What are the real dangers with wood burning?

[Lumber-Jack]

What stove are we talking about here?

https://www.usstove.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=510

 

[gmtechguy]

Yes, sorry, it is the aps1100b. I will try to post a few pics of the install.


The tree behind the chimney is probably 30 feet away from chimney, but I know it doesn't help things from what I have read. The neighbor wants to keep it I think.

And the branches in the front have been removed. I did my best with it all.

 

[begreen]

Got it, that looks like a clean install.

The real dangers of wood burning lie mostly with the person running the stove. The biggest danger might be careless or shoddy installation. We see this a lot here. The second would probably be poor running of the stove. This would include overfiring or spacing out the fire and running with the air wide open or not using the bypass on a cat or downdraft stove. The opposite can be bad too if one constantly burns a smoldering fire. And the last might be poor maintenance. This would include burning poor wood, not cleaning the chimney regularly, and using chimney fires to clean the chimney.

 

[doug crann]

Have you had a lung capacity test? If you have asthma, or worse the dreaded COPD it would be wise to wear a dust mask when cleaning the box. Ernestina purchased one of those Love-Less ash vacs.....0 dust comes out the exhaust port. Not exactly cheap but how much are your lungs worth? I burn a slash pile several times a winter, our roads are self maintained & I volunteered to start clearing the trees back...Sure breathing all that green Ponderosa Pine is real good for me.....Oh well, no one gets out alive anyway.....

 

[smallcabin]

Hey GMTECHGUY congrats on the new stove. Yes that does have a secondary burn system. If you open up the door and look inside and up you will see 2 rows of holes. The holes are drilled in a chamber that draws air from the back side of the stove and once heated up will produce blue and yellow flames when the wood is outgassing. It does put out a lot of heat, just not a long burn time (4 hours or so). Install looks great by the way.

 

[gmtechguy]

Hey SMALLCABIN,
Thank you for the info. I guess the person that I talked to wasn't so informed. I'm not surprised though, they also had me remove my top firebricks to help draft and then the next rep said that my stove isn't the model with the firebrick problem haha. Oh well. I thought those holes were just a baffle system that is involved with the air intake, so thanks for the info.
Also, how do you get such a long burn time? Do you wait until the last logs are burned down to coals and then add? I need some info on hoe to properly run this thing. I have been getting suggestions from friends with much bigger fireboxes and they don't seem to work for me.

If you don't mind, would you walk me through your routine with this particular stove?

 

[Cynnergy]

Someone gave me about 5 cords of oak that was cut into mostly 16 inch logs and stacked for almost 2 years. I have been hauling it home and splitting it with my buddies 27 ton splitter. I think it needs some more time now that it is split... I have a magnetic thermometer on the stove top and the highest it has gotten when burning real good was 450 but usually hangs around 300-350. Is that even hot enough to burn right?

Yes, your wood is very likely wet - oak is notorious for needing a long time to dry. And it doesn't season until it's split and stacked. A moisture meter would be a good investment - do a search on here for how to use it.

The easiest way that I can tell if I'm burning clean is to look at what's coming out of the chimney: no smoke = clean burn. Wet wood just makes everything harder - hard to start, hard to get and keep a clean burn, more coals, etc. you could be getting a clean burn at 300F stovetop but that's definitely on the edge for my stove - of course once you're in the coals/cooling down stage, most of the nasties have burned off, so 300F usually isn't a problem then, although with wet wood the chimney can start smoking again later in the burn - keep an eye on it and add air if necessary.

Lots of info on here about your options if you have wet wood - do a search and then ask away.

 

[gmtechguy]

Hey DOUG CRANN,
I did have those types of tests done some years ago but not recently. I usually don't have any issues in that area but if they persist I will have to look into it.

 

[smallcabin]

Sure I'll try to tell you how I do it. Open the draft all the way to the right and start a kindling fire, I use some scrap wood maybe 1 very small split and a fire starter. For a fire starter I use a Super Cedar..works great for me. I leave the door cracked open until the fire is going pretty good and usually don't shut the door until the temp on the stove pipe is 275-300 deg (measured about 18" above stove) I have 2 temp gauges one on the stove pipe and one on the top of the stove. The reason I let it get it up to 275-300 deg on the pipe is it seems to get the draft going really strong. Once the door is shut I let the stove burn down the wood with the draft open until the wood burns down into coals. I then open the door slowly and reload with a hardwood of choice and once leave the door cracked open until the fire is going good and I have about 275-300 deg on the stove pipe. Once I reach this temp I close the door and let the fire stabalize for about 10 min or so and then I start closing down the draft in stages letting the fire stabilize between each step. One thing is I never leave the stove when the door is cracked open. I usually end up with the draft at about 1/4 open..this usually sets up a good burn for me and the secondarys are going good. With this stove you will not get that long of a secondary burn as a bigger stove because of the smaller amount of wood you can fit in this stove. Ok now problems I have had...don't load the stove when the stove top temp is above 250-275 deg, it will have a tendency to over fire. The coals light off the wood super fast and with the higher stove temp the secondaries with go crazy. Another way to get a runaway is to load the wood too close to the holes where the secondary flames come out. I think the secondary flames not only burn the gasses and smoke but you can see where they are burning the wood as well. I don't know if this happens with other stoves or not and is just my humble opinion. I learned from someone else on this forum if you have a runaway to just open the door, as all that extra air will help cool the stove and the chimney down and it worked for me the two times I had a runaway. I have learned a lot from others on this forum, there are a lot of great people on this site with a lot of experience. I sure this is not the only way to run this stove and if someone else finds fault with or has a better way please tell me as I am still learning. There is a lot of info on this site along with great people with a lot of knowledge willing to help and I have learned a lot here. Sorry to be so long winded and I hope it helps. Rick

 

[branchburner]

Since switching from forced hot air to wood, the family seems to have fewer illnesses/colds... with either, adding humidity in winter is essential. Probably we face much more health hazard in our old NH house from radon, trace arsenic in well water, old lead paint, hidden mold, cupboards filled with junk food, etc.

 

[DanCorcoran]

danke.

Bitte

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Hello all, I am new to wood burning and have recently purchased and installed a US Stove Company APS1100B EPA certified stove. I also installed the chimney which is a supervent insulated chimney system. I pulled a permit and had it inspected. The heat is fantastic! The stove is a little tricky to get going but once it is going, if you keep it hot and use smaller logs, it works well.

That being said, I have noticed lately that my lungs on some days feel a little funny. Could just be the dry air in the house, despite the cast iron kettle on top of the stove. I started researching wood burning health risks and am now quite concerned. I had no idea about the fine particulate matter and how harmful it can be. To help with ash, I bought a shop vac ash vac, which i feel is a bit of a rip off but I will see how it works. I know there are things like this that are heavily one sided, so I wanted to ask you folks, since you have much more experience with this.

Is it the ash or smoke that is the real worry? Is there anything I can do to protect my family? Is it safe once it is burning and door is closed? (Some environmental organizations say that 70% of the smoke particulates re-enter the home with doors and windows closed).

Wow, thank you all for the replies. I do not have a moisture meter but do think my wood is too damp. Someone gave me about 5 cords of oak that was cut into mostly 16 inch logs and stacked for almost 2 years. I have been hauling it home and splitting it with my buddies 27 ton splitter. I think it needs some more time now that it is split. I will have to invest in a moisture meter. I contacted the stove company to ask about the hard lighting and happened to ask if my stove has a secondary burn (doesn't have burn tubes or anything) and they said no. It is an epa certified stove though. I have a magnetic thermometer on the stove top and the highest it has gotten when burning real good was 450 but usually hangs around 300-350. Is that even hot enough to burn right?

Welcome to the forum gmtechguy.

The real dangers of wood burning is some of the poor practices that some folks use and continue to do so. Some can never be taught...

What you are finding is quite normal with new wood burners so you are not alone. Looks like a good install and I would not worry about those trees. We have lots of trees to contend with here but have no problems because of them.

On the dry air, which is no doubt causing that strange feeling in your lungs lately, a humidifier can help that out nicely.

On the shop vac, I'll only add one caution and that is to not remove all the ashes when you do this. Leave at least 1-2" in the bottom of the stove for best results. We usually remove some ashes once per week or maybe sooner in really cold weather but still leave a good amount of ashes in the stove.

Now to the real problem. The most basic problem with new wood burners is being able to get good fuel to burn. As you well know, if you burn poor fuel in your car or truck, you will get very poor performance. It is exactly the same thing with wood stove. So the question becomes, how do we get good fuel?

Most wood burners will cut their own wood. Some have woodlots; some scrounge wherever they can; many have had good luck getting wood from arborists because it costs those folks many dollars to dispose of their wood so they are happy to give it away. Some folks will buy a semi-load of logs and then cut from that. Also, it definitiley pays to learn what types of wood is available in your area and also to know which is best.

So once we get the wood, how do we dry it? First and foremost is that wood will not dry hardly at all until it has been split. It will lose some moisture from the ends but very little. Therefore we need to expose more of the interior of the logs to air so the moisture can evaporate. Once this is done, then the wood needs to be stacked, off the ground and preferably in the windiest spot you have on your place. The biggest key to drying wood is air circulation and that means wind. Sunshine won't hurt either but if I choose between the two, wind always wins. In most cases it also pays to top cover the wood but never cover the sides or ends. Remember, it needs air. Now that you have your wood cut, split and stacked, what you need is time. But how much time?

That depends upon the wood. Generally speaking, the softer the wood, the quicker it will dry. On the other hand, oak is one of the very best. However, it gives up the moisture very reluctantly. Around here, we give it 3 years in the stack before burning it in the stove. It pays great dividends by doing this. Yet there are plenty of woods that will dry nicely within a year. You need to find out what you have in your area and choose some that take only a year to dry.

I also have to second what BrotherBart said on this idea of 70% of the particulates re-entering the home. Pure grade A baloney.


On your stove top temperatures, they are low so don't worry about running it hotter. Especially that your wood is a bit damp, higher temperatures will help you. But one word of caution here. Do check your chimney often. At least monthly. Clean if necessary. Burning wood that is a bit high in moisture can cause a chimney to plug up very quickly; we've seen this done in less than 2 weeks! So please do yourself a favor and keep a sharp eye on the chimney.

Good luck.

 

[Paulywalnut]

I have some fine white ash floating around when I open my stove door. Very little.
Outside I rarely see any smoke coming from my chimney. If my oil burner comes on
just to heat some hot water I see smoke. Conclusion: wood is safer than oil

 

[gmtechguy]

Thank you all very much for all of the insight. I need to find some good dry wood and soon. I want to burn the stove but without dry wood it is hard to do.

What exactly do I look for when inspecting the chimney? I did go up the other day and removed the cap. There is already a black rough coating that reminds me of carbon from an engine, only a bit more sticky, (Creosote I am guessing).

At what point does it need to be cleaned, and do I just leave the stove pipe connected and run the sweep down to the stove? Sorry if this is a stupid question, just haven't done it before and would rather get help from you folks than people who might mislead me.

 

[jatoxico]

You might consider some bio-bricks or equivalent to supplement /mix in with your marginal wood. Not as good as the real thing but at least you can enjoy your new toy and get some decent heat out of it w/o driving yourself crazy. Wet wood takes the fun out of burning, dry wood = pleasure.

 

[gmtechguy]

Good point.

 

[doug crann]

Where in Jersey do you live? I spent 27 years in Parsippany.....the air there is not exactly all that healthy to begin with....

 

[gmtechguy]

I'm on the southern end of the state near the pine barrens.

 

[doug crann]

I'm on the southern end of the state near the pine barrens.

Used to go 4 wheeling in the Pine Barrens...air is ALOT more clear down there then where I used to live....

 

[gmtechguy]

Cool. I go out there fairly often.

 

[doug crann]

You ever been out to Warren Grove to watch the A-10's & F4's wrecking stuff?

 

[gmtechguy]

Been through probably 95% of the woods around there. I stay away from the range though. My dad used to take us out there when we were kids.

 

[Oldhippie]

The real dangers with wood burning is the possibility of burning your house down, and anyone in it, if you don't do it right.

 

[mfetcho]

I don't know if it was mentioned, but get a few carbon monoxide detectors for you house. Wood stoves consumed oxygen and you definitely want to monitor the carbon monoxide.

I live in Washington and I haven't read any of the jargon you have mentioned, but I definitely want to check it out. I have been burning for 10 years and I am on my 3rd house with my third stove and I now have 3 kids. We have no issues with health and wood burning.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

EPA stove produce much less emission than older stoves , and probably no more hazardous than the diesel truck going by your house or the other chimneys on your block spewing flue gas from coal,gas or oil heaters. A properly burning modern stove does not smoke anyway after its warmed up.