Will a Jotul F602V2 work for this 500 sf space? Pics included. Any other options?

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fabsroman

Minister of Fire
Jun 1, 2011
1,082
West Friendship, Maryland
I have a 40' wide x 28' deep detached garage with an upstairs living area and the equivalent of 2 garage bays on the main level as "living space". I use the space on the bottom level as my main office for work and I use the upstairs area as a conference area, small kitchen, and file storage. I want to put a wood stove in the lower level where I spend most of my time. That area is about 500 sf and it has 12 foot ceilings. Two years ago, I bought a Woodstock Ideal Steel Hybrid stove. I was looking to have it installed in my office now and I am thinking that the stove is just way too large for the area it needs to heat. My wife and I have agreed that the Woodstock will most likely be better in the 2,200 sf basement of the house and that a smaller stove would work better for my office.

So, what would you guys recommend wood stove wise for my office space? I can circulate the air from the main level to the upper level with the air handler/HVAC. Just looking not to freeze to death this winter and not to use too much propane to heat my office.

Thanks
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
91,301
South Puget Sound, WA
How well insulated is this space? Is there an exposed concrete floor or has an insulation pad been laid down, then carpet? Is there an open stairwell that the heat can easily convect to the conference room from the lower level? If yes, then it's more like 1000 sq ft that will be heated. In that case, I would look at stoves in the 2 cu ft range. There are many so it will come down to budget, looks, desirable features, and availability.
 

fabsroman

Minister of Fire
Jun 1, 2011
1,082
West Friendship, Maryland
How well insulated is this space? Is there an exposed concrete floor or has an insulation pad been laid down, then carpet? Is there an open stairwell that the heat can easily convect to the conference room from the lower level? If yes, then it's more like 1000 sq ft that will be heated. In that case, I would look at stoves in the 2 cu ft range. There are many so it will come down to budget, looks, desirable features, and availability.
The entire floor is stamped concrete in green to look like porcelain tiles. No padding, no carpet, no wood. The stove will be resting on a 6" concrete slab. The stove will be in the back of the office space and the stairwell to go up to the conference room is in the front of the office space right by the front door. The entire area is well insulated. I am not too worried about the upstairs area receiving any of the heat from the stove. The conference area is only used occasionally and I am thinking about using the fan/heat pump/propane furnace to heat that are whenever I know I have a meeting that will require the use of that area. As far as budget is concerned, that really isn't an issue. I am not looking for a gold plated stove, but I can afford every stove I have looked at, big or small. Anything between $1,500 and $3,500 is fine.

I have been looking at the Jotul F 602V2, Pacific Energy Alderlea T4 LE, and Blaze King Sirocco 20.2. I really like the burn time of the Sirocco 20.2 on low. I could leave it on low all night long and then just add wood in the morning when I commute the 45 feet from the house to the office.

I have been looking at stoves for 10+ years now and Jotul and Blaze King were always in the running and discussion. This is the first time I have ever heard of Pacific Energy.
 

fabsroman

Minister of Fire
Jun 1, 2011
1,082
West Friendship, Maryland
Pics of my office space and the Woodstock Soapstone Ideal Steel Hybrid that will be getting relocated to the house basement at this point. Just way too much stove for this area. Initial though on buying the Woodstock was that I would put a fan between the finished area of the garage and the 2 garage bays for the vehicles so I could work in there in comfort. Two years later, I realize I do not want to smell the garage in the office, and I don't want my clients dealing with that smell either. In the pic of the office, you can see the woodstove in the back left. To the right in that pic is the front door to the office and you can see the door to the stairway leading upstairs. When the woodstove is not running, the finished area of the garage will be heated by a HVAC system, which has been set at 50 degrees for heating.

20211029_121901.jpg 20211029_121934.jpg 20211029_121953.jpg
 

fabsroman

Minister of Fire
Jun 1, 2011
1,082
West Friendship, Maryland
I started a thread about this a couple days ago, but have not received any recommendations or advice yet. Essentially, I have a 500 sf office space in a detached garage. There is about 1,100 sf of finished space upstairs too, but that space will only be used intermittently as a conference room area. The finished space in the entire garage is climate controlled with a heat pump/propane furnace and will never drop below 50 degrees (i.e., where we have the thermostat set right now). Looking to heat the main area, that is pictured, with wood.

I have talked to a couple of stove installers/retailers and over the phone they have told me that a medium sized stove will be way too much for the area I am describing. Thing is, they did not have pics to see the area. I am attaching pics of my office space. Main pic shows the stove alcove in the back with the Woodstock Soapstone Ideal Steel Hybrid stove there. That stove is most likely too large for the area and it will get getting moved to the basement of our house. Initially thought I would use the Woodstock stove to heat the office space and the 2 garage bays just on the other side of the wall. Was going to install a fan in the wall, but then decided I did not want the smell of the garage in my office space. I have two kerosene heaters for the garage and that will be just fine. The front door, which is pictured, has a doorway that leads to the staircase for upstairs. It is just to the right of where I took the main pic from.

Wondering if the Jotul F602V2 will heat this space adequately and not run me out of the room sweating. Are there any other stove options that I am overlooking here? I have a lead for the Jotul, which is in stock, for $1,249. I am about to pull the trigger on it, but figured I would see if I can get any confirmation that it will work, or advice that it will not work for this space.

I know the chimney in the pic is a disaster and that is something that will be taken care of.

20211029_121901.jpg 20211029_121934.jpg 20211029_121953.jpg
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
91,301
South Puget Sound, WA
Responded in other post. No need for redundant postings. This title is better though. Merging.

The pictures show that the stove is being installed in an alcove. The brings on new rules for clearances for this installation. What is the construction of the alcove? Is it standard stud covered with drywall?

Some of the heat will go upstairs regardless unless the stairwell has a door that closes it off. The F602v2 is not a close clearance stove. This will be a deciding factor. What is the alcove ceiling height and width?
 
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Todd

Minister of Fire
Nov 19, 2005
9,500
NW Wisconsin
I think the Jotul 602 would work out fine but expect to feed it every 4-7 hours, it has a very small fire box.

I kind a like your idea of the Blaze King better, you would have more control and a good consistent overnight burn.
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
91,301
South Puget Sound, WA
I should note that the alcove requirements could be avoided by moving the stove forward of the alcove recess. In that case, the Jotul or a Morso 2B, or VC Aspen C3 would suffice. I am assuming the fire would only be lit during office hours. I would start the fire at least an hour or two before using the office unless it is kept at a reasonable minimum 60º by the primary heating system.
 

fabsroman

Minister of Fire
Jun 1, 2011
1,082
West Friendship, Maryland
Responded in other post. No need for redundant postings. This title is better though. Merging.

The pictures show that the stove is being installed in an alcove. The brings on new rules for clearances for this installation. What is the construction of the alcove? Is it standard stud covered with drywall?

Some of the heat will go upstairs regardless unless the stairwell has a door that closes it off. The F602v2 is not a close clearance stove. This will be a deciding factor. What is the alcove ceiling height and width?
Alcove is 75" wide and 78" high. The back wall of the alcove is cementious backerboard like Hardi, but it is wood studs behind it. The top is drywall with wood studs. No idea what is on the left or right side since it is covered and I cannot see it from the back. The alcove is just barely over 12" deep because the flat ceiling support box from Duratech fits snugly in the joists. I will be installing a heatshield on the back wall by floating tin ceiling tiles an inch off of the wall. Will be using 1/2" copper pipe, cut 1" long, as spacers behind the ceiling tiles. The side walls to the alcove will not have a heat shield unless absolutely necessary. The heat shield in the rear will be 72" by 72". That will leave me a little over an inch on each side and I will have the shield about an inch off the floor with a larger gap at the top. I looked over the Jotul manual for this stove just briefly and it looks like it will work. The alcove example in the manual has a 24" depth on the top portion of the alcove, which is nearly twice the depth of mine. Going to spend some more time now looking through the manual, but an additional set of eyes would be welcome.

If the top of the alcove needs to be raised, I can do this somewhat easily since it is accessible from the mechanical room. I could frame it up and put cementious backer board all over. Could even install metal studs if need be. Would not be fun, but none of this ever is until the job is done and the stove is lit and heating the area.

I have somebody coming out on November 18th to give me an estimate on doing the chimney work and installing the stove, but they do not sell Jotul. Everything they sell is too large to put in this area according to them. Now, if I could get away with a stove with a longer burn time, that would be ideal, but I am not sure that will be the case. Would really like the Blaze King with the 20 hour burn time (i.e., Sirocco 20.2), but the two people I spoke to on the phone said it would be way too much.

The stairwell to upstairs does have a door and it is usually closed, but I could leave it open too.
 

weatherguy

Minister of Fire
Feb 20, 2009
5,868
Central Mass
I would think the BK or the smaller Woodstock would work, you could burn low and sloe with either one.
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
91,301
South Puget Sound, WA
Everything they sell is too large to put in this area according to them.
What brands do they sell? A BK Sirocco 20 would not be too much stove. It can run lower than some of the stoves considered. But that may be with continually black glass until it gets below freezing outside.
Alcove is 75" wide and 78" high.
The Jotul F602v2 requires a 96" high alcove ceiling. The VC Aspen C3 requires 63". The BK Sirocco 20 needs 72" and Morso forgot to include ceiling height requirements. :rolleyes:
 
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wjohn

Member
Jul 27, 2021
166
KS
I was going to mention the Vermont Castings Aspen C3. I just got one and installed it, and it hasn't been below freezing here yet so I haven't had much of a fire in it. I can't vouch for it yet. Some folks have had issues with VC stoves in recent history and it has changed owners and the Aspen has gone through a redesign. The Aspen does have a 50% larger firebox than the Jotul F602V2.

I have some pictures in my thread linked below and you can see it's pretty small. As begreen has mentioned you can go pretty tight with clearances per the manual. Personally I have no experience with the Jotul, but I'm not sure I would want to deal with a firebox smaller than the one in my Aspen. The Jotul was 8+ weeks out to my local dealer and did not qualify for the tax credit, and the Aspen C3 was in stock (got lucky and the dealer had 3 that he had ordered months before finally show up) and is efficient enough to qualify for the credit. However I see they are showing "temporarily unavailable" on VC's website right now.

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/2021-vermont-castings-aspen-c3-install.188736/
 

fabsroman

Minister of Fire
Jun 1, 2011
1,082
West Friendship, Maryland
What brands do they sell? A BK Sirocco 20 would not be too much stove. It can run lower than some of the stoves considered. But that may be with continually black glass until it gets below freezing outside.

The Jotul F602v2 requires a 96" high alcove ceiling. The VC Aspen C3 requires 63". The BK Sirocco 20 needs 72" and Morso forgot to include ceiling height requirements. :rolleyes:
They sell a bunch of different brands in pellet and gas stoves. However, the only wood stoves that they sell are Pacific Energy and Blaze King. The lady I spoke to advised against the Blaze Kings in the 20 size range because she said it would just be way too much heat for the space. Granted, she did not have pics of my office space. I can always leave the door to upstairs open and I can use the fan on the HVAC system to move the heated air around to the upper level to a degree. One of the return registers for the HVAC system is right above where the stove would be going. Had been planning on installing a Nest thermostat in here. So, I could just move that thermostat up in the planning process and use the fan programming to get the fan to run on a certain schedule (i.e., when I am in the office). I really like the Blaze King Sirocco 20.2. Along with the front door to this office, there is a crappy 60" window on the front wall and a second door on the backside leading from the pool area to the bathroom, and I can see some daylight on that door on the very bottom. Think I am going to wait for the estimator to come out on the 18th and discuss all of this with him.

The woman I spoke to yesterday also said I can purchase any stove I want, have it delivered to me or them, and they would install it regardless. She recommended the Jotul 602. Just not sure I like that stove and the short burn times.
 

stoveliker

Minister of Fire
Nov 17, 2019
2,805
Long Island NY
Can that Jotul output less BTU per hour than the Sirocco? I'd be surprised.

The return vent could be an issue, being (too?) close to the stove.
 

fabsroman

Minister of Fire
Jun 1, 2011
1,082
West Friendship, Maryland
Can that Jotul output less BTU per hour than the Sirocco? I'd be surprised.

The return vent could be an issue, being (too?) close to the stove.
Return vent is up by the ceiling and to the right of where the stove would be. How do you see it being an issue? Is it an issue with the HVAC operation or with the operation of the stove? If it is an issue, I can always put a magnetic cover over it during the winter.

The more I think about it, the more the Sirocco seems to be the answer. Of course, I might be biased in that I like the way the Sirocco looks and the ability it would give me to regulate the amount of heat via the thermostat. When I asked a salesman at another place if the Jotul 602 would be enough or too much, he said I could put, 1, 2, 3, or 6 pieces in it. Like a moron, I asked him, "Pieces of what?" The answer hit me a split second before he replied with "Wood". I also really like the burn time of the Sirocco compared to the Jotul 602.
 

stoveliker

Minister of Fire
Nov 17, 2019
2,805
Long Island NY
I'll let others comment on the Jotul as I am not familiar with that stove. Small, shorter fires are possible, buy you'll see larger temperature swings (fire, coals, no fire cycles).

The return can cause under pressure issues if too close to the stove (leading to gases coming out of the inlet of the stove, especially in warmer weather or lower stove burning rates). Also, IF the stove leaks e.g. CO you'd be spreading that through out the building. I believe it needs to be at least 10 ft away.

Regardless, have working CO and smoke detectors, of course.
 

fabsroman

Minister of Fire
Jun 1, 2011
1,082
West Friendship, Maryland
Had a guy come out today and give me an estimate for the install of a wood stove. He is recommending a Regency F1500 hybrid catalytic stove for the office space I want to heat. Looks like it is about the right size for the space at 600 to 1,500 sf heating capacity. The clearances on it are pretty good too. What do you guys think?
 

fabsroman

Minister of Fire
Jun 1, 2011
1,082
West Friendship, Maryland
What about the Regency Classic F1150 stove that does not have a catalytic converter? Think my debate right now is between the Regency Cascade F1500 (with catalytic converter) and the Regency Classic F1150 (without catalytic converter). Estimate for installing the Regency Cascade F1500 is $2,664 for the stove and $3,414 for the pipe and install. So, $6,078 total all said and done with the Regency Cascade F1500.
 

EbS-P

Minister of Fire
Jan 19, 2019
1,708
SE North Carolina
Does the cat version qualify for the tax credit?
 

fabsroman

Minister of Fire
Jun 1, 2011
1,082
West Friendship, Maryland
Does the cat version qualify for the tax credit?
On this install, the tax credit is irrelevant for me. It is going into my office space and I will deduct the cost of installation and the cost of the stove. My marginal tax rate is 48.7% for 2021 between federal, FICA/medicare, state, and county and there is no way I am going to eclipse the FICA ceiling to lower it significantly, so the deduction is worth more than the 26% tax credit to me.

The cost is almost irrelevant to me too. The Regency Classic F1150 is $2,195 and the Regency Cascade F1500 is $2,664. Somewhere around a $500 cost difference. Thing is, over 20 years that is pretty much insignificant. My main issue is which stove would be better for the space I need to heat, which is about 500 sf, a 1.3 cf stove without a cat or a 1.3 cf stove with a cat.
 

EbS-P

Minister of Fire
Jan 19, 2019
1,708
SE North Carolina
On this install, the tax credit is irrelevant for me. It is going into my office space and I will deduct the cost of installation and the cost of the stove. My marginal tax rate is 48.7% for 2021 between federal, FICA/medicare, state, and county and there is no way I am going to eclipse the FICA ceiling to lower it significantly, so the deduction is worth more than the 26% tax credit to me.

The cost is almost irrelevant to me too. The Regency Classic F1150 is $2,195 and the Regency Cascade F1500 is $2,664. Somewhere around a $500 cost difference. Thing is, over 20 years that is pretty much insignificant. My main issue is which stove would be better for the space I need to heat, which is about 500 sf, a 1.3 cf stove without a cat or a 1.3 cf stove with a cat.
Unless you or someone else can confirm the cat allows yo to run the stove at a lower output I’d probably just got for the non cat version. 1500 is rated at 10 hour vs 8 for the 1150. That’s suggests a lower output to me, but I don’t trust marketing numbers. 1150 Is just more simple operate.
 

Todd

Minister of Fire
Nov 19, 2005
9,500
NW Wisconsin
That $500 cost difference is bigger than you think when you figure cat replacements over 20 years.