wood stove for new 1500 sqft house

[whtoak]

Hello all,

Background on my stove experience: I used to live in an old 1100 square foot farm house that was drafty. I put a smaller Jotul stove in there to heat it (I cannot remember the model of the stove). It was rated up to 1600 square feet. The stove would heat good but only last maybe 6 hours. The best size firewood for it was around 10 inches to 12 inches and split right small. I do not want another small stove like that for heating a house overnight. It really got on my nerves but when I purchased it I did not even look at burn time. I was just trying to buy a stove to fit the right application according to square footage.

I am currently building a brick house that is right at 1500 square feet, 9 ft ceilings. I am putting the wood stove in the middle of the house in my living room/den. I am trying to look at a few stoves but the stove folks around here are still closed up because of the virus. I have talked to two local companies via the phone. After me telling them what I was looking for, Company 1 recommended a Jotul 500. It looks like the one I used to have on steroids with a side load door. I want to like this stove and am leaning toward it (especially the side load). Company 2 recommended a Blaze King Sirocco with the 20 hr burn time. They also recommended a Enerzone Solution 3.5 w/ 10 hr burn time and a Enerzone harmony 2.3 w/ 8 hour burn time. I like the specs on the Blaze King and it is nice and about the same price as the Jotul. The Enerzone was cheaper but the dealer told me it was still a nice stove.

What I am looking for: I want to make sure I buy the right wood stove for this new house. I do not want to have to get up at 3:00 in the morning to start and reload the stove. I want the stove to have an overnight burn so when I get up in the morning all I have to do is load some more firewood to get it going again. I don't want to have to start a fire from scratch as soon as I get up. I had to do this with the smaller Jotul in the farm house and was a pain especially when trying to get ready for work. Since I will be in a new brick house with modern insulation, do I need to have a long burn time? Will the enerzone 8 or 10 hour stove be enough since the house will be new and the heat will last longer? Will the bigger longer burning stoves be too much for a new 1500 square foot house?

I am looking forward to all the professional advice I am about to receive on this forum. Thanks for any and all responses.

 

[Highbeam]

That scirocco with the 20 hour burn time may have been the orphan 20 model. The smarter choice is the 30 model that boasts a 30 hour burn time but has the same heat output low and high capabilities and same footprint. Don’t let that dealer dump a 20 box on you!

My experience with a cat stove in a similar climate but older house is that I only reload once per day. Never get up and load at night. If it’s bitter cold I might throw a few splits in as I walk past it in the morning before going to work. Long burntimes are great!

Can you heat this home with a stove that barely makes it through the night? Sure.

 

[WoodBurnerInWI]

Hello and welcome to the forum!

That is good that you are doing your research. Given that the area you wish to heat has high ceilings and is over 1,000 sq ft, I think getting a stove with a heating area of 2,000 plus feet would serve you well. That would put you in the firebox size range of 2.5 cu ft and up. A firebox that large should easily be able to accommodate 16 in splits and larger and with the larger splits plus larger firebox you should be able to get really good burn times.

The next obvious question is going to be what is the stove being hooked into (stove pipe vs chimney). It sounds like you've talked with some dealers, did their prices include stove plus stove pipe (or chimney liner install) plus labor? Also most modern stoves will require some level of hearth protection so that is another cost you will need to factor in. There are lots of great options for stone, slate, etc pre made hearth pads you can buy (my stove sets on one of the pre built ones made of slate) or building your own if you are handy.

In regards to stoves are you looking mostly at just catalytic stoves or catalytic and non cat stoves? Both have their strengths and weaknesses and there are tons and tons of threads on here that discuss both. Getting a stove from a dealer if he will include it as part of a package that would include stove pipe install and labor is a good deal but you can also order a stove from some online stores and get it shipped to you or to a nearby freight depot.

My stove was purchased from Woodstock Soapstone, a company from New Hampshire that does online only sales. Don't let that scare you, the process of getting one of their stoves is fairly painless and they have a 6 month guarantee on it once you get the stove, which according to the website says, ..."enjoy the radiant, efficient and gentle heat of a Woodstock Soapstone stove in your home for up to six months. If you are not entirely delighted, we will buy the stove back from you for the price you paid. We even cover the cost of the return shipping!..." My stove model is the Ideal Steel, a 3.2 cu ft firebox steel stove that uses hybrid burning technology. My stove operates with both secondary burn tubes and a catalyst at the top of the stove. Both systems work together to give me a super clean burn with a great flame show once the secondary stuff gets going! I average burn times of 12 hrs easily and longer in warmer weather using hardwood. Price wise they are very reasonable and even better there's always a sale going on that usually includes a good discount on the stove price and shipping. They ship using the carrier ABF to a nearby freight depot or they'll ship to a business with a loading dock. The only challenge most people have is getting the stove into their home since most of their models weight well over 500 lbs!

The other stoves you mentioned are all really solid choices too. If getting a stove shipped to you is too big of a hassle and your local dealer offers Blaze King, Jotul etc then that might be the route to go. All the other models you mention will certainly give you the long burn times you desire and if you want crazy long burn times most Blaze King models burn well over 24 hrs on the low setting!

Hopefully this was helpful!

 

[kennyp2339]

BK princess owner here, trust the bk on this one, I heat approx. 1400 sq ft from my basement in NWNJ, its a little colder up here then down in VA, the one big take away that should help steer you in the right direction is the ability to turn the stove down since your climate is warmer, new construction home so your insulated to todays modern codes, and your house is tighter since even new lower end windows are better then premium windows of 25 years ago.
With the BK you can have your normal ragging fire, the stove will act like any other stove that your looking at, 8-10 hr burn, or you can turn the stove down and stretch your burn all the way up to 25-30hrs per load. Some people feel freaked out of about a catalytic stove, they feel as though there's a failure point / to many working parts, the BK's are well engineered and proven work horses, the cat setup is probably one of the best in the market that's available to the public, often it turns into a mute point actually.
Either way, which ever direction you go, one piece of good advise, since the house is still being built, and the stove will be centrally located, run a 4" air fresh air duct from the outside of the home under the floor to the hearth pad, leave it capped and buy what ever stove you please, get the fresh air kit (oak) for the stove and connect to the air duct while installing the stove so your not using house air for your burn which can create a draft on the floor, or worse, create pressure issues within the house and then you get smoke roll out when loading the stove, or sluggish draft issues.

 

[begreen]

Welcome. How well insulated will the house be? That's going to determine the heating needs. Also, what will be the primary heat source (furnace, elect baseboard, heat pump)? If heat pump, will the woodstove only be burning when the temps get colder, like say below 40º, or is the goal to heat exclusively with wood?

 

[Highbeam]

Other than my drivel, these are some of the best, most thorough, responses I’ve read in a long time to a fairly standard question. Good job.

 

[Dix]

Welcome to the Forums !

You've come to the right place

To add to your already spinning head, I think a floor plan, even rough drawn would be of a huge help here. I'm the floor plan gal

 

[whtoak]

Alright, I will try answer the questions some of your have asked.

1. I will have a brick hearth pad sitting on a block of concrete that will be under the house for support. The brick hearth is going to be 5', 4" by 5' 4" and brick all the way up the wall. I think this should be big enough. If not, please let me know!

2. I will be using stove pipe to run up through the roof and have had the estimates priced to include install and stove pipe. I talked with my brick man about putting a flue with brick in the middle and also doing a fireplace with insert. After talking wth him and the stove professionals around my area I decided to go with stove pipe straight out the stove and thru the roof. It is expensive but I did this before in my old house (built a chimney to accommodate the stove on that one instead of stove pipe thru roof). Did I say this is EXPENSIVE. lol Either way you go brick or stove pipe its expensive.

3. As far as insulation, it will be to latest code per the county I will be living in. I know the walls are going to be R-15 value with brick veneer on the outside. I will have to pull the specs to see what the attic and crawl space will be but it will be a lot better than the old farmhouse I lived in.

4. The house will have a heat pump and the wood stove is not the sole source of heat. I will be using wood stove to help offset the heat pump when it gets below 40 degrees. I will be using the stove mostly November thru early March pending on how cold it gets. In Virginia it is usually coldest between late December thru February. Every winter here varies year to year. When it does get real cold 30 degrees during the day and lower at night, I will run the stove all day and night.

5. As far as house plans, I have the stove exactly where I want it. In the middle of the house. The room it is in runs from front to back of house with the living area at the front and the kitchen in the back. One side has the master and the other side has two bedrooms. Basic open plan layout. I don't want the stove directly in the kitchen or the living room so I have put it right in the middle. The area between the kitchen and living/den is basically 16' by 10'. Plenty of room for hearth and stove with a love seat maybe on the adjacent wall from the stove.I will have ceiling fans and will probably use those to move the heat around. Not sure if I need a blower???

I am going to look at a BK stove today. The gentlemen is going to open the showroom up for me for a little while so I can actually see the stove and ask some more questions. I really appreciate everyone that has responded thus far (keep them coming). All make good suggestions and points and gives me thing to think about. I hate making these types of decisions but this is an item I will be using for a LONG time and I want to get it right. I think my biggest concern is having a stove that will make it through the night so I don't have to get up early, early to get the fire going again. I think all of the stoves mentioned so far would heat the house no problem but I really want long burn time.

 

[Highbeam]

When looking at the bk store you should know with freestanding models that there is the princess, the king, and then the 20 and 30 box stoves. The 20 and 30 box stoves are two different fire boxes with three possible outer shells. That’s the sirroco, chinook, and ashford shell. Don’t bother with the 20 box and the king requires an 8” chimney and is huge. Look at the princess or whichever of the three 30 box shells you like the look of the most.

 

[begreen]

Great answers and info. Good for you on locating the stove in the center of the house. Why spend all that money on the hearth though? Many new stoves are ember protection only. A simple veneer of brick will easily suffice for these stoves. Given the house size, location and heat pump backup you have a lot of choices. A good 2 cu ft stove will do what you want. A 3 cu ft stove may be a bit overkill when temps are mild, but they can be run with a partial load of fuel and you have the heat pump for when temps are in the 45-65 range. Your choices are ok, though I would look at some cast iron clad stoves too. These are steel stoves that have a castiron jacket surrounding the steel stove body. This has the advantage of softening the radiant heat from the sides and top. This makes the stove more gently radiant and convective. The advantages are closer clearances, much less room temperature swing and a steady release of heat even after the fire has died down. The Jotul F45 and F55 have this design. Another option is the Pacific Energy T5 or T6. In BK cat stoves it's ok to go for a larger stove. The thermostatic control will regulate the output.

 

[Ashful]

I think all of the stoves mentioned so far would heat the house no problem but I really want long burn time.

Equation: (smaller house * very good insulation)^(southern state) / (long burn times) = Blaze King

There are lots of good stoves on the market, begreen mentioned a few worth checking. But if long burn time is high on your priority list, know that nothing else comes even close to BK for hours per cubic foot. There are a lot of poeple for whom that would not matter, their house needs more heat than the stove will provide on a very low burn rate setting, but you may be their ideal customer with relatively low heat demand.

Note that while the BK 30 is rated to run as low as the BK 20, I have my doubts it can really do it on a completely full stomach, when you have 50% more wood off-gassing. My gut tells me it's really not likely, although I'd love to hear @BKVP weigh in on that.

Also note that many non-cats can easily give overnight burns without any trouble, but maybe not a non-cat as small as you'd want for a well-insulated 1600 sq.ft. house in Virginia, unless you're only sizing the thing for the coldest three weeks in January.

 

[begreen]

Also note that many non-cats can easily give overnight burns without any trouble, but maybe not a non-cat as small as you'd want for a well-insulated 1600 sq.ft. house in Virginia, unless you're only sizing the thing for the coldest three weeks in January.

That is a serious misstatement. A ~2 cu ft stove will work fine for a lot more than just 3 weeks in January. There are many folks here heating their 1600 sq ft homes in New England with ~ 2cu ft stoves. Some will do an easy 8-10 hr burn. Ask folks heating with a T5 or an F45. With the heatpump the user will probably be heating with wood for about 4-5 months depending on the year.

 

[kennyp2339]

That is a serious misstatement. A ~2 cu ft stove will work fine for a lot more than just 3 weeks in January. There are many folks here heating their 1600 sq ft homes in New England with ~ 2cu ft stoves. Some will do an easy 8-10 hr burn. Ask folks heating with a T5 or an F45. With the heatpump the user will probably be heating with wood for about 4-5 months depending on the year.

Yea but your chasing the dragon, to hot, to cold, need to make another fire from scratch, save yourself the heart ache and use the thermostat as designed and add wood when needed, 20hrs per load on a lower setting is a lot of time to figure out if your to cold or not.

 

[Ashful]

That is a serious misstatement. A ~2 cu ft stove will work fine for a lot more than just 3 weeks in January. There are many folks here heating their 1600 sq ft homes in New England with ~ 2cu ft stoves. Some will do an easy 8-10 hr burn. Ask folks heating with a T5 or an F45. With the heatpump the user will probably be heating with wood for about 4-5 months depending on the year.

Yeah, maybe it’s an overstatement of the truth, but the underlying point holds. That point is that his house that may be well-served by a 2 cu.ft. non-cat can be equally well-served by a 3 cu.ft cat having 50% more burn time at the same burn rate. Sorry if I over-stated the point, but as the OP stated burn time was a (or the) primary consideration, it is important to them.

 

[begreen]

Yea but your chasing the dragon, to hot, to cold, need to make another fire from scratch, save yourself the heart ache and use the thermostat as designed and add wood when needed, 20hrs per load on a lower setting is a lot of time to figure out if your to cold or not.

That's also a fallacy. It's not an issue with a properly run and sized cast iron clad stove, same for most soapstone stoves. You fanboys need to give it a rest. You are making statements about which you have no experience.

 

[kennyp2339]

You fanboys need to give it a rest.

Nothing personal here. but its not a fan boy thing bruh, (see I used my Jersey twang) I have a smaller home, before the princess I ran a epa re-burn for 3 years, and before that when I was living at my parents home we had a country canyon insert that was also a tube stove in a 2800 sq ft colonial for 10 years (still in service and is a great stove) hypothetically I've been a wood burner for almost 20 years, I know the routine and have been around both types of stoves for a long while, I prefer the BK, where you choose your heat setting rather then adjust the stove because it gets to hot or its burning to fast, or you want it to make it through the night (chasing the dragon) But to each his own here, I appreciate your input, but please respect mine at the same time.
Steady mid range heat output is way better than a quick rise and mid range freefall, one of the biggest complaints of re-burn soap stone stoves is top end btu output and time length from cold starts until you get warm, cast iron clad stoves are nice but when your paying that kind of money, go with the better tech of something you can have almost infinite adjustments. Then add climate, the OP is building in Virgina US zone 4, but warmer and more volatile side of zone 4, our weather has been whacky for the past 5 years, some cold, but a lot of the storms that have been blowing in also raise the outdoor temps when they arrive, then once the storm departs the temps free fall, so there's a need for multiple heat outputs and why hold yourself back with small loads, big loads, re-lights ect (this shouldn't be like Goldilocks testing her porridge) when you can just adjust the thermostat and be done, especially on a new home were you up to current code with minimum insulation, new windows and over tightness with todays basic building tech.

 

[Ashful]

Nothing personal here. but its not a fan boy thing bruh,

Maybe he meant me, but that’d be ignoring the fact that I’ve made at least as many recommendations for Woodstock as BK recently, if not more. Not that either reflect my personal preferences, it’s where the OP’s questions directed the conversation.

If referring to the general cat vs non-cat thing, then yes... I have a clear bias for superior performance. Cat stoves generally provide a wider range of output options, as well as the possibility of flatter output over the duration of the burn cycle, than non-cat stoves. It’s impossible to not see that as superior in most applications. We just need to be fair and also acknowledge that you need to include ~$50/year typical combustor depreciation, not that reburn tubes last forever.

 

[Highbeam]

If referring to the general cat vs non-cat thing, then yes... I have a clear bias for superior performance.

Agreed

 

[whtoak]

Update:

I appreciate all the responses so far. You guys/gals take your wood stove burning serious. LOL. It is helping me to make a good decision.

I really like the gentlemen that showed me the BK sirocco 30. Their company has a good reputation also which will be good for the install when I drop the hammer on one. He also carries the Lopi stove brand as well. The one he had on the floor looked real nice but was a bit smaller than the BK 30 and had a burn time of 10 hours. I still liked it quite a bit.

Right now I am leaning very heavy towards the BK 30. After burning the smaller Jotul at the farm house for 7 years I just want to have more room in the firebox and a longer burn time. I DON'T want to have a regret again with this new stove purchase (I regretted the small Jotul purchase). Am I wrong in wanting more than enough stove for my house? Is there any downside to the larger BK 30 stove?

 

[Ashful]

You guys/gals take your wood stove burning serious. LOL. It is helping me to make a good decision.

Yeah, we probaby waste more time than we should, discusing these things. And I should take a moment to commend begreen on trying to keep this bunch of us on an even keel, it's a thankless and damn near impossible job for which he has volunteered, he is doing a better job with it than most of us would.

I really like the gentlemen that showed me the BK sirocco 30. Their company has a good reputation also which will be good for the install when I drop the hammer on one. He also carries the Lopi stove brand as well. The one he had on the floor looked real nice but was a bit smaller than the BK 30 and had a burn time of 10 hours. I still liked it quite a bit.

Dealer support is huge. If you like a dealer in your neighborhood, that should weigh heavily in your decision.

Is there any downside to the larger BK 30 stove?

I have one of my BK30's installed in an addition to my house which is 1200 sq.ft. of 1990's blown-in celluluse 2x6 construction, and nearly all glass. I fill it once per day and set it for a 24 hour burn, which is just about perfect for the majority of our winter. On very sunny days, solar gain makes it a little warmer than I'd like in there, but that would be an issue in that space no matter what stove I ran. On very cold days, I turn it up if it's a weekend and I don't mind running a second load, or I just let the oil fired boiler pick up the difference. I think you would likely do very well with a BK 30 in 1600 sq.ft. of modern construction.

 

[bholler]

Yea but your chasing the dragon, to hot, to cold, need to make another fire from scratch, save yourself the heart ache and use the thermostat as designed and add wood when needed, 20hrs per load on a lower setting is a lot of time to figure out if your to cold or not.

You don't have to do it like that once you figure out how to run your stove

 

[bholler]

Maybe he meant me, but that’d be ignoring the fact that I’ve made at least as many recommendations for Woodstock as BK recently, if not more. Not that either reflect my personal preferences, it’s where the OP’s questions directed the conversation.

If referring to the general cat vs non-cat thing, then yes... I have a clear bias for superior performance. Cat stoves generally provide a wider range of output options, as well as the possibility of flatter output over the duration of the burn cycle, than non-cat stoves. It’s impossible to not see that as superior in most applications. We just need to be fair and also acknowledge that you need to include ~$50/year typical combustor depreciation, not that reburn tubes last forever.

Not superior for me

 

[Ashful]

Not superior for me

Well, yes... I think I stated that in my post above:

There are a lot of poeple for whom that would not matter, their house needs more heat than the stove will provide on a very low burn rate setting, but you may be their ideal customer with relatively low heat demand.

But if we really need to go back and dig up old posts, I seem to recall you stating that you did like the way the BK could cruise long in the shoulder season, you just quickly lost that advantage when the weather turned cold.

 

[bholler]

Well, yes... I think I stated that in my post above:

But if we really need to go back and dig up old posts, I seem to recall you stating that you did like the way the BK could cruise long in the shoulder season, you just quickly lost that advantage when the weather turned cold.

Yes there absolutely are things I like about the princess. But the fact is it simply doesn't have enough btu output to maintain the heat I want in my house with the burn times I need to have when a comperably sized regency did it pretty easily until it got down to sub zero or single digits with high wind. That means more oil burnt and none of the woodsavings many of you talk about

 

[Ashful]

Yes there absolutely are things I like about the princess. But the fact is it simply doesn't have enough btu output to maintain the heat I want in my house with the burn times I need to have when a comperably sized regency did it pretty easily until it got down to sub zero or single digits with high wind. That means more oil burnt and none of the woodsavings many of you talk about

You must have a fairly high heat load, if the Princess just couldn’t keep up. Clearly much more than the OP‘s expected heat load in a well-insulated new 1600 sq.ft. house in Virginia, for which I was recommending the BK.