I have looked around my area for a new wood-burning masonry insert for six months. A Napoleon 1402 is readily available from dealers, but only with installation. The charge for a bare-bones 1402 in matte black is a whopping $3200-3400 plus sales tax, although they are made only an hour away. From the forum I understand a pro can install one complete with SS chimney liner, where masonry modification is not needed, in two hours. Now I am thinking of buying used and doing it myself to avoid the profiteering. Is this a bad idea?
used versus new fireplace insert
- Thread starter canuck4
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Never a bad idea to do something yourself and save money. Just ask questions and learn as you go.
canuck4 said:
The company will only sell a new Napoleon if you also pay them for the install? This seems a bit odd . . . they will not cut the price if you do a cash-and-carry type of deal where you pay them only for the stove and install it yourself? Must not need the sales business. . . .
I jump up and down and cheer in my showroom when someone wants to hand me cash and take a stove from my warehouse cash and carry style. I really cant understand someone "only" selling an insert with the installation included. I'm pretty sure Napoleon is one of those stoves you can buy from a million different online sources with the stipulation that they dont sell at more than 10% off retail. Hell, I could order you a Napoleon stove and have you pick it up here. (I'd much prefer you buy local of course) My point is, there has got to be someone who can order one of these for you. They are listed by a lot of distributors in their dealer catalogues here in the Northeast of the USA.
If you go to Google Shopping, Napoleon 1402 inserts can be purchased online with free shipping for about $1500. So that would be a heck of an expensive install you would be paying for at over $3000.
http://www.fireplacesnow.com/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=38234&ref=gbase
That's just one of many online retailers for Napoleon. They appear to be really nice stoves.
http://www.fireplacesnow.com/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=38234&ref=gbase
That's just one of many online retailers for Napoleon. They appear to be really nice stoves.
Something you have to keep in mind in Ontario is the the installation is going to have to be inspected and sighed off on by a W.E.T.T. certified inspector.
Considered buying my insert online. After thinkin about it, I went with the dealer. Buying online can be a touchy situation. If ya have a problem with the stove, do you think the internet dealer is gonna come out and help you?? I would much prefer to walk into a store and talk with the dealer and feel them out. How does an internet dealer know what your exsisting fireplace look like? What shape is it in??? How much of a chimney liner do you need and various other things. I just feel more comfortable buying from a reputable dealer because when I have a problem, they are only a phone call away. Before my stove was installed, the dealer sent their in house installer to the house to know exactly what he needed for the install. I also got two seperate quotes for installs from local chimney sweeps. Both were competitive, but the dealer beat their price. Having the first stove professionally installed was paramount for me for peace of mind and safety of my family. Good luck to ya.
I am not kidding about no cash and carry pricing for wood inserts. Seven Napoleon dealers all quoted the same steep prices. Moreover, other brands seem to be sold the same way--with high-priced installation or no sale. The Drolet Escape 1400 is available by special order from a hardware chain, but it is a lower grade product that might not quite fit the existing fireplace. More interesting is the fact that certified WET technicians who do not work for dealers,, are extremely scarce in southern Ontario. And yes, I have figured out the fair market price for a Napoleon, from US websites or I would have no basis at all for comparison. Apparently Ontario has no competitive market for these wood heating products or their many US counterparts like Jotul or Osburn. With the staggering scale of cross-border trade between America and Canada, the situation should be greatly improved. Federal competition policy here is too seldom invoked because it seems the regulators are too embarrassed to pull up the rug to see what they know is there. Thank you all. Your advice is very much appreciated.
Sometimes finding the right insert used can be tough. But be patient. I got an almost never used Lopi Answer for $150. SS liner, installed myself following the instructions and codes. Certainly made me feel good when I read the saving money thread and found people with 3-4 year payoffs. Mine can payoff in one cold month with scrounged wood. Yeah, I don't have that dealer support. But I can pay for a lot of professional help with the money I saved.
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I bought my insert used for a fraction of new, ordered a SS liner online, and installed it all myself.
I did need a new cat for my stove so I called the closest dealer and they had it to me in a couple days. I have called them several times with other questions and they have treated me great. I would think most dealers that have the same brand would like your current and future business, especially with the economy.
I did need a new cat for my stove so I called the closest dealer and they had it to me in a couple days. I have called them several times with other questions and they have treated me great. I would think most dealers that have the same brand would like your current and future business, especially with the economy.
Can US dealers ship to Canada ?
Not sure what the "W.E.T.T. certified inspector. " means but you may want to see what that costs if you need it done.
Once you light a fire in the new insert it is used !
Not sure what the "W.E.T.T. certified inspector. " means but you may want to see what that costs if you need it done.
Once you light a fire in the new insert it is used !
well...1st off that price is a little high i sell and install that same unit for $2695 complete.canuck4 said:
it's very important for you to remember that even though it may take a pro a few hours to complete--they do it everyday.
first of all the chimney must be properly cleaned before install.
there are alot of variables with installation such as insulating the liner (yes...all wood,pellet and coal applications require 1/2 inch ceramic wrap around the liner), you may have to have liner ovalized and still maintain proper cross-sectional area, make the proper connections, carry in the unit, damper removal, crown repair if needed.
it's the unit , liner and insulation kit that costs the money....maybe $200-$500 labor
DO NOT BUY A USED STOVE...THERE MAY BE PROBLEMS WITH IT AND YOU ARE NOT THE ORIGINAL OWNER=NO WARRANTY
purchase a new one and have it professionally installed by dec 31, 2010=30% tax credit
BeGreen said:
As I was reading through this thread . . . and realizing it was an old one . . . I just somehow knew who had re-opened this oldie . . . Zombie Thread . . . it's alive . . . it's alive.
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