What size Hearthstone for 1100 sf cape

[eastmitten]

This is another time when I would give up a few inches and put the stove in a place that allows a vertical chimney. Small house, so you'll be running the stove no low settings frequently and you'll need every bit of draft you can get. Sounds like a sunroom install with a flat roof and single story right? You'll need a minimum chimney height of 14+ feet as specified in the stove's manual. If you plan to be near the minimum then having a straight flue is even more important.

Lots of people put little bends, offsets, and joggles in the black pipe between the stove and the ceiling. It is legal and sometimes has to be done.

Yes, it's a one story off a 2-story cape - but it has a peaked roof above the sunroom - it's got a good size crawl space (just looked and it's about 5-6' high) with no opening in it to see the ceiling support structure. I'm thinking about putting a small entry into the crawl space from one of the knee walls.

 

[Highbeam]

You definitely want an access to all parts of your attic. I thought it was a code requirement for fighting fires, insulation installation, etc.

 

[eastmitten]

Ignore the sq ftg. go by the firebox size. Heating 1100 sq ft in NH is entirely different that heating the same sq ftg in WA state or the Carolinas. Firebox capacity will give you longer times between refilling the stove and the reserve capacity you need for those zero degree nights.

I would get the T5. It's a pussycat to run, and can hold a low fire or burn cleanly with just a few sticks of wood, stove top at 450. But when it gets into the single digits, it can be pushed hotter (stovetop 650-700) and will have the reserves you need.

BeGreen - I'm seriously looking at the T5 now instead of the Hearthstones because of the much smaller clearances and not knowing how the flue will go through the ceiling I'd like to have some wiggle room at install time. Talked to a local Wood Stove shop owner and he said that he used to carry Pacific Energy but "couldn't get the heat out of them" (room temp) and doesn't carry them any longer. Putting two BTU-like stoves side-by-side the PE just didn't give the heat he said. He had the PE people in and they couldn't make any adjustments to get more heat. I went to another stove shop last night and they raved about the T5. Your thoughts? Thanks!

 

[eastmitten]

You definitely want an access to all parts of your attic. I thought it was a code requirement for fighting fires, insulation installation, etc.

Thanks Highbeam - I'm planning on looking at adding an access door into the crawl space. I'm not comfortable putting the chimney through with no way to access.

 

[thinkxingu]

Although I'm a big fan of my Hearthstone, and soapstone in general, I'm not sure I've ever heard a negative review of Pacific. Which shops you working with?

S

 

[eastmitten]

Although I'm a big fan of my Hearthstone, and soapstone in general, I'm not sure I've ever heard a negative review of Pacific. Which shops you working with?

S

I spent some time at Alternative Energy (Hampton Falls) - who didn't recommend PE. I talked to John at Nordic Stove Shop (Dover, NH) who was very helpful. This thread has been extremely helpful. Heck, I started out with Hearthstone (see the topic name!) and the recommendation to the T5 should help out a ton with my particular setup.

 

[eastmitten]

Does anyone know of any web sites that can give some good ideas/designs for a brick hearth for under the stove? My 86 year-old neighbor is moving and gave me 115 antique bricks that I've cleaned up and most look great. I'm planning on using them so I'd like to get some ideas of for a nice design.

 

[begreen]

Big topic eastmitten. Do a google image search for brick laying patterns. There are lots of cool ways to do this.

 

[Nic36]

After reading this thread, I've kinda had my feelings hurt that no one suggested the PE Classic to you. Of course I'm partial, I have the smaller Vista Classic. I think the Classic has the same firebox as the Alderlea T5. It just has a different look. The T5 just has a big cast iron jacket around it, whereas the Classic has a porcelain exterior. I seriously considered the Alderlea T4 though before I made my final choice.

On the hearth design, I really have no good suggestions. The good thing is you don't have to worry about pad design other than the pad being a noncombustible material. So, it can be any thickness as long as it is noncombustible.

 

[eastmitten]

What is the general consensus on getting a blower with the stove? Someone suggested waiting a bit to see if we need it and if so, buy and install it ourselves at that time. My other thought is to get it now and bundle it all together with the 30% tax credit. I don't think I can incorporate it into the 2010 tax credit. Thx.

 

[eastmitten]

After reading this thread, I've kinda had my feelings hurt that no one suggested the PE Classic to you. Of course I'm partial, I have the smaller Vista Classic. I think the Classic has the same firebox as the Alderlea T5. It just has a different look. The T5 just has a big cast iron jacket around it, whereas the Classic has a porcelain exterior. I seriously considered the Alderlea T4 though before I made my final choice.

On the hearth design, I really have no good suggestions. The good thing is you don't have to worry about pad design other than the pad being a noncombustible material. So, it can be any thickness as long as it is noncombustible.

Nic - here's your chance to convince me of the Vista Classic over the T5! And anyone else that wants to comment. thanks.

 

[Nic36]

I was being a bit silly when I made my post. I think either stove will perform almost the same since they are basically the same. I think the Classic is lighter weight and will probably start radiating heat quicker, whereas the T5 will radiate heat longer since it has the thick cast iron jacket around it. Their clearances are probably the same as well.

Pick the stove that you really like. You're the one that will have to look at it every day. I really wanted an Alderlea early on, but finally decided on the Vista Classic for a few reasons--it was a little cheaper, a bit lighter and I wanted a porcelain finish stove. I think I would be just as happy with either though, and I really like the Alderlea cook top. That's the main thing I liked about the Alderlea. The Classic does not have that.

So, it sounds like I have steered you more towards the T5 if anything. I think you would be happy with either though. I bought a PE stove because I read so many posts on Hearth.com about how much everyone else liked theirs. The stove review section is a good place to go to as well. The information on this forum was really helpful for me when I was tying to figure out my installation.

On the tax credit, I think you can only count up to $1500.00. And, I'm sure you will spend more than that on the stove alone. (Someone correct me if I'm wrong about that.) I don't have a blower on my stove, although I think it would be a nice feature. I have just enough room for a revolving fan to sit behind mine. I may eventually buy a blower though.

 

[begreen]

After reading this thread, I've kinda had my feelings hurt that no one suggested the PE Classic to you. Of course I'm partial, I have the smaller Vista Classic. I think the Classic has the same firebox as the Alderlea T5. It just has a different look. The T5 just has a big cast iron jacket around it, whereas the Classic has a porcelain exterior. I seriously considered the Alderlea T4 though before I made my final choice.

On the hearth design, I really have no good suggestions. The good thing is you don't have to worry about pad design other than the pad being a noncombustible material. So, it can be any thickness as long as it is noncombustible.

Nic - here's your chance to convince me of the Vista Classic over the T5! And anyone else that wants to comment. thanks.

The Vista Classic has the same size firebox as the Alderlea T4, 1.4 cu ft. The 2 cu ft equivalent of the T5 in a steel jacket is the PE Classic. That would work as well if you prefer the look. It doesn't have the mass of cast iron or the soapstone-like behavior with the steel jacket, but inside it's the same stove as the Alderlea T5.

If looking for a steel jacketed stove like the PE Classic, maybe also take a look at the Quadrafire 3100 and the Napoleon 1400PL. Both have nice close clearances due to the outer steel jacket.

 

[Highbeam]

Nic36, I think you're mistaken on the credit. You get 30% rebate up to 1500$. Meaning you have 4500 to spend and can only get 1500 back. I do believe that the rebate program runs through 2010 so you can make these purchases next year too.

The reason I prefer the Alderlea over the classic series is that the outer sheet metal shell of the classics looks like a refrigerator shell. The painted colors make it even more so. I would probably get a plane plate steel model before opting for a sheet metal clad one. The cast iron appears more substantial. All of course have the same internals.

 

[Nic36]

Nic36, I think you're mistaken on the credit. You get 30% rebate up to 1500$. Meaning you have 4500 to spend and can only get 1500 back. I do believe that the rebate program runs through 2010 so you can make these purchases next year too.

The reason I prefer the Alderlea over the classic series is that the outer sheet metal shell of the classics looks like a refrigerator shell. The painted colors make it even more so. I would probably get a plane plate steel model before opting for a sheet metal clad one. The cast iron appears more substantial. All of course have the same internals.

That's good on the tax credit. I was basically repeating what I had read elsewhere, so I wasn't sure if that was right.

I understand what your saying about the outside covering of the Classic stoves. I was a little anxious when I ordered mine, because sometimes pictures don't always look like the real thing. I bought just the classic black color and did not want to risk anything else. But, I am very happy with how it looks. I don't regret it one bit. Cleaning it with a damp cloth is also easy to do. I would say the Classic stoves are probably more contemporary looking and the Alderlea has a more rustic old style appearance/charm to it. I would have been happy with either one I do believe.

 

[eastmitten]

Nic36, I think you're mistaken on the credit. You get 30% rebate up to 1500$. Meaning you have 4500 to spend and can only get 1500 back. I do believe that the rebate program runs through 2010 so you can make these purchases next year too.

The reason I prefer the Alderlea over the classic series is that the outer sheet metal shell of the classics looks like a refrigerator shell. The painted colors make it even more so. I would probably get a plane plate steel model before opting for a sheet metal clad one. The cast iron appears more substantial. All of course have the same internals.

That's good on the tax credit. I was basically repeating what I had read elsewhere, so I wasn't sure if that was right.

I understand what your saying about the outside covering of the Classic stoves. I was a little anxious when I ordered mine, because sometimes pictures don't always look like the real thing. I bought just the classic black color and did not want to risk anything else. But, I am very happy with how it looks. I don't regret it one bit. Cleaning it with a damp cloth is also easy to do. I would say the Classic stoves are probably more contemporary looking and the Alderlea has a more rustic old style appearance/charm to it. I would have been happy with either one I do believe.

I only know this because I'm doing the actual buying.... To clarify - the tax credit is 30% with a $1,500 maximum. Which means you have to spend $5,000 to get the full $1,500 (not spending $4,500). Either way, it's a great deal. But not all stoves are listed as 75% efficient and may not be eligible. So before you buy, make sure it's eligible.

 

[eastmitten]

You definitely want an access to all parts of your attic. I thought it was a code requirement for fighting fires, insulation installation, etc.

I have someone coming to put an access door from the knee-wall to the crawl space. I'll feel much more comfortable having it there.

 

[AlaskanRedneck]

I have a Hearthstone Phoenix and it is heating my entire house. 1700 sf living area. It also heats my 1700 sf crawlspace. So basically it's heating 3400 sf. My home is 5 star plus energy rated though and I have an air exchanger that moves all the heat around.

I would go with the Hertiage Homestead, some friends of mine heat thier 1600 sf home with it. Although thier far rooms can get a little chilly.

 

[eastmitten]

After reading this thread, I've kinda had my feelings hurt that no one suggested the PE Classic to you. Of course I'm partial, I have the smaller Vista Classic. I think the Classic has the same firebox as the Alderlea T5. It just has a different look. The T5 just has a big cast iron jacket around it, whereas the Classic has a porcelain exterior. I seriously considered the Alderlea T4 though before I made my final choice.

On the hearth design, I really have no good suggestions. The good thing is you don't have to worry about pad design other than the pad being a noncombustible material. So, it can be any thickness as long as it is noncombustible.

I have looked around online and read the PE Alderlea T5 manual and can't find what the hearth's r-value needs to be. I've got about 130 antique bricks that will be used but I don't know how much durock will be needed. Thanks.

 

[Nic36]

The Alderlea will not have a R value. Your hearth only needs to be "noncombustible" and Durock is not necessary unless you just want to use it.

So, anything under the stove will be fine as long as it won't burn. Plain bricks will be fine as long as they are mortared together so an ember cannot make it to a combustible. Or, if you don't want to mortar the bricks together, a layer of Durock underneath the bricks will meet the requirement. You have a lot of flexibility in coming up with a hearth design because of that.

 

[Nic36]

I should have added that my stove radiates very little heat to the floor. I could keep my had under it all day on full burn and not break a sweat.

I would think the Alderlea would be similar. So, the only reason you are building a hearth is for protection against embers falling out of the stove and starting a fire.

 

[eastmitten]

The Alderlea will not have a R value. Your hearth only needs to be "noncombustible" and Durock is not necessary unless you just want to use it.

So, anything under the stove will be fine as long as it won't burn. Plain bricks will be fine as long as they are mortared together so an ember cannot make it to a combustible. Or, if you don't want to mortar the bricks together, a layer of Durock underneath the bricks will meet the requirement. You have a lot of flexibility in coming up with a hearth design because of that.

Sweet. Thanks Nic. When I was looking at the Hearthstone Homestead it had R2.5 after adding the bottom heat shield and 6" legs. So it got me wondering about this stove. The more I learn the more I think I'm gonna love the T5. Hearth getting built Friday. Stove installed Tues or Wed but I leave for Florida early Wed so... I'll light her up in the New Year!

 

[eastmitten]

The stove is going in a room on posts. Does anyone see any issues with the T5 (400-500 pounds), 2 layers of durock and 1 brick layer being excessive weight for that room? The room feels very stable so I'm assuming it's on 2x6 construction and it appears that the 3-4" posts may be cement filled. One in each corner that's not connected to the house with one between them on the side wall farthest from the main house. thx

 

[begreen]

Without seeing a picture of what is actually under that floor area, it's hard to say. I would expect 2x10 are under the floor. The load is distributed over multiple floor joists by the sub and primary flooring. I wouldn't worry about it, but post a picture of the floor joists with a tape measure in the picture if possible if you want to get some eyes looking at it.

 

[Highbeam]

It's not the posts so much as the beams that run between the posts and the joists that span those beams. If the stove is 500#, holds 50# of wood, 2 layers of durock at 100# per layer (yes that's 200#), one brick layer at say 200 more pounds, and a 200# person warming their buns then you're over 1150#s at the hearth location.

I added reinforcement under my stove as can be seen in my OAK pics in my sig line just to be sure. The last thing I wanted was a sagging floor. A couple of beams, some framing, and 4 posts were not expensive and maybe weren't needed but they also don't hurt anything.

Some folks build these add on porches very well and sometimes folks build them with very hokey methods never thinking that they will be anything but decks so you would be wise to investigate the construction methods.