Why dont stoves come with thermometers?

[Jake]

The manual for my stove
(broken link removed)

specifically states:
"without a thermometer, you are working blindly"


Why not include one as part of the stove?

 

[Shane]

I agree wholeheartedly. I always recommend the thermometer for all wood stoves we sell.

 

[MrGriz]

I agree Jake, this would be helpful.

I ended up buying one of the magnetic ones, which I have sitting on the top of my insert.

Of course, now that I have the thermometer on the stove, I can't find any good data as to what temps I should run at. I'm sure that the reading I'm getting on top of the 'cook top' of my insert is lower than the actual top temp. I also don't know what this might translate to in liner temp. This is all still new to me; I'm sure that in a year or two I just won't worry about it.

Sorry if I'm moving off topic, just had to vent a bit on this one.

 

[wahoowad]

I imagine none provide a thermometer because they all seem to be pieces of crap. I have bought 3 of them, none agree. I use the two that are closest to each other. One responds to heat change slower than the other but both get fairly close after a bit.

I wish Jotul or another quality stove manufacturer would make a reliable thermometer. Heck make it built in.

 

[kevinmoelk]

I absolutely agree Jake. And you'd think that where the manufacturer dropped the ball the hearth dealers would "give" (cost added to stove purchase) every customer a thermometer.

On the manual topic, I've been extremely disappointed with my stove's manual. If it weren't for Hearth, I most likely would not be operating the stove correctly. And being a newbie I still am learning my stove, but at least I have a decent handle on most of the theory.

-Kevin

 

[Martin Strand III]

The manual for my stove
(broken link removed to http://www.napoleonfireplaces.com/Webshare/installation_manuals/EPA.pdf)

specifically states:
"without a thermometer, you are working blindly"


Why not include one as part of the stove?

My guess: The same reason people aren't born with a thermometer.

You put one in when you need to.

Aye,
Marty

 

[Roospike]

< Turning the table >Another thread as so:

Title: "How come VC come with them ugly looking thermometers mounted on the face of the stove ?"

Title#2: "Why does Pacific Energys thermometer that comes with there stove only come in Whorehouse Red?"

Title#3: "Why is Country Stoves thermometer mounted on the face of the stove , would it not be better to be mounted on top?"

Title#4: "I own brand X stove and the thermometer is not accurate and brand X wants $34. for the replacement unit , is there a better option?"

******************************************************************************

With well over 15 years of wood burning under my belt i didnt even use a thermometer the first year on my PE Summit and i ended up getting one just to keep up with the forum talk of stove temps and tho i have one on my stove now i dont "run my stove" off of the thermometer as i run my stove off of the needed heat i need per inside and outside temps. I might look at the thermometer on my stove a few times per week just because its there.

Once you get used to your stove and how it runs best you shouldn't need a thermometer. If you are overfiring and or "banking the stove" ( smoking - under firing ) then you are not used to working your stove and all the variables that have to do with wood / wood type / moisture / outside temps / Stove control and adjustments / ect... ect...

All the EarthStoves came with a thermometer mounted on the top back and most of the thermometers were / are OFF now and also then to the correct temp of the stove top.

 

[velvetfoot]

If you have a window, can't you see what's going on?

 

[MrGriz]

As a newbie to burning in an insert, I want to be sure that I am burning correctly. The manual that came with my insert does virtually nothing to educate on the proper way to burn and control things. I may be over analyzing and putting too much thought into things, but I would like to get it right. Not only do I want to minimize the creation of creosote in the liner, maximize the burn time of my wood, create as little emission as possible, I also don't want to damage the insert in the process.

At this time I am thinking that an accurate thermometer and a guideline of optimum brun temps would be helpful. That way, I could observe what's going on inside the insert at different temps and eventually pay no attention to the thermometer. I guess at this stage in my learning curve it would be a good backup or reference point.

As good an analogy I can come up with at this time is that of a speedometer in a car. When you first learn to drive, you watch it pretty closely. At some point, you stop relying on it so much and only give it a second look when you go flying past a cop taking radar.

 

[velvetfoot]

But the temps are pretty tranistory for a wood heater, no?
You put a few logs on, it gets colder. They catch fire it gets hotter. It dies down and gets colder, etc.
Maybe I should be more concerned, I don't know.

 

[Roospike]

As a newbie to burning in an insert, I want to be sure that I am burning correctly. The manual that came with my insert does virtually nothing to educate on the proper way to burn and control things. I may be over analyzing and putting too much thought into things, but I would like to get it right. Not only do I want to minimize the creation of creosote in the liner, maximize the burn time of my wood, create as little emission as possible, I also don't want to damage the insert in the process.

At this time I am thinking that an accurate thermometer and a guideline of optimum brun temps would be helpful. That way, I could observe what's going on inside the insert at different temps and eventually pay no attention to the thermometer. I guess at this stage in my learning curve it would be a good backup or reference point.

As good an analogy I can come up with at this time is that of a speedometer in a car. When you first learn to drive, you watch it pretty closely. At some point, you stop relying on it so much and only give it a second look when you go flying past a cop taking radar.

Exactly .

I thought i was always the odd ball with my PE Summit stove becuse everyones burn temp on there stove was around 550° and my stove top temp was 450° and less ...................
Well my stove has a thick 3/8" steel top and is showing a lower temp vs most other stoves , So with my temp showing 100° - 150° less than other stoves i still knew i was buring correct even tho it wasn't reading the same .... This week i put the thermometer on the front of the stove and low and behold the stove running as i normally would now shows 550° at the front plate and the top temp is showing 410° , now if i would of run my stove top temp at 550° like most people are saying it should be then i would of been running at about 700° and baking cookies in my front room.

Thermometers have there place but i feel there a bad habit if you let them be. After one builds experence with there stove its a good idea to sway away from the thermometer and run the stove as needed.

 

[Robbie]

Who needs them ? I can tell by looking at my fire what my temp is...........................



The answer to the original question I think would cost, liability, etc.



OK.........I'm stretching the truth a bit, I use one of these below, actually I have 2 now, both on my stove front, work great, could not operate without them.

(broken link removed to http://www.condar.com/meters.html)


Robbie

 

[Roospike]

Thermometers i believe are better served around your home and one out side. When you can see at a glance when the different rooms in your home tempture is and also what the out side temp is and how these temperatures are changing it lets you better to control the stove.

Pictured is the base units of my houses thermometers showing all the different temperatures of different rooms / front - back / up stairs - down stairs / outside temp .
Also showing the wireless thermometer X 6 units.

 

[Roospike]

Who needs them ? I can tell by looking at my fire what my temp is...........................



The answer to the original question I think would cost, liability, etc.



OK.........I'm stretching the truth a bit, I use one of these below, actually I have 2 now, both on my stove front, work great, could not operate without them.

(broken link removed to http://www.condar.com/meters.html)


Robbie

OK , Anyone. Here is a question about stove top thermometers .............

At what tempture does the stove top thermometer need to be when its 32° out side and its 9:00 pm ?

At what tempture does the stove top thermometer need to be when its 40° out side and its 9:00 am ?

At what tempture does the stove top thermometer need to be when its 16° out side and its 11:00 am ?

At what tempture does the stove top thermometer need to be when its 50° out side and its 10:00 pm ?


Do you know the exact #'s the stove top thermometer should be reading ? or are we just running the stove at 550° all the time ?

 

[BrotherBart]

OK , Anyone. Here is a question about stove top thermometers .............

At what tempture does the stove top thermometer need to be when its 32° out side and its 9:00 pm ? Wherever between 450 and seven hundred that I ain't sweating or freezing

At what tempture does the stove top thermometer need to be when its 40° out side and its 9:00 am ? Wherever between 450 and seven hundred that I ain't sweating or freezing

At what tempture does the stove top thermometer need to be when its 16° out side and its 11:00 am ? Wherever between 450 and seven hundred that I ain't sweating or freezing

At what tempture does the stove top thermometer need to be when its 50° out side and its 10:00 pm ? Wherever between 450 and seven hundred that I ain't sweating or freezing


Do you know the exact #'s the stove top thermometer should be reading ? or are we just running the stove at 550° all the time ?

 

[babalu87]

I agree they should be included with stoves or at the least recommended (at the manufacturers request) at the retailer.
Mounting them????
Mine is on the pipe so I am glad it isnt mounted, it would look butt ass.............. like that stove in front of the window.

I use mine so I know when I am making creosote, if you want some its $150 for 2 SQ ft

 

[BrotherBart]

I agree they should be included with stoves or at the least recommended (at the manufacturers request) at the retailer.
Mounting them????
Mine is on the pipe so I am glad it isnt mounted, it would look butt ass.............. like that stove in front of the window.

I use mine so I know when I am making creosote, if you want some its $150 for 2 SQ ft

Is your website (broken link removed)

 

[Roospike]

OK , Anyone. Here is a question about stove top thermometers .............

At what tempture does the stove top thermometer need to be when its 32° out side and its 9:00 pm ? Wherever between 450 and seven hundred that I ain't sweating or freezing

At what tempture does the stove top thermometer need to be when its 40° out side and its 9:00 am ? Wherever between 450 and seven hundred that I ain't sweating or freezing

At what tempture does the stove top thermometer need to be when its 16° out side and its 11:00 am ? Wherever between 450 and seven hundred that I ain't sweating or freezing

At what tempture does the stove top thermometer need to be when its 50° out side and its 10:00 pm ? Wherever between 450 and seven hundred that I ain't sweating or freezing


Do you know the exact #'s the stove top thermometer should be reading ? or are we just running the stove at 550° all the time ?

Right on BB , So now let me ask ..........can you or can you not tell when the stove is underfiring and overfiring without the thermometer? ( smoky idle vs INFERNO)

 

[BrotherBart]

It has been useful starting out with a newer technology stove but before long it will be back to eyeballing it.

How much of using it has come from all of the talk here about temps and how much was parinoia from Ole Brownie running away on me I don't know.

 

[Roospike]

It has been useful starting out with a newer technology stove but before long it will be back to eyeballing it.

How much of using it has come from all of the talk here about temps and how much was parinoia from Ole Brownie running away on me I don't know.

So would you agree that with experence ( 4 months or 40 years ) the "need" for a stove thermometer is not needed and is not a priority to running a wood stove.

 

[BrotherBart]

It has been useful starting out with a newer technology stove but before long it will be back to eyeballing it.

How much of using it has come from all of the talk here about temps and how much was parinoia from Ole Brownie running away on me I don't know.

So would you agree that with experence ( 4 months or 40 years ) the "need" for a stove thermometer is not needed and is not a priority to running a wood stove.

Agreed. It isn't a priority. Handy, not a priority. Since I have temp monitors for all three floors of the house and outside, why not know how hot or cold the stove is? Now if they would just make a remote one.

 

[PacificGuyInCNY]

I know about thermometer placement on a stove, but what would you recommend for an insert? I know about the center-vs-side argument - that center will be sensitive to the secondary burn - but there still seem to be a number of different opinions out there. My Summit (and I think most other inserts) don't leave you with a whole lot of options (see below). Is it possible to get a remote flue sensor to read pipe temperature like on a stove?

 

[MrGriz]

Roo, I agree with you 100%. I'm sure that by this time next year, I'll just be looking at the thermometer once in a while out of curiosity. I do think that it's a valuable aid in learning what's going on now though.

I think we are talking about using it in a different way though. I'm not concerned with what top temp I need when its 40 outside at 9:00am or 28 outside at 10:15. If I'm cold, I want a hotter fire; if I'm warm I'll let her burn down a bit and not throw in so much wood. What I'm more concerned about is not overfiring when I'm trying to crank up the heat and not running a creosote factory when I'm warm.

With time, I'll be able to gauge this by the look of the fire, the sounds the insert is making, the type and quantity of wood I'm using and a host of other clues I'm already starting to pick up on. Until then, I'll throw the temp reading into the mix.

 

[MrGriz]

PacificGuy, I have the same problem with my insert. The Osburn bay window gives me really no place to put the thermometer on the front. I currently have it sitting on top of the 'cook top', in the center. Since this area is separated from the fire box by an air gap (where the blower circulates) I'm sure that the temp is not an accurate reading of what the top actually is running at. It does give me a benchmark though.

 

[Roospike]

I know about thermometer placement on a stove, but what would you recommend for an insert? I know about the center-vs-side argument - that center will be sensitive to the secondary burn - but there still seem to be a number of different opinions out there. My Summit (and I think most other inserts) don't leave you with a whole lot of options (see below). Is it possible to get a remote flue sensor to read pipe temperature like on a stove?

If i were you i would just put it above your door off to the side and go from there .

When the front ( in the middle) thermometer reading showed 700° on mine the top was around 550° if that helps you out.

The front reading changes faster and gets hotter then does the top temp on the monsters.
I assume your looking for max heat with out overfiring per the thermometer ?