VC Defiant 1945 Rebuild or Buy New Stove

[prw]

We've had VC Defiant 1945 woodstove for 13 years now. Have replaced in the past the catalytic once, andirons, (seems like once a season) gaskets, bricks, glass. This past winter the damper was very hard to close. At times I wondered if it would, which was scary since the stove was full of wood and heating up. Husband started taking apart stove this weekend. Couldn't see why the damper was not functioning properly. He did break a bolt, that holds damper tab. I assume stove does need new cement in seams because I saw smoke come out of it. My question is: what would you do:
Rebuild?
By a new stove?
We really don't want to spend 2 or 3000 on a new one.

 

[begreen]

It's most likely due for a rebuild. Hubby will have to assess the status of the stove. It could be the bypass damper is warping. If the refractory package needs replacing and a new cat and bypass damper, the parts alone could be inching towards $1K.

These are pretty stoves, but they are complicated and expensive to maintain. Although I can appreciate not wanting to spend $2-3K on a new stove right now, once the full cost for a rebuild has been assessed, weigh that against the costs of maintenance over the next 10 or 20 years. There are good stoves that if run well and cared for, will only need some gaskets during that time period.

 

[prw]

It's most likely due for a rebuild. Hubby will have to assess the status of the stove. It could be the bypass damper is warping. If the refractory package needs replacing and a new cat and bypass damper, the parts alone could be inching towards $1K.

These are pretty stoves, but they are complicated and expensive to maintain. Although I can appreciate not wanting to spend $2-3K on a new stove right now, once the full cost for a rebuild has been assessed, weigh that against the costs of maintenance over the next 10 or 20 years. There are good stoves that if run well and cared for, will only need some gaskets during that time period.

Suggestions for a good stove that is less expensive and maintenance?

We've top loaded for around 20 years now and worry about front loading stoves.

 

[begreen]

What is the worry about front-loading stoves? They are usually simpler and with N/S loading there is no need for andirons or worries about logs rolling up against the glass. We had an original VC Resolute and loved it. Since then we have only had front-loading stoves. They work great and have sold me on the virtues of a KISS designed stove.

If top loading is a must, maybe look at the There are many on the market, but before suggesting some tell us more about what is most important to you. Looks, function, heating ability, long burn time, loading flexibility, etc. are all attributes of one stove or another. If cost is a challenge then I would look at the Drolet HT2000 or its replacement, the HT3000.

If looks are a priority there are the Jotul F500 and the Hearthstone Manchester. In a more convective package there are the cast iron jacketed Quadrafire Explorer II and III, Jotul F55 and the Pacific Energy Alderlea T6.

 

[prw]

What is the worry about front-loading stoves? They are usually simpler and with N/S loading there is no need for andirons or worries about logs rolling up against the glass. We had an original VC Resolute and loved it. Since then we have only had front-loading stoves. They work great and have sold me on the virtues of a KISS designed stove.

If top loading is a must, maybe look at the There are many on the market, but before suggesting some tell us more about what is most important to you. Looks, function, heating ability, long burn time, loading flexibility, etc. are all attributes of one stove or another. If cost is a challenge then I would look at the Drolet HT2000 or its replacement, the HT3000.

If looks are a priority there are the Jotul F500 and the Hearthstone Manchester. In a more convective package there are the cast iron jacketed Quadrafire Explorer II and III, Jotul F55 and the Pacific Energy Alderlea T6.

Looks are not important. We use only wood to heat. So, long burn time is a must, we need our house to stay warm through the night without having to reload in the middle of the night. I see on this forum recommendations for the Englander 30, which would be the cost of what we would have to probably do the rebuild. We do use hedge some and since that has a firecracker effect, loading from the front seems like it would be coming out at us, closer to the floor. It's probably the fear of the unknown (loading from the front). The Englander is metal. Heard metal doesn't hold heat like cast iron.

 

[begreen]

Looks are not important. We use only wood to heat. So, long burn time is a must, we need our house to stay warm through the night without having to reload in the middle of the night. I see on this forum recommendations for the Englander 30, which would be the cost of what we would have to probably do the rebuild. We do use hedge some and since that has a firecracker effect, loading from the front seems like it would be coming out at us, closer to the floor. It's probably the fear of the unknown (loading from the front). The Englander is metal. Heard metal doesn't hold heat like cast iron.

The Englander 30NC and Drolet HT2000 are proven winners in value stoves. They are large enough to hold a fire overnight. The cast iron jacketed stoves I mentioned are great at holding heat and then slowly releasing it over time. But more metal does cost more. The benefit is a more even heat with less room temperature swing.

I hear you on the sparks with hedge. Locust can be sparky too. This is where a proper depth hearth is important.

 

[prw]

Looking at the Englander 30nc, you need a hearth with a depth of 52 inches. Our hearth is 48 inches deep. Has anyone ever installed a stove on a hearth that is 4 inches to shallow?

 

[Simonkenton]

Let's see, rebuild, again, a dog Vermont Castings. Or buy a new stove.

BUY A NEW STOVE. It is a no brainer.

 

[prw]

I wish it was that easy, just buy a new stove like the Englander 30nc for a $1000. But our hearth area is has only 48 in depth for clearance and the Englander requires 52. Stoves that fit that area are limited unless we want to pay $3000. Our fireplace dealer sells a buck stove that would probably fit. I believe they are a metal stove and I don't see a lot of reviews that one. We know the VC heats our 2400sq ft 3 level house here in Kansas winters. The stove is in our basement. I wonder if metal stoves would do the same.

 

[Simonkenton]

I paid $2500 for my stove, plus $1400 on the install, and I provided the pipe.
But I have a good stove.

If you want a good stove you got to pay.

 

[begreen]

I wish it was that easy, just buy a new stove like the Englander 30nc for a $1000. But our hearth area is has only 48 in depth for clearance and the Englander requires 52. Stoves that fit that area are limited unless we want to pay $3000. Our fireplace dealer sells a buck stove that would probably fit. I believe they are a metal stove and I don't see a lot of reviews that one. We know the VC heats our 2400sq ft 3 level house here in Kansas winters. The stove is in our basement. I wonder if metal stoves would do the same.

What is the problem with extending the hearth 4"? What is the floor material? Is this on a concrete slab?

 

[Diabel]

I was also concerned about the front loading concept. Now, I can honestly say. The front loading is easier than top loading.

 

[prw]

The pad is brick with vinyl planks up against. Just yesterday we were thinking we could extend the brick bad. Of course that means learning how to brick lay.

 

[begreen]

This could be a pretty easy task, depending on the stove hearth requirements. I would extend it further, say 8" for further protection against sparks from the hedge. The 30NC has an insulation requirement of R=1.5, so some insulation may be needed under the brick unless the brick is on the slab floor. If that is the case, no problem, just cut back the vinyl and lay down the brick in mortar. The HT2000/HT3000 just needs ember protection. This could be a strip of steel on top of the vinyl or more brick.

 

[prw]

I was also concerned about the front loading concept. Now, I can honestly say. The front loading is easier than top loading.

I'm wondering how front loading is easier. We open top loader with wood and add wood. It has been simple. With a front loader don't you have to squat down to add. We are not lazy, just getting older. Then again, you are not adding wood constantly. Such a dilemma. Repair. Replace with a new one that is $3000 give or take. Replace with one which requires more floor clearance but is cheaper. If only money wasn't an issue

 

[Diabel]

Both of my stoves I stuff to the max and walk away. VC is reloaded 8h later on ambers with no sparks flying anywhere. BK gets reloaded 18h later with no sparks flying anywhere. I can stuff the BK much better (tighter) than the VC.

 

[begreen]

Yes, the stoves suggested can be loaded N/S. That allows fuller loading of the firebox without worries of a log rolling against the glass. It's one of the reasons front loading can be easier than top loading.

 

[Diabel]

Just my opinion but if you burn 24/7 (full time) I would not hesitate and go with the 3K stove and be done with. As someone told me once “most of us are too poor to buy cheap”.

 

[prw]

Just my opinion but if you burn 24/7 (full time) I would not hesitate and go with the 3K stove and be done with. As someone told me once “most of us are too poor to buy cheap”.

Ha ha! So true! We do burn 24/7.

 

[prw]

Do all cast irons need re-cemented in seams. Do metal stove seams need re-welded?

 

[Bad LP]

I'd have a hard time rebuilding a VC stove. Too bad really because they were once a great stove.

3K is a lot of money to some but keeping your eyes open for a good used one should have been on the radar for a while now before the winter season started staring us down. I know the installer at a local stove shop has a collection of used stoves he sells.

Are there any other stove shops you can put your name out to? Craig's List? Realtors also run into buyers who want stoves removed for various reasons.

 

[billb3]

Do all cast irons need re-cemented in seams ?

eventually

Do metal stove seams need re-welded?

that's kinda rare.



I've owned a Tempwood top loader and starting a fire in it was not easier than a front or side loader.
Me, I like a N/S side loader for ease of use alone. Including removing a few ashes in the middle of Winter.

Why wait until September to contemplate rebuilding a wood stove ?

 

[prw]

We didn't follow this advice: "Don't put off until tomorrow what you can do today.”

 

[prw]

I don't think I will let the floor requirements dictate what kind of stove to get. I think we can remedy that by adding more bricks.
For now, I want to keep price factor out of this and try and figure out:

Cat or Non-Cat?
Radiant or Convection?

 

[begreen]

Do all cast irons need re-cemented in seams. Do metal stove seams need re-welded?

Eventually yes, for true cast iron jacketed stoves. But not true for steel stoves unless there is a problem.

Note that there are also cast iron clad steel stoves. In that case the cast iron never needs seam sealing. The cast iron is just an outer jacket.