Total Creosote Blockage After 1-2 Fires

[Whiskey Fun]

First, thank you all for the great info already gathered!

Here's my situation.

We just moved into a rental home with a Vermont Castings Vigilant (early to mid-1980's), with a rear exit. Off the stove is a single wall, 8" oval male-90 degree (horizontal)- 8" round female pipe, connected to another 8" horizontal 90 degree pipe, connected to an 8" to 6" adapter, all going into a 6" T-section and straight up a 30-ish foot SS flexible liner. No insulation as far as I can tell except for the original 6"x6" terracotta liner. The chimney is centrally located in the home and extends about 6' above the roof peak. We have draft problems due to living at the bottom and downwind of a big ridge a 1/4 mile away. I know this stove should have an 8" liner. But the owners claim to have used it many years with well seasoned wood with no issues and sweeping the chimney twice a season.

We bought supposedly 3-year seasoned wood from a reputable place (And I understand "seasoned wood" is not really seasoned). After 3 or 4 daylong fires, TOTAL CREOSOTE BLOCKAGE, primarily in the T-section and about 1-2 feet above it.

What I've done so far thinking it was a draft issue: Cleaned out the stove (a bucket full of creosote and ash caked inside all the rear chambers of the stove), Installed a Vacu-Draft cap, bricked up the clean out and installed an iron door (the owners used fiberglass insulation and loose bricks). Brought all the wood inside hoping to speed up the seasoning process.

Now have awesome draft. After 10 minutes using the top-down method, it sounds like a jet engine in there. But still after 1-2 fires, total blockage.

What I'll be doing this weekend: Installing all double wall (thinking the flu is cold and the retained heat might help to move exhaust up) 8" oval to 6" round pipe (made for VC stoves), 2 x 6" 45 degree elbows (thinking 3 x 90 degree turns before the exhaust goes up is too many) (this will also do away with the 8"-6" reducer which may be choking the system right before the vital turn up into the liner), a new T-section as the existing one is mangled and doesn't mate well at the vertical and horizontal section, and a 6" x 48" SS liner pipe and cap to go down into the clean out in case there are any leaks in the brick/terracotta chimney. I'll also be building a proper wood shack to season a few cords for next year.

My questions are: Could any one of these existing no-no's really cause a total blockage after 1-2 fires? And will any or all of my fixes help to remedy the problem until we can get a new stove meant for a 6" liner this summer when the money's there? I don't mind sweeping a few times a season, but after every fire is kind of ridiculous. I included a photo if my setup explanation doesn't make sense.

Thank you in advance for any advice.

 

[DougA]

I'm stumped on how it would be totally blocked that fast but my only thought would be a furry critter inside

 

[Whiskey Fun]

I'm stumped on how it would be totally blocked that fast but my only thought would be a furry critter inside

I wish it were only that. I sweep it after every 2-3 fires. Unless the the critter can teleport in and out of the liner. I haven't thought of that ;-p

 

[claydogg84]

While the setup may not be ideal, it isn't the main reason for the creosote problem. The only way you could get that much creosote in such a short period of time would have to involve extremely wet wood, and a choked out fire bellowing smoke constantly.

 

[jb6l6gc]

Ya that's absolutely crazy. Must be some of that ohio seasoned wood

 

[jb6l6gc]

Some of my woods not the greatest. I've burned a cpl cords in my furnace. Swept and cleaned stove pipe and chimney and only got about a quart. That's a very alarming amount of creosote your getting.

 

[fbelec]

what is your stove top temp?

 

[Whiskey Fun]

While the setup may not be ideal, it isn't the main reason for the creosote problem. The only way you could get that much creosote in such a short period of time would have to involve extremely wet wood, and a choked out fire bellowing smoke constantly.

The wood probably isn't seasoned but I wouldn't call it wet. Sounds like a baseball bat when I bang them together. We do the top-down method, and once the embers are low enough to open the doors, reload it. It only smolders at night when we're not adding more wood. But the damper is left wide open.

 

[Whiskey Fun]

what is your stove top temp?

I'm not sure of the stove or pipe temp. I will be getting thermometers. The stove gets hot enough to steam water on top. Heats the 17'x17' room to about 80 degrees.

 

[Babaganoosh]

Get a moisture meter, an IR temp gun, and a thermometer for your stove pipe..then report back for duty.

 

[Whiskey Fun]

Get a moisture meter, an IR temp gun, and a thermometer for your stove pipe..then report back for duty.

I'll pick up the moisture meter tomorrow. I have a temp gun. After I install the new pipe and t-section, I'll fire it up and take a reading. Want temp am I looking for? 300-500 degrees? It's suppose to be in 50's tomorrow. Will that affect things? I did notice less spillage with temps below 40.

 

[maple1]

I can't imagine plugging a pipe that quickly even if trying to. Something is very wrong here, or more like more than one thing. The wood is surely wet, and technique is surely lacking. Somehow.

 

[jb6l6gc]

I think going from an 8" from stove to a 6" chimney is not good and I don't believe it's allowable by code. I think it's bottle necking your flue gasses

 

[jb6l6gc]

Bholler had mentioned in another
Post regarding going from a 6" outlet to 5.5" liner causing some
To have to do multiple cleanings per season. I have that setup and am lucky to only have to do a mid season cleaning. I think your 8"to 6" plus multiple 90's wet wood and smoldering fires are creating a serious buildup

 

[maple1]

Also sounds like there could be cold air coming up to the T from the clean out.

 

[Whiskey Fun]

Ok this is probably something I should've figured out ahead of time...How do I get the old liner out so I can install the new T-section? Pulling it up from the top seems impossible. Can it be pulled out through bottom? I'm a little terrified to let it drop as is it will go down into the chimney a good 4-5 feet before bottoming out into the clean out. Again, thanks in advance!

 

[claydogg84]

Ok this is probably something I should've figured out ahead of time...How do I get the old liner out so I can install the new T-section? Pulling it up from the top seems impossible. Can it be pulled out through bottom? I'm a little terrified to let it drop as is it will go down into the chimney a good 4-5 feet before bottoming out into the clean out. Again, thanks in advance!

Some liners use a pulling cone to get into the chimney, depending on how tight is the liner inside the chimney. Up and out is really your only option.

 

[Whiskey Fun]

Some liners use a pulling come to get into the chimney, depending on how tight is the liner inside the chimney. Up and out is really your only option.

It sits inside a 6" x 10" terra cotta liner, so there is some wiggle room. But it's quite heavy. If I use a pry bar under the support collar I can inch it up but there's no way to grab it and lift. It's 30' long. So how can I pull it up? Would lowering rope with a hook down the inside and trying to hook the bottom work?

 

[claydogg84]

It sits inside a 6" x 10" terra cotta liner, so there is some wiggle room. But it's quite heavy. If I use a pry bar under the support collar I can inch it up but there's no way to grab it and lift. It's 30' long. So how can I pull it up? Would lowering rope with a hook down the inside and trying to hook the bottom work?

@bholler will be much more help than me.

 

[BrotherBart]

Wet wood AND a major leak in the piping somewhere letting cool air to get sucked into the flue cooling the flue gases.

Those black pipe elbows are the first suspect.

 

[rippinryno]

Wow that's a fast creosote buildup. I have black pipe outside my building and don't even see buildup like that, in fact after about 20 fires i've got nearly no buildup. if you can, next time it literally blocks your flue, snap a photo of the interior of the pipe so we can see this buildup, that's very fast!

 

[Whiskey Fun]

Wow that's a fast creosote buildup. I have black pipe outside my building and don't even see buildup like that, in fact after about 20 fires i've got nearly no buildup. if you can, next time it literally blocks your flue, snap a photo of the interior of the pipe so we can see this buildup, that's very fast!

This is kind of embarrassing, but this is after the first 3 fires of the season. They were all day fires and only allowed to burn to just embers while sleeping (damper fully open). By the 3rd fire I noticed a lot of smoke spillage. This is looking into the T section from the spout. In the 2nd picture you can see the stainless steal starting to shine through after a quick cleaning. Sometimes it's glossy like this, other times it looks like giant candle drippings (like someone poured tar down the chimney) and brown with powdery ashy coating.

 

[jb6l6gc]

Wow that's extremely bad stage 3 glazed creosote. That is a huge chimney fire waiting to happen. I wouldn't burn anymore until you've figured out wtf is going on

 

[rippinryno]

dang you weren't kidding man! Unbelievable how that can happen so fast. My black pipe outside doesn't even come close to that bad. It's a single wall stove pipe that i've used for my chimney pipe, 2 sections high with a black tee and when its' freezing outside the outside of the pipe is really only warm to the touch. I would think my setup would be clogging like that or else you have a completely different issue not related to flu temps. I've been warned by people on here about the black pipe outside getting an over abundance of creosote build up, but at this point i have yet to see that. MY plan is to simply clean or replace the outside black pipe if andw hen it does show crazy amounds of creosote

 

[begreen]

My black pipe outside doesn't even come close to that bad. It's a single wall stove pipe that i've used for my chimney pipe, 2 sections high with a black tee and when its' freezing outside the outside of the pipe is really only warm to the touch.

That is a 100% illegal setup.