could decide to ask America to repay the debt. On that day, the party is over."
The potential for harm seems much greater than perceived benefits. The tariff policies also open the door for corruption and crony capitalism.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/trumps-political-tariff-bureaucracy-1533597856
per Doug's linked article:
"An ongoing trade deficit is detrimental to the nation’s economy because it is financed with debt. The United States can buy more than it makes because it borrows from its trading partners. It's like a party where the pizza place is willing to keep sending you pizzas and putting it on your tab. This can only continue as long as the pizzeria trusts you to repay the loan. One day, the lending countries could decide to ask America to repay the debt. On that day, the party is over."
The potential for harm seems much greater than perceived benefits. The tariff policies also open the door for corruption and crony capitalism.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/trumps-political-tariff-bureaucracy-1533597856
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Yup its true. National debt is a big deal. It is the same as over leveraging your household income with credit cards. Right now we are just making the interest payments.
The interesting being about 5% of total fed spending.
I find that quote a little confusing. Trade deficit just means imports are greater than exports. How a country leverages that is another story. A deficit by itself, does not mean borrowed money, in this case.
Here is a quite good definition that I found beneficial reading. https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/trade_deficit.asp
The interesting being about 5% of total fed spending.
I find that quote a little confusing. Trade deficit just means imports are greater than exports. How a country leverages that is another story. A deficit by itself, does not mean borrowed money, in this case.
Here is a quite good definition that I found beneficial reading. https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/trade_deficit.asp
Maybe I just don't understand. one country already owns a huge currency advantage over another and pays a very small duty on their good entering that country seems to have a pretty good advantage. then protect it's own industry with duty at 12.5 time higher on products from that trading partner making it fall in the unfair column. we've seen movement to fairer trade with Mexico and Europe, but #1 China looks to be a tougher nut to crack .
sounds very simple and with a great deal of common sense where I sit. If china refuses to compromise or adjust is where the real problems will begin.
CaptSpiff
Minister of Fire
"...... One day, the lending countries could decide to ask America to repay the debt. On that day, the party is over."
I'm not certain the debt is callable. They can however stop buying our debt, in which case we offer higher interest until the buyers come out.
I'm not certain the debt is callable. They can however stop buying our debt, in which case we offer higher interest until the buyers come out.
Recently had a machine situation arise in my factory. A 1980's era Comelz thermo folder, which are Italian made, broke down. While parts are available, service is non existent.Failure being beyond our capabilities a new folder became our best option . New Comelz's go at $2000-3500, comps from China go at $1000-2000. Just got notification from Homeland Security's entry summary. $ 0.00 duty, $0.00 tax, line 39 other $ 2.05 based on a $1285.00 value. While I'm sure not very many of these enter the USA annually, the domestic suppliers of rebuilt or new folders cannot compete here.
Wonder how many other product cruise under the radar with $0.00 duty and or tax?
Just for reference here is the exact job we use this for,
one point here , a real good operator would be chaining the insoles continuously!
Wonder how many other product cruise under the radar with $0.00 duty and or tax?
Just for reference here is the exact job we use this for,
one point here , a real good operator would be chaining the insoles continuously!
Are you sure you would have paid taxes on the machine sold stateside?
Many of my customers do not have taxes added since they are MRO customers.
not the point. I had expected at least some duty on it's entry. as we are a regular US Corp. We have never paid tax on machinery whether domestic or imported as they previously been purchased through the maker or a supply reseller. .this was purchased direct with a Chinese comp. as I ask, I wonder how many other products come here duty free.
as I'm writing this I was just informed that Trump has made shoe and apparel machinery exempt. that is so because there are no manufacturers left producing said machinery. that is pretty sad as this is a 2.4 billion pair market??? largest manufacturers left are those producing military footwear.
CaptSpiff
Minister of Fire
Remarkable how surgically these tariffs can be applied by an administration in such alleged chaos.
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