What to do? Help me with fireplace.

[Pattonky]

I have a purchase contract on a home with a fireplace inglenook kind of setup in mid century modern style home. I have a professional coming to inspect the fireplace this week. The chimney is on an outside wall, has an inoperable throat damper and a chimney height of about 10'. Honestly, cursory research says that what my heart desires is not what the brain would have you put in place. My current home has a gas fireplace, vented and I don't care for it. I want the sound and appearance of a real fireplace. This home's fireplace looks to have originally been for a gas fireplace as the gas line is there, but currently they have only an electric look at me log set sitting on the hearth floor.


Please tell me what you think is the best option for me working with what I have and why? If I need to give more information then please let me know that too.

 

[begreen]

By the soot staining it looks like it might have burned wood at one time. I'd be a bit nervous with an open wood fire having the wood cabinet right below it to the left. Do you want an open fireplace or an insert or a freestanding stove in that space?

 

[Pattonky]

That is exactly what I am wanting help with. What do you think is the best way to go with what I have there? I am thinking that a compromise position might be some sort of stove that could run open with a screen. This way I would be more efficient than an open fireplace, but if the wife and I wanted to put a bistro table and eat in front of the sound we could. In the real cold efficiency. In the spring and fall a few dinner type fires with sound. Thoughts?

 

[begreen]

I'm not sure what would fit. What is the height, width and depth of the fireplace?

 

[Pattonky]

I believe it to be approximately 27" x 27" x 18".

 

[Pattonky]

I keep looking at possibilities. Based on what I have set out above what would be anyone's thoughts on a Jotul f100 set in that spot? Would this be doable? Concerns? Things to look at? Help....

 

[Ashful]

Lots of folks seem to put a particular Buck stove in those L-shaped fireplaces. I’m sure begreen knows the model, I cannot remember now.

I love that fireplace, BTW. Totally modern, versus what I’ve always owned, but I love it. That architect had good taste, even tho his style and period was very different from that I usually enjoy.

 

[jetsam]

Open fireplaces and efficient heaters are mutually exclusive groups. (To anyone who wants to talk about putting glass in front of the fireplace, the efficiency of that is not even close to that of a bad wood stove, and also the side of his fireplace is wide open.) There are some wood stoves that are designed to allow burning with an open door (Jotul Oslo, for example), but you are sacrificing the warmth of the house and the efficiency of the stove if you burn it that way.

Just going from that one photo- that wooden storage thing could be a problem. If you like it there, I might take off the granite top, repurpose the wood, build a masonary version, and put the granite back on.

Otherwise, that looks like a nice spot for a small wood stove assuming there's no hidden issues (such as the fireplace being verneerstone hung on wooden studs with no air gap).

 

[Simonkenton]

I agree with ashful, that is a beautiful fireplace. Obviously a far different design from my fireplace, seen at left, but I think it looks great.

The throat damper is broken? Is it gone? You gotta get some kind of damper in that chimney or you are losing massive heat going up the chimney.

 

[RobbieB]

A small insert will fit in there and the bonus is the side access will make it easier to install. 6 inch flue liner and block off plate and no damper needed.

 

[Pattonky]

I agree with ashful, that is a beautiful fireplace. Obviously a far different design from my fireplace, seen at left, but I think it looks great.

The throat damper is broken? Is it gone? You gotta get some kind of damper in that chimney or you are losing massive heat going up the chimney.

Damper is present and inoperative. There is water damage and sweep says it will have to come out as it is past point of repair. The other side of the wall in that picture looks exactly the same, ledge stone. I want to do the best I can by this fireplace area and that is why I am looking for help.

 

[Pattonky]

Why would you pick an insert versus a small stove?

I know it is inefficient, but I would like to be able to hear the fire now and again when I am not really after the heat so much. Maybe in front of the fire having a meal with the wife for example. The picture doesn't really show it, by the small area is quite cozy. The area is maybe 8x8' with a bench to sit on.

 

[RobbieB]

You could also do a stove, they are a little taller but you get the ash pan which is nice. With 27 inches of vertical space it could work too.

You will still hear the crackle of wood if it crackles.

 

[begreen]

I keep looking at possibilities. Based on what I have set out above what would be anyone's thoughts on a Jotul f100 set in that spot? Would this be doable? Concerns? Things to look at? Help....

The little Jotul would easily fit. It's a small stove that takes just a few 14-16" wood pieces so this would just be mostly for chill chasing and ambience.

There are several inserts that would fit. Without surround they would essentially be black boxes. If the desire is not to see the insert side then a side wall could be added to the fireplace. I looked at the Buck 74 but it is about 5/8" too wide. The Buck 21 would be an easy fit.

It would be good to take out the tape measure and get exact dimensions if the fit is going to be close. Then try to decide on the visual look you'd like to achieve and style stove that is most appealing. Also decide on whether the goal is for occasional heating, but mostly for ambience or more for 24/7 burning and heating. And last, the 10' chimney is going to be an issue for many stoves. Stick to those that have shorter flue requirements or are known to be easy breathing stoves or the chimney height will need to be extended.

While investigating, get the current chimney throat dimensions. The new stove will need an insulated 6" liner for the short chimney.

 

[HomeinPA]

Just brainstorming here but....

If it were mine and I could do what I wanted to do..... I'd remove the bottom row of firebrick from the entire "hearth" and replace it with 2 or 3" thick hearthstone or limestone slab and secure it in place. You could also form and pour concrete but that probably wouldn't look nearly as nice. I would lay the stone so that I had a small overhang along the front edge all the way to the wall, 4" give or take. That would be to allow the depth needed for the stove. Remove the damper and frame completely and then install a Hampton H201 or H205 with the short leg kit along with the required liner and components. Good stove, looks good.... won't cook you out of the room and would be very efficient.

Oh, and get rid of the wood storage box in front of the fireplace. It's a fire hazard.

 

[Pattonky]

I have spoken to the boss, wife, same person, and she says an insert is the way she wants to go for keeping with the architecture. I am going to be in the house on Thursday for the inspection/smoke test and I will get solid measurements at that time. I saw a pacific coast neo insert that looked like it could be a candidate if it will fit. We can certainly do something with the cabinet piece as a fire hazard. I will report back with solid measurements and the results of the test/inspection. I appreciate all of the input to this point!

 

[RobbieB]

An insert will look very nice in there and having a blower means you can cover it up too. You'll have to make a custom surround, but that shouldn't be too hard as that post will help with support.

Hope all goes well with the inspection. Ask the inspector for his ideas too while he's there.

 

[HomeinPA]

Mama ain't happy, nobody gonna be happy!

When you say "insert" do you mean a fireplace insert that is contained inside the firebox with a surround or a hearth stove "insert" installation similar to above? A traditional fireplace insert with surround doesn't seem feasible with one open side and no hearth extension. IMHO

 

[HomeinPA]

Of course, with the proper incentive, anything can be accomplished.

 

[begreen]

I have spoken to the boss, wife, same person, and she says an insert is the way she wants to go for keeping with the architecture. I am going to be in the house on Thursday for the inspection/smoke test and I will get solid measurements at that time. I saw a pacific coast neo insert that looked like it could be a candidate if it will fit. We can certainly do something with the cabinet piece as a fire hazard. I will report back with solid measurements and the results of the test/inspection. I appreciate all of the input to this point!

I thought of the Neo, but at 29.5" even the smaller Neo 16 insert is too wide. Otherwise a PE or Enviro insert would probably be a good candidate. They are more easy breathing stoves. The PE Vista insert and Enviro Kodiak 1200 would fit. For a contemporary look the Regency Alterra 1250 is only 22" wide, but I don't know how that would perform on a short chimney.

 

[begreen]

Just brainstorming here but....

If it were mine and I could do what I wanted to do..... I'd remove the bottom row of firebrick from the entire "hearth" and replace it with 2 or 3" thick hearthstone or limestone slab and secure it in place. You could also form and pour concrete but that probably wouldn't look nearly as nice. I would lay the stone so that I had a small overhang along the front edge all the way to the wall, 4" give or take. That would be to allow the depth needed for the stove. Remove the damper and frame completely and then install a Hampton H201 or H205 with the short leg kit along with the required liner and components. Good stove, looks good.... won't cook you out of the room and would be very efficient.

Oh, and get rid of the wood storage box in front of the fireplace. It's a fire hazard.

Good suggestion but I would go with the larger H300 with the short leg kit. This stove is an easy breather and comes in at about 24" high with the shorter legs.

 

[yooper08]

Have you given any thought to putting a free standing stove in the corner of the masonry vented into the existing chimney? You could still leave the fireplace intact to put the day’s wood and what not.

 

[shoot-straight]

A Jøtul Black bear? Its long and thin?

 

[Mark8]

You said you like a wood burning fireplace just for the ambience not necessarily the heat, is there anyway to bring it up to code returning it to a wood burning fireplace and just have sliding spark screens, and that way you can preserve the architecture. It sounds like you would only be using it occasionally for pleasure.

 

[Pattonky]

You said you like a wood burning fireplace just for the ambience not necessarily the heat, is there anyway to bring it up to code returning it to a wood burning fireplace and just have sliding spark screens, and that way you can preserve the architecture. It sounds like you would only be using it occasionally for pleasure.

Yes, I have thought about this quite a bit. The more I read, the more I know how inefficient this is and that is not appealing. At the same time if the draw is adequate and the flue is in good shape then I do wonder about getting top damper installed and using it only occasionally for that ambiance fire and architecture retention. This is another reason I decided to post this stuff and get some feedback on what to do. I am torn and may seek counseling, haha!