Where to put the stove?

[gypsy-spirit]

Ok, here's the situation. As per my first post, we have a doublewide rancher with a full unfinished basement (with a chimney already installed). So I was doing the research, and apparently the basement may not really be the best location because:

1. it is unfinished and I won't have the funds to finish it for at least a year or 2
2. the existing chimney is located on the exterior and is made of block with a ceramic liner (I don't know if it's insulated or not, but it needs another 18 inches to adhere to the 2-3-10 rule, and it isn't covered either)

So, the next option would be to put it in the livingroom which would mean having to install a brand new chimneypipe through the ceiling

Pros:
1. I'm more likely to spend time with the fire in our main living area
2. The heat would be located in the most-used area of the home instead of having to be piped up

Cons:
1. More mess in the living area
2. The basement would be cold and damp.. not conducive to spending ANY time down there in the winter months..

Either way we'll have chimney work that needs to be done.. As for wood useage.. we'd probably use 8-10 cords heating both levels, and 4-6 heating the upstairs

The other consideration: If we put the stove upstairs, I'll go with a Woodstock Fireview (1560 sq.feet to heat), if we put it in the basement I'll have to go with the HearthStone that's rated for 3000+ sq. feet.

 

[Dakotas Dad]

Your basement is unfinished, and at least for now, unused? So waiting to put heat down there changes nothing.

My plan would be: put a stove upstairs now. Later, when finishing the basement, add a small second stove down there, since you already have a chimney, and use that stove when the basement is used. Once your basement is finished and insulated, it won't take much to heat it. ecspecialy if you finish it with an "open" floorplan. And I think if you go with a big honking stove down there and try to heat the far reaches of the upstairs with it, you won't like being down there where the stove is at much.

 

[gypsy-spirit]

Thanks for the prompt reply!.. Just to clarify, we have just bought the house (haven't moved in yet), so I'm in the projecting/planning phase for how the home will be used. But you're right, the basement in our current home just sits there, cold and damp.. but it doesn't have the potential that the new home's has.

That does sound like a reasonable idea.. any other points of view?

 

[begreen]

How is the new house heated? If it is forced hot air, perhaps consider an add-on wood furnace?

If a big woodstove was put in the basement, what natural, existing convective path(s) are there for the heat to get up to the 1st floor? If none, then having a second stove does make sense, especially once the walls are insulated, if the basement is more for occasional use on weekends. If there is a wide, centrally located stairwell, then perhaps the house can be heated by wood from the basement. But usually this is not an ideal situation, especially in a house that is more horizontal, than vertical.

Regarding wood consumption, I wouldn't be surprised if it ended up half of the upper estimates unless the place is poorly insulated. But be sure to get the wood drying now.

 

[gypsy-spirit]

There is an oil furnace that *probably* works. The inspector turned it on and it pushed air, but no heat was forthcoming.. so it could be out of oil, or it needs to be fixed. Either way, this will be the backup source to the woodstove. I thought about a wood furnace, but I guess I'm a romantic.. if I've got to go through all the trouble of firewood, I want to be able to see/enjoy the flames.

As for the floorplan, its pretty open.. the kitchen/dining/living areas are in the middle of the home with the master bedroom on one side and 2 other bedrooms on the other. The stairs to the basement go down from the kitchen, and there is an open floor grate in the dining room that opens directly to the basement (it's an opening about 1ftx2ft) All the rooms have small vents/ductwork that the furnace feeds into.

On that note, however, there could be another option, I suppose.. I saw somewhere (don't remember the brand now) there is a wood/oil furnace that has glass on the side for flame-viewing. There wouldn't be room upstairs for a wood furnace room (they have to be pretty big, right?).. but maybe downstairs...

At any rate, my budget is $5000 TOPS (stove, installation, chimney, etc), I'm actually hoping that figure will get the wood for a year as well.

 

[begreen]

There is an oil furnace that *probably* works. The inspector turned it on and it pushed air, but no heat was forthcoming.. so it could be out of oil, or it needs to be fixed. Either way, this will be the backup source to the woodstove. I thought about a wood furnace, but I guess I'm a romantic.. if I've got to go through all the trouble of firewood, I want to be able to see/enjoy the flames.

As for the floorplan, its pretty open.. the kitchen/dining/living areas are in the middle of the home with the master bedroom on one side and 2 other bedrooms on the other. The stairs to the basement go down from the kitchen, and there is an open floor grate in the dining room that opens directly to the basement (it's an opening about 1ftx2ft) All the rooms have small vents/ductwork that the furnace feeds into.

On that note, however, there could be another option, I suppose.. I saw somewhere (don't remember the brand now) there is a wood/oil furnace that has glass on the side for flame-viewing. There wouldn't be room upstairs for a wood furnace room (they have to be pretty big, right?).. but maybe downstairs...

At any rate, my budget is $5000 TOPS (stove, installation, chimney, etc), I'm actually hoping that figure will get the wood for a year as well.

It sounds like there may be no return duct to the furnace, if so, the inspector should have pointed this out. Sucking the return air through an unheated and uninsulated basement is not a great plan for keeping the oil bill down. You'll definitely want to investigate this further and get the oil furnace in good working order. It will be good to have the furnace working properly in case you get sick, injured, go on a vacation, run out of wood, or want to keep the pipes warm to avoid freeze up.

The furnace with a view is the Caddy: http://www.woodstoves.net/psg/caddy.htm . Good unit and EPA approved so it qualifies for the tax credit.

If money is tight, but the plan is to definitely finish the basement, I would be installing an Englander 30NC in the basement and put the savings into tightening up the place and starting on insulating the basement. But if that project is a long way off, then a nice stove in the living room should cover you. Try to locate the stove centrally so that the flue system can be as tall as possible and heat distributes well.

 

[SteveKG]

There is something to be said, regardless of floor-plan and heat distribution, to having the stove in the main living area. Simply for enjoyment. Then buy a small [and perhaps modest] stove for the basement. You would not have to heat that area all the time, just when you want to spend time down there. Or whatever. No problem with getting the heat up the stairs, etc. I realize this means an additional stovepipe. If you are planning to stay there for some time, it might be well worth it. If you cannot let go of the funds for this now, put the main stove upstairs and begin to watch for a good, used, small stove for downstairs.

Or, that's what I would be thinking. I've been heating 100% with wood since 1975, and in both the homes I've had the wood stove became the central point of gathering/sitting/reading/relaxing/sometimes eating and not by design but simply naturally.

I must admit I don't know what a double-wide rancher is, so perhaps my suggestion isn't appropriate.

 

[Todd]

I also agree with installing the stove on the main floor and then you can wait a couple years to finish off the basement and add a stove down there as well. Heating 3000 sq ft from a basement wood stove doesn't work well, I've tried years ago in a double wide ranch in upper MI. Ended up installing two stoves and the propane never came on after that. One stove on each level or a wood furnace would be best options.

 

[laynes69]

If you want even heat through the whole home then I would consider a woodfurnace also. The Caddy isn't a bad looking furnace. It puts out a nice light show and burns cleanly. But like Begreen said, things would have to be setup properly with your current central furnace before considering that idea. You would probably be around the 5 cord mark with a caddy, maybe a little less. One thing nice about a furnace they don't care where they are installed. With a fully insulated air jacket they push the heat where needed. Plus you get some radiant heat from the front of the furnace. Otherwise, you may need 2 stoves. I personally would rather load one and heat the whole home. Is your furnace upstairs? If so installing a woodfurnace may not work unless it was installed as a standalone with new ductwork. That would increase the cost a bit.

 

[madison]

Another negative for the basement, carrying wood down the stairs if the ranch does not have a walkout....

 

[gypsy-spirit]

A doublewide is a manufactured (mobile) home that happens to come in 2 pieces (making it double the width of a regular mobile home).. and it is a ranch-style (I guess.. 1 story anyway)

The oil furnace is actually upstairs in a teeny tiny closet in the kitchen.. not big enough for the wood/oil combo. We didn't really see the cold air return.. so I guess its just drawing air from the kitchen area. My guess is the previous occupants removed the cold air ductwork (the large register in the dining area) because that is directly above where they had a big woodstove in the basement (and they put a little plug-in fan above the woodstove to blow the heat up into the dining area). Of course the air return could be drawing from the basement then as well. With the furnace inside that closet, it made it a little hard to see where exactly the cold air return was located (and by that time I think the inspector and I both forgot to look for it!)

There actually is a walk-out from the basement, though it has some stairs (not as bad as from the kitchen though). The # of stairs to traverse either direction will be about the same, and wood storage could be equally convenient (there is a front covered porch where I could store a week's worth of wood for the livingroom).

It sounds like the general concensus is I should put the nice stove upstairs, then when we finish the basement put another small one down there. The more I think about it, the better sense that makes

I will price out the oil/wood combo though, in case the oil furnace doesn't work at all, we'll need to go that route. (Unless I did something totally different.. maybe put a propane stove upstairs that could be set on a thermostat for those times I can't deal with the wood...

I don't know, maybe I just hate the thought of using oil at all...(pulling hair out) We've had natural gas furnaces forever, and I haven't hardly thought about them (except I can't STAND having the vent blowing up in my face all night (heat or AC).. and with a king sized bed, that's always been the case...

Sorry I'm turning into a raving lunatic.. its just that Woodstock is having a sale right now and so I feel a bunch of pressure to hurry and make a decision..

 

[gypsy-spirit]

Oh, I checked out the link, but it wasn't exactly what I'd been looking at.. it was the Charmaster II.. furnace that takes wood and oil or gas, is a fireplace, and can heat hot water.. pretty nifty! Its a bit out of my proposed budget.. but my budget was thinking about a woodstove only. If the oil furnace needs replacing or major repairs anyway then...

However I didn't see anything on Charmaster's site about the tax credit...

 

[Dakotas Dad]

Sorry I'm turning into a raving lunatic.. its just that Woodstock is having a sale right now and so I feel a bunch of pressure to hurry and make a decision..

Don't panic, they have sales all the time.

 

[Todd]

Sorry I'm turning into a raving lunatic.. its just that Woodstock is having a sale right now and so I feel a bunch of pressure to hurry and make a decision..

Don't panic, they have sales all the time.

You can also put down a $250 refundable deposit to hold the sale price. And then there is the 6 month money back guarantee if you change your mind.

 

[gypsy-spirit]

Thanks everyone for your help. I'll let you know in what direction I decide to go