the value of wood heat?

[beermann]

I've been doing my research but I'm wanting to get some additional thoughts from you guys regarding the value of wood heating.

As some of you know. I recently got a wood insert (regency i1200) to heat 1200-1300sq foot one level house. I have a half finished open concept basement about the same size. I have recently started making a lot of trips to get quality maple hardwood for this coming winter and my spouse who is supportive and a great person said that I may be putting too much value and time into what we are going to actually get/save from wood heating vs central air gas heating.

Now all winter we kept the house cold (62f - 16 cel) and its -15 to -30celcius outside with windchill. The chill seems to really hit the inside of the house on windy days....anyway normally I don't really care as I just budle up but having my 4-6yr old kids say they are cold and not being able to afford higher temps in the house has me obsessing a little over the whole wood heat thing. So having more heat is already a win for me.

As far as value goes, my understanding is that I can save between $2-$3/day on the low end by keeping household thermostat temps low (60-62ferinheit/15-16celcius) and run the stove when we get home during the day so it's 10degrees ferinheit warmer inside during the day time (that's about 5 degress celcius warmer). Since I work nights I can load it with maple and be good for 3-5hrs when I get home. By loading it again before and after bed the central gas won't turn on all day. And I can load it before going to nightshift which would keep things nice and warm until 2-3am.....

I thought I was being conservative in my numbers but she thinks I'm not going to get what I think I'll get ($40-$80saved per month) the central kicks on every 15-20minutes on cold days. About every 30min on 0 to -5 Celsius days.

Am I putting too much value in thinking ill save $40/month by burning all day and potentially $80/month if I can manage to burn most nights as well?

All my wood is free and it's maple right now. About 4-5 facecords and growing.
I might be able to get a lot of willow but I read it burns like crap and needs tending every hour.

 

[twd000]

Well you've already bought the stove and cut the wood, so the only meaningful thing left to do is track your ACTUAL energy costs. Before I bought my stove, I tracked my energy costs on a spreadsheet. I know every date my propane tank was filled, and how many gallons it took, for the past two years. I estimate I will save $1500 a year at current propane prices, if the stove can handle 80% of my home heating demand.

 

[Easy Livin’ 3000]

I've been doing my research but I'm wanting to get some additional thoughts from you guys regarding the value of wood heating.

As some of you know. I recently got a wood insert (regency i1200) to heat 1200-1300sq foot one level house. I have a half finished open concept basement about the same size. I have recently started making a lot of trips to get quality maple hardwood for this coming winter and my spouse who is supportive and a great person said that I may be putting too much value and time into what we are going to actually get/save from wood heating vs central air gas heating.

Now all winter we kept the house cold (62f - 16 cel) and its -15 to -30celcius outside with windchill. The chill seems to really hit the inside of the house on windy days....anyway normally I don't really care as I just budle up but having my 4-6yr old kids say they are cold and not being able to afford higher temps in the house has me obsessing a little over the whole wood heat thing. So having more heat is already a win for me.

As far as value goes, my understanding is that I can save between $2-$3/day on the low end by keeping household thermostat temps low (60-62ferinheit/15-16celcius) and run the stove when we get home during the day so it's 10degrees ferinheit warmer inside during the day time (that's about 5 degress celcius warmer). Since I work nights I can load it with maple and be good for 3-5hrs when I get home. By loading it again before and after bed the central gas won't turn on all day. And I can load it before going to nightshift which would keep things nice and warm until 2-3am.....

I thought I was being conservative in my numbers but she thinks I'm not going to get what I think I'll get ($40-$80saved per month) the central kicks on every 15-20minutes on cold days. About every 30min on 0 to -5 Celsius days.

Am I putting too much value in thinking ill save $40/month by burning all day and potentially $80/month if I can manage to burn most nights as well?

All my wood is free and it's maple right now. About 4-5 facecords and growing.
I might be able to get a lot of willow but I read it burns like crap and needs tending every hour.

If you like doing it, it's totally worth it. If you hate doing it, it's not. My attempts to quantify how much money I'm saving, with time studies, etc. made it seem way too much like work.

Your wife intelligently recognizes that it's a time and labor intensive endeavor, particularly now with the EPA stoves. Some would even describe it as a lifestyle. The Mrs. also recognizes that the time and energy you spend doing it will replace whatever you were doing before, and she might not like that.

You may want to come up with a real simple analysis to show her how much you are saving using whatever assumptions you like and can defend, to keep her on board. This is assuming that you are enjoying it. Otherwise, you will just have a top rate fireplace for ambiance and some suplimental heat. Not a bad situation, but different than heating with wood and using the central heat as the suppliment.

 

[EatenByLimestone]

Free wood is great, as long as you don't have to go fat to get it. I also like willow. Per pound, it has the same amount of energy as maple. It is less dense, so that split that weighs 4lbs of maple will weigh 2lbs. That said, if you're sticking around the house you can reload often without worrying. It may allow you to save some maple for the coldest nights.

While you are collecting wood, I'd look at air sealing and insulation. Air sealing is cheap and makes a huge difference on how much energy it takes to keep a house warm. You worked hard to get the house warm, why let it outside?

 

[jatoxico]

Except for those folks burning multiple (>3-4 cords) a year getting ahead on wood is the most difficult part. Once you're ahead the amount of work to maintain 2 cords isn't that bad. Personally I would buy if time became an issue.

The temperature you'll be able to keep the house and the ability to have at least part of your house truly warm and comfortable can't only be calculated in simple dollars and cents. You'll save money but even if it isn't as much as you estimate (and it might) I bet she becomes a believer.

 

[Shmudda]

To me, its not so much the money saved, it's the comfort and feel of a warm house on a cold winters night or a damp cold spring day. I built a new home in the fall of 1996 and didn't get the burner going until February 1997, and have been burning every year since. I did get a few gas bills before the burner was installed and they were in the area of $180/month or so, I am now down to between $85 -$100/month at most. So for me, I am saving $$$, but the real deal is the cold winter nights and a warm home Any other heat, whether it's propane, oil, electric, or geothermal just cannot give you the warm dry heat of wood, plain and simple!

Craig

 

[Blazing]

I save about $130 dollars a month burning 24/7 all winter. That being said going from having just a heat pump to a wood stove I'd find the money to keep burning wood if it cost me an extra $130 a month. I can't stand being cold and hearing the cold air blowing heat pump makes my skin crawl. I guess it's to each their own and yes you have to take money into consideration but my wife wouldn't have it any other way. YMMV

 

[Rangerbait]

There are a lot on non-tangible and difficult to quantify benefits of wood heat as well. Where I grew up, we were very prone to power outages when big storms hit, and were it not for our wood stove, we would have been completely without heat for sometimes up to a week.

If times got really tough and you were forced to cut out your gas entirely, you'd at least have some heat source to fall back on. There's just something soothing to a man's soul in knowing that he'll be able to provide for his family independent of some external service.

And then there's just the good ol' caveman itch that gets scratched by dragging trees out of the woods to make fire in your cave. Arrh arrh arrh arrh!

 

[jetsam]

I might be an extreme example, but there's a few of us here that are in the same boat. Long Island is (for some reason) mired in 1950s heating technology, and the most common way to heat a house is hydronic baseboards heated by something your grandparents may have heard of- a fuel oil burner. (They still sell these in 2017.)

Fuel oil is a few bucks a gallon right now, but it was $8 a gallon a few years ago. Even at $3, it's unreasonably expensive compared to natural gas in the midwest.

Since I get "free" wood, I imagine my stove paid itself off in about a year and a half, and I keep the house about 15 degrees warmer than I used to- and that has been popular with the wife.

 

[Blazing]

There are a lot on non-tangible and difficult to quantify benefits of wood heat as well. Where I grew up, we were very prone to power outages when big storms hit, and were it not for our wood stove, we would have been completely without heat for sometimes up to a week.

If times got really tough and you were forced to cut out your gas entirely, you'd at least have some heat source to fall back on. There's just something soothing to a man's soul in knowing that he'll be able to provide for his family independent of some external service.

And then there's just the good ol' caveman itch that gets scratched by dragging trees out of the woods to make fire in your cave. Arrh arrh arrh arrh!

Well said sir!

 

[ddddddden]

Here's the wood Btu vs. gas Therm cost comparison.

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/price-of-natural-gas-vs-wood.98898/

You get your wood for "free," but only you(& the Mrs.) can place a value on your time. Other than wood scrounging, you could cut the time you spend tending the stove by getting a bigger stove. I know the i1200 was a good score, and it fits your existing fireplace, but it's a bit small for your burning ambition. You could easily double your 3-5 hour burn time with a larger stove.

 

[jotul8e2]

There is a definitive answer, and it is "It depends".

Value of the heat? Here is southern Missouri in a well insulated house, it is not that high. Our high efficiency heat pumps run through the heating season cost about $600. That is $600 for the season, not per month. Of course there is also the chainsaw, the trailer, the truck, the chaps, and (new this year) a powered splitter. So the payback on all this is... rather a long time.

No, I will never, ever come out ahead on dollars. But I note the OP is in Canada, other posters are in New Hampshire, upstate New York, and other colder locations where heating costs are far higher. Not everyone had the luxury of building their own house and specifying the insulation. And many are buying oil. The calculations then become quite different.

It is also true, however, that many must purchase their firewood. This again must be factored. I live on 70 acres, almost entirely in oak and hickory. And as some have noted, there is no such thing as "free" firewood. The time involved is not trivial, even for the two to three cords I burn a year.

So that leaves the question of the value of time. What is the value of time spent in front of the tv? Or adding new posts to the wood burning forum? I am in that sweet spot where it is enjoyable to go out and spend two or three hours in the woods a few days a year. This time has a market value of approximately $0.00. If I had to do, say, eight or 10 cords it would become work and again the calculations would be different.

Finally, there is the value of the end product. We happen to be fine with an ambient temperature of 68 deg. f. But it is so nice to have a place in the house that is warmer. To me that is the greatest value, So while my time may be worthless, the experience of sitting by the fire is beyond price.

 

[VirginiaIron]

We like the idea that the casa could be heated during power failures or an economic collapse. Truly, this new stove has been easy to heat our space. So it is worth it to us.

 

[VirginiaIron]

The dead standing or storm damaged trees will deteriorate and may become hazardous in the future- so we burn them- we feel it is a win-win situation. However, when we entertain or we are tired or sick it's nice to flip a switch and enjoy the benefits of technology.

 

[Sodbuster]

A few things come to mind when thinking about savings and heating with wood. The type of fuel your central heating system uses, natural gas, propane, or fuel oil. Obviously with propane or fuel oil, your savings will be greater and will vary every year as the price fluctuates. We had our PE summit installed one year after we moved into our house, our first year here we paid $3500 for propane and that was for heat and hot water and a cook top. The next year with the stove going 24/7 we paid a total of $916 for propane so about a 1-1/2 year payoff on the stove. I'm retired so my time is basically free. If you are working and make a good living, your time might be better spent putting in an extra shift, paying for the fuel. Last summer natural gas was run down our road and we hooked up, I can't tell you the happiness I experienced watching the propane tank loaded on a truck and heading down the driveway!! Now, burning 24/7 my natural gas bill is $35 a month. When it comes down to it, like ED 3000 said burning wood for heat is a lifestyle, I am the only one in our family that heats with wood, no one else even has the desire to do so, and that's fine, I like the fact that no matter what happens, I can keep my family warm, I can cook on it if I have to, it's a comforting feeling to have. I live in Michigan, and recently we had sustained high winds for a day; the local electrical utility,DTE said that about 800,000 people lost power. Many of my wife's friends went 4-5 days without power, hotels were full and they were cold, and had no where to go. One last thing that I haven't seen mentioned as an advantage of heating with wood, is that it gets you outside, and gives you great exercise.

PS - no offense to those that burn it, but I tried Willow, and found it wasn't worth the fuel to cut it and split it. YMMV

 

[weatherguy]

If you had a larger stove that burned 24/7 it would be easy to figure out, in your case it's a little harder but in time you can compare to what you used to spend on gas. Right now Gas is cheaper than oil. In my case I burn 600-700 less gallons of oil per year plus were always warm when in the past the house felt cold all winter.

 

[VirginiaIron]

[QUOTE="...One last thing that I haven't seen mentioned as an advantage of heating with wood, is that it gets you outside, and gives you great exercise.... QUOTE]... [like]....!
But, unless we are running around like the three stooges there might not be any cardio to benefit our hearts.

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[Sodbuster]

[QUOTE="...One last thing that I haven't seen mentioned as an advantage of heating with wood, is that it gets you outside, and gives you great exercise.... QUOTE]... [like]....!
But, unless we are running around like the three stooges there might not be any cardio to benefit our hearts.

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Great upper body though, especially when carrying those 24" rounds to the the splitter!!

 

[VirginiaIron]

I find the new heat so valuable I'm thinking about a bigger wood supply. I carried 30 inch pine rounds with no problems, recently, but some of the smaller oak, lol, was taking its toll. I'm now building a lift for the splitter.

 

[VirginiaIron]

It has recently been a joy to heat with wood. We are using more wood. This splitter is about 30 years old so I am adding a lift and a ground-zero horizontal splitter to tackle the huge rounds when we get them.

 

[drstorm]

I like standing by the stove,I like the gathering(even if it's just the ecobricks at the TSC store)and I like being somewhat insulated from energy price spikes.
We can also stay warm in a power outage,and If times got real tough I know I can scrounge the area for wood or factories for pallets.It's even fun picking out differnt pieces of seasoned wood to burn on colder days,I can't do that with propane or oil.
I have the temperature at 75 degrees in my living room standing near the stove while watching the NCAA tourney and drinking a cold beer.I know I would not be as happy standing under the forced hot air vent doing the same things.

 

[drstorm]

I guess I'm trying to say,if you like any of the above mentioned,then the cost-benefit ratio really doesn't matter.That's just a bonus.

 

[Lloyd the redneck]

So now that we are coming into spring ( thank the lord!) I have saved 250 gal of fuel oil. And 400 of propane so far. Last week I decided I was tired of Css. But after taking a 3 wheeler ride around the estate I decided to drop about 20 trees to let my evergreens thrive. I will be switching to a waste oil boiler for the next heating season but I'm keeping my insert. It's noisy and ugly but I like it. Plus why waste the wood! And like many others have said. Before wood we were cold. Set to about 62 with blankets and the dogs to keep us warm. Now with wood it's warm the pups love it and I can run around in shorts and a t. Not to mention before wood my shop was a balmy 45. Now it's a shade under 70. Makes working so much more enjoyable. And the shop cat loves it warm. Ha.

 

[jetsam]

My dogs like to go to that one spot in the house where it's about 150° and just lie there and bake.

As for me, it's also nice to have something that makes the coldest days fun, and a roaring fire does that for me.

Wood heat isn't that much fun most of the year, but it sure saves me a ton of money. I look at it like a combination part time job and gym membership that I actually use.

 

[Lloyd the redneck]

Jet , my lab/rottie is getting older now and lays right next to it and I swear burns. My German Shepard can't even be in the room literally. She sleeps by the door. Both dogs play outside with the horses every day you would think they would both like the heat