Time for a new chimney crown.

[Woody Stover]

I'll be starting on this project in the next couple of days, and I've got a couple questions. The crown already has several cracks; Do you think I'll be able to pound up on the segments from the bottom of the overhang and dislodge them without breaking too many bricks loose, so I can minimize the number of bricks I'll need to re-mortar? Could I grind some more grooves with an angle grinder to break the big chunks of crown smaller, again pounding up from the bottom?
What should I use for the concrete of the crown? Would this stuff be good? http://www.homedepot.com/p/Quikrete-80-lb-Crack-Resistant-Concrete-100680/100318448

What am I likely to find under the crown, some type of filler that the new crown can be poured onto? If not, can I improvise my own filler? My thinking is, there will be a lot of weight from the wet concrete on the filler so it would have to be tight into the opening to resist the weight. At the same time, if it is too tight, will it break brick mortar joints loose? Or would it be better to go over the top of the opening with some kind of semi-thick stainless sheet, that possibly wouldn't need to be supported underneath? Thanks in advance for any guidance you can give me!

 

[ccmac]

I would think that your crown will break up fairly easy despite being think. Use a good hammer and stone/brick chisel and eye protection of course. You can cut a line just below the crown to assist in separation from the brick below but honestly from the looks of things the brick just below needs redone anyway. There are many good youtube videos that will help you. Here are a few. The last link has a very very good series of vdeos that will show you how to do many things with your chimney and crown. You'll get more from these than anything I can tell you.

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[Woody Stover]

I would think that your crown will break up fairly easy despite being thick. Use a good hammer and stone/brick chisel and eye protection of course. You can cut a line just below the crown to assist in separation from the brick below but honestly from the looks of things the brick just below needs redone anyway. There are many good youtube videos that will help you. Here are a few.

Thanks for those links, ccmac! I haven't watched all three of his crown videos but I like the middle guy's approach to the making the crown form. For anyone wanting to see his vids, search youtube, Boss Masonry and Tile. I will look at the bottom guy's stuff as well.
I removed the crown today; You were right, it came off pretty easy using the cracks that were already in it. As you can see, they tried to get cute with the decorative granite pieces on the corners. They are weak points and develop cracks in their mortar. I'm thinking it would be best to get rid of the four granite pieces and to have the top four courses re-laid by a mason. As you can see, there are some bad bricks further down than four courses, but maybe @bholler or @webby3650 can give me advice on possibly just taking out the loose chunks of brick and patching the gap with concrete? You can see that the other sides are in better shape, just need some mortar joint repair. I have more granite further down, but I'll just have to re-do the joints as best I can. My main focus right now is getting the top re-laid and then put the crown on myself.



These sides aren't as bad...



By the time this top is re-laid, it doesn't look like there will be big gaps where there will be a lot of wet concrete to support. I don't know if, for the bond break, I will get a sheet of stainless, or as bholler sometimes does, "plastic." Not sure if he's talking about 6 mil plastic sheet, or something more substantial that will hold the weight of wet concrete?

 

[begreen]

I'd start off with a Crown Royal.

 

[bholler]

As you can see, there are some bad bricks further down than four courses, but maybe @bholler or @webby3650 can give me advice on possibly just taking out the loose chunks of brick and patching the gap with concrete?

Well that looks like a roofline up rebuild to me but you could pull out the bad brick and replace them. Just filling the missing sections with mortar does not work well.

 

[Woody Stover]

that looks like a roofline up rebuild to me

What's your guess at to what it might cost, just the four courses, and then for the 'roofline up?' But I'm certainly inclined to go the whole nine yard, like you say, and be done with it for a while (I could get rid of some of the stupid granite, too.) I guess I'd want to leave the flashing undisturbed. Besides being a pain to re-do it, I'm kinda proud of it...it's a cut above my usual level of hack work.
Anyway, the chimney brick structure measures about 22" x 40", to give you some idea of how much work it might be. I guess it's best to go with new brick (hard brick, I think you've said in the past, but I guess the mason will know.) I'm not really too worried if the color doesn't quite match but I want something that's gonna hold up. Also, is it best to go ahead and replace the clay liner tiles while you're at it?

 

[bholler]

I guess it's best to go with new brick (hard brick

your brick are already modern brick not old soft ones. For a roof line up rebuild and poured crown you would be looking at around $1500 here.

 

[Woody Stover]

your brick are already modern brick not old soft ones. For a roof line up rebuild and poured crown you would be looking at around $1500 here.

Thanks for the input.
So would you use some of the old brick if it's in good shape?
I guess I'll make the form and pour the crown myself...how much do you think that might reduce the cost?

 

[bholler]

So would you use some of the old brick if it's in good shape?

Not worth the time to clean them honestly. We only reuse old brick if we cant match them close with new brick. But in your situation where it will all be above the roof with no visible joing to the old chimney there is no reason to reuse them.

If you do the crown I would say it would go down to $1000 to $1200

 

[Woody Stover]

If you do the crown I would say it would go down to $1000 to $1200

Well, that's definitely worth my time to do the form and crown. I'm just not comfortable trying to practice and get up to speed on brick-laying, with the short time left of good weather. Especially if going roofline-up...seems you would have to able to move along quickly, no time to stop and try to figure things out.

 

[bholler]

Well, that's definitely worth my time to do the form and crown. I'm just not comfortable trying to practice and get up to speed on brick-laying, with the short time left of good weather. Especially if going roofline-up...seems you would have to able to move along quickly, no time to stop and try to figure things out.

That is all speculation from pics and in my area it may be very different in person or in your area. Honestly you may have trouble getting it done ths year. I am sure a chimney guy will not have time. You may find a mason willing to do it this late.

 

[Woody Stover]

That is all speculation from pics and in my area it may be very different in person or in your area. Honestly you may have trouble getting it done ths year. I am sure a chimney guy will not have time. You may find a mason willing to do it this late.

I know of one mason that I think will be pretty good. Mason may charge a bit more than a sweep would but prices are cheap here...your estimate will be close, I bet.
The lowest temp forecast for the next ten days here is 70/45. With the way it's going so far, wouldn't surprise me if it stays warm for a while yet...one-month temp forecast looks good. I gotta git 'er done, now that I've torn the crown off. Shoulda got rolling on this a couple weeks ago.

 

[bholler]

Mason may charge a bit more than a sweep would but prices

No if anything I have found the opposite to be true. That is here though. And this is a busy season for many contractors lots of people wanting to get stuff done before the weather changes getting someone good there anytime soon could be an issue.

 

[Woody Stover]

N getting someone good there anytime soon could be an issue.

Getting "someone good" has always been an issue for me. Usually end up trying it myself. I may not know what I'm doing but I'll at least take the time to research it, and take the time necessary to at least try to do it right. I think this is a family business, and from what I've seen, the guy stays busy.

 

[Woody Stover]

I've got the scaffold up and the crown off...hopefully, they will see it as a chance to get in, get their money, and get out with a minimum of time and hassle.

 

[Woody Stover]

Heck, I could put a tarp and a heater up there if it came to that. Or burn a hot fire.

 

[Woody Stover]

your brick are already modern brick not old soft ones. For a roof line up rebuild and poured crown you would be looking at around $1500 here.

The guy I talked to, a well-regarded brick company here, quoted me 3K for the roof-up rebuild, so I went ahead and tore off the top four courses last fall. I was running out of warm days so it ended up being somewhat of a rush/hack job. I know there are ways to do concrete in colder weather, but I was having trouble just working with regular concrete when doing the brick work. It was slow going, me being a first-timer.The crete would start getting stiff on me, but I did the best I could. I covered the work with some drop cloths and provided a little heat under there with a heat gun.
For the crown, my nephew helped me haul buckets of crete up the ladder. I was no doubt working the crete too much, but overall I'm pretty satisfied with the way it turned out. I built the crown form using the Boss Masonry link that @ccmac provided above. Thanks, bud!
I definitely want to put some type of coating on the crown this fall. I'll look at some of the other crown threads to refresh my memory on the products you guys have used.
I got back up there this week, cleaned up the brick and re-caulked the seams between the liner tiles and crown. I still need to run a bead of caulk between the top of the brick and the crown.

I'm going to work on the rest of the chimney this fall, sealing other mortar cracks and trying to deal with some cracked bricks, etc. The wider base of the chimney is still in pretty good shape, but you can see in the following pic that I've got problems where the mass of granite stones is, particularly on that one corner at the base of the smaller section.

I'd start off with a Crown Royal.

We live only 12 miles from KY, and are required by law to drink only 'Kentucky Straight Bourbon Whiskey.' Working on a Four Roses Single Barrel right now.

 

[BeerChemistWhiskey]

That looks pretty good to me, I would hope to do the same quality job being a fellow diy-er.

How many bags of concrete would you say you used for the crown?

We live only 12 miles from KY, and are required by law to drink only 'Kentucky Straight Bourbon Whiskey.' Working on a Four Roses Single Barrel right now.

I'm partial to Wild Turkey myself But Four Roses is a good second.

 

[Woody Stover]

How many bags of concrete would you say you used for the crown?

I'm thinking it was 4 bags. I didn't make the crown as thick as it originally was.

I'm partial to Wild Turkey myself But Four Roses is a good second.

A couple weeks back I got a Russell's Reserve 10-Year. After trying it, I'm thinking I might have instead gotten a Wild Turkey 101 to try. I'd think it would be comparable..not to mention it's 9 bucks cheaper.

 

[Easy Livin’ 3000]

The guy I talked to, a well-regarded brick company here, quoted me 3K for the roof-up rebuild, so I went ahead and tore off the top four courses last fall. I was running out of warm days so it ended up being somewhat of a rush/hack job. I know there are ways to do concrete in colder weather, but I was having trouble just working with regular concrete when doing the brick work. It was slow going, me being a first-timer.The crete would start getting stiff on me, but I did the best I could. I covered the work with some drop cloths and provided a little heat under there with a heat gun.
For the crown, my nephew helped me haul buckets of crete up the ladder. I was no doubt working the crete too much, but overall I'm pretty satisfied with the way it turned out. I built the crown form using the Boss Masonry link that @ccmac provided above. Thanks, bud!
I definitely want to put some type of coating on the crown this fall. I'll look at some of the other crown threads to refresh my memory on the products you guys have used.
I got back up there this week, cleaned up the brick and re-caulked the seams between the liner tiles and crown. I still need to run a bead of caulk between the top of the brick and the crown.
View attachment 199709 View attachment 199710
I'm going to work on the rest of the chimney this fall, sealing other mortar cracks and trying to deal with some cracked bricks, etc. The wider base of the chimney is still in pretty good shape, but you can see in the following pic that I've got problems where the mass of granite stones is, particularly on that one corner at the base of the smaller section.
View attachment 199711

That's real good work, Woody. You were like, $3 grand? I don't think so. Love it.

Did you buy the scaffolding for this project?

 

[Woody Stover]

Did you buy the scaffolding for this project?

Yeah, I bought the scaffold. I think it was like $800 or so. Figured by the time I get done with the rest of the chimney, rental costs would be getting high anyway. Not sure what else I may be able to use it for, but that gable end is pretty shot from the sun beating on it..that's ONE thing.
A friend and an in-law have both expressed interest in borrowing it, although they haven't done so yet. Maybe they will toss me a few bucks to soften the blow.

 

[kennyp2339]

Those new bricks you laid in there look nice, you did a lot better job than if I was doing it

 

[Woody Stover]

Those new bricks you laid in there look nice

You can see that a couple times I got distracted and didn't put the smooth sides of the bricks facing out..some numbers are visible.
I got some valuable tips in other threads from @bholler, @webby3650 and others. The tip I remembered most was bholler(?) saying "It doesn't have to be perfect." I'm just hoping that the mortar adhered to the bricks pretty well. Got a little dry on me a couple times, and I had to add a little more water.

 

[Easy Livin’ 3000]

Yeah, I bought the scaffold. I think it was like $800 or so. Figured by the time I get done with the rest of the chimney, rental costs would be getting high anyway. Not sure what else I may be able to use it for, but that gable end is pretty shot from the sun beating on it..that's ONE thing.
A friend and an in-law have both expressed interest in borrowing it, although they haven't done so yet. Maybe they will toss me a few bucks to soften the blow.

I should have bought scaffolding for my install instead of renting a lift ($400 and nothing to show for it, but two 10" deep ruts in the lawn, well, and we got the liner in and enjoyed the view from the top). I'm going to end up buying some scaffolding anyway, I'll use it all the time.

Good thinking, Woody!

 

[webby3650]

You can see that a couple times I got distracted and didn't put the smooth sides of the bricks facing out..some numbers are visible.
I got some valuable tips in other threads from @bholler, @webby3650 and others. The tip I remembered most was bholler(?) saying "It doesn't have to be perfect." I'm just hoping that the mortar adhered to the bricks pretty well. Got a little dry on me a couple times, and I had to add a little more water.

Looks nice! Same profile as mine, but mine took 10 80lb bags... my new house will likely need new crowns too. This time I won't go at it alone!