Wife says at that price, no more 24/7 wood burning. Looks like my wood will last a lot longer now. Wonder if I should sell my splitter? Probably the moment I do, they'll jack up the price of gas like they did last Winter.
Gas company announced 11% price drop
- Thread starter LLigetfa
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smokinj
Minister of Fire
LLigetfa said:
you know it and the way the economy is going I would need more that 11percent to afford it. 50 percent I will shut the saws down for the winter
Last Winter while the price of gas was high, my wood guy raised his price to $100 a cord and the wife then was arguing that burning wood was not worth it. I don't know if I actually won the argument but I wore her down and got my 12 cord. At the time she was suggesting I take free Poplar/Aspen off my land which I take a bit of, but when I was burning it, she complained about the smell and the ashes.
Now she says that the 18 cord I have will be the last purchased wood and that it will last a very long time with only evening fires. I'm waiting for her to again raise the topic of retrofitting the RSF with natural gas. I've got to come up with a way to not bring dirt into the house with the wood and to not let loose any ashes when I clean the stove. Also, she keeps a window open upstairs which causes enough of a negative pressure downstairs that the OAK pushes some smoke and ashes into the house when she or I load the stove so I have to find a way to keep the smoke out.
Now she says that the 18 cord I have will be the last purchased wood and that it will last a very long time with only evening fires. I'm waiting for her to again raise the topic of retrofitting the RSF with natural gas. I've got to come up with a way to not bring dirt into the house with the wood and to not let loose any ashes when I clean the stove. Also, she keeps a window open upstairs which causes enough of a negative pressure downstairs that the OAK pushes some smoke and ashes into the house when she or I load the stove so I have to find a way to keep the smoke out.
daveswoodhauler
Minister of Fire
LLigetfa said:
Outdoor boiler? Not purdy to look at, but you still get your wood and the Mrs's is happy with no dirt in the house
SolarAndWood
Minister of Fire
ilikewood said:Outdoor boiler? Not purdy to look at, but you still get your wood and the Mrs's is happy with no dirt in the house
hate to see the ROI vs natural gas on that project...I'm not sure we would have more than evening fires if we had access to NG.
kbrown
Feeling the Heat
The price may drop by 11% but what other fees have increased or been added? It's been my experience that's how they sneak a few extra bucks outta ya each month. In our area we use to get hit with a $3/mo fee by the phone company in order for them to provide "no cost" internet service to the school district. WTF
We dropped them and got another provider. Gas is the same, price drops but we get a new "green energy" charge and increase cost of transmission charge. Most people will see the 11% price drop and end up using 50% more gas! For us, it's a combination of being able to get free wood and the indirect costs of our time, equipment costs, etc that play into what is really the best method. So far it's still wood!
If your wife doesn't like the wood stove, then what about an outdoor furnace? Free hot water is always nice too!
We dropped them and got another provider. Gas is the same, price drops but we get a new "green energy" charge and increase cost of transmission charge. Most people will see the 11% price drop and end up using 50% more gas! For us, it's a combination of being able to get free wood and the indirect costs of our time, equipment costs, etc that play into what is really the best method. So far it's still wood! If your wife doesn't like the wood stove, then what about an outdoor furnace? Free hot water is always nice too!
Too much capital outlay with too little ROI.
For the dirt, I was thinking one of those slings with ends on them that look more like a sack.
For the ashes while cleaning the stove, I could go with an ash vacuum.
For the negative pressure, I should nail the upstairs window shut. I just don't get it... I ducted the HRV fresh air into the bedroom so there's no need to open the window. An open window upstairs tends to let more air out than in and the air she lets out is the fresh air the HRV pumps in. I think I'll switch the ducts around so the fresh HRV air is pumped to the hearth room instead. She keeps the bedroom door closed to keep out the excess heat and house smells so the modified HRV duct would pressurize rather than de-pressurize the house.
For the dirt, I was thinking one of those slings with ends on them that look more like a sack.
For the ashes while cleaning the stove, I could go with an ash vacuum.
For the negative pressure, I should nail the upstairs window shut. I just don't get it... I ducted the HRV fresh air into the bedroom so there's no need to open the window. An open window upstairs tends to let more air out than in and the air she lets out is the fresh air the HRV pumps in. I think I'll switch the ducts around so the fresh HRV air is pumped to the hearth room instead. She keeps the bedroom door closed to keep out the excess heat and house smells so the modified HRV duct would pressurize rather than de-pressurize the house.
Lanningjw
Minister of Fire
LLigetfa said:
In my area (Minneapolis MN) the gas company is estimating the price of natural gas will be 20% lower than what we payed last winter.
Do the guys selling cords of firewood understand that they need to also lower there price? The price of gasoline is also lower for processing and delivery of the wood. The average price of red oak in this area is $275 a loggers cord. The fist year I got into this I paid $175.00..... I know its alot of work processing the wood, but this is BS. I worked all summer collecting wood for the engine....
BrowningBAR
Minister of Fire
LLigetfa said:
Sounds like a lot of rules to follow. My wife wouldn't think about complaining about the wood stacks. And my wife is a HUGE pyro.
We've already seen several price reductions since its highest last Winter. This 11% is a further reduction below the current low price.Lanning said:
'bert
Minister of Fire
LLigetfa, do they drill for Nat gas in ON? or is it brought in via pipe or ship?
I have a nat gas well within 600' of my house and I have not heard of any big reductions in AB for this winter, I thought our price here kinda floated with the market price plus the fixed delivery charges which now seem to amount to as much as the gas usage part of our bill.
I have a nat gas well within 600' of my house and I have not heard of any big reductions in AB for this winter, I thought our price here kinda floated with the market price plus the fixed delivery charges which now seem to amount to as much as the gas usage part of our bill.
It's brought in by several big pipes from Alberta. Do you remember the "Let those Easterners freeze in the dark" rhetoric way back when the government got involved in oil/gas pricing? Sorry it cuts into Alberta revenues.Alberta Burner said:
Union Gas News Release
http://www.uniongas.com/news/2009/September142009.asp
'bert
Minister of Fire
We should compare gas bills, but I am really gonna be pissed if you pay less then us! I see if I can dig one up and post some details for you.
Current Natural Gas RatesAlberta Burner said:
Gas used 20.055 ¢/m3
Gas price adjustment -8.0676 ¢/m3
Transportation to Union Gas 3.3308 ¢/m3
Transportation price adjustment -0.4199 ¢/m3
Storage 1.895 ¢/m3
Storage price adjustment 0.0025 ¢/m3
Delivery 8.7142 ¢/m3
Delivery price adjustment -1.7767 ¢/m3
Monthly charge $18.00
Backwoods Savage
Minister of Fire
Let the price of gas and oil drop. I'll still be burning wood and staying comfortable this winter and the next and the next, etc., etc.
Lanning, the price of gas and oil is cheaper but the price of labor isn't any less for sure. Actually, the cost of gas and oil for cutting firewood is very low but is very labor intensive. With that in mind it is difficult for wood sellers to drop their prices and I don't blame them if they don't. However, the prices have dropped in this area anyway.
Lanning, the price of gas and oil is cheaper but the price of labor isn't any less for sure. Actually, the cost of gas and oil for cutting firewood is very low but is very labor intensive. With that in mind it is difficult for wood sellers to drop their prices and I don't blame them if they don't. However, the prices have dropped in this area anyway.
BrowningBAR
Minister of Fire
Backwoods Savage said:
Low oil and gas prices means cheaper wood for the rest of us. High oil prices means I can't find wood for under $200 a cord.
Though, I am getting better at scrounging...
TreePapa
Minister of Fire
I've never seen Southern California Gas Company (a Sempra Energy Company) actually lower prices. Even if the price of their supply goes down, my gas bill seems to go up every year. Mind you, it's nothing compared to summer A/C ('lectric) bills, but it sure never seems to go down.
Peace,
- Sequoia
Peace,
- Sequoia
'bert
Minister of Fire
LLigetfa said:
Let's see if I can compare
Distribution Base $0.794 / Day
Default Supply Provider Admin Fee $ 0.074 / Day
Variable Distribution (Base) Energy Charge $ 1.636 / GJ
Third Party Transportation Charge: $ 0.448 / GJ
Gas Cost Recovery Charge: $ 2.350 / GJ
Property Fee of about $ 1 per billing cycle
I give up! I wonder if anyone at the gas company can understand these bills? How many GJ in a m3?
Todd
Minister of Fire
Yeah, I've been watching my gas bills and they are cheap! $18 for last month and that's just for hot water. The thing is, wood heat just feels better and the house is much warmer burning wood. Tell your wife your going green and wood is carbon neutral, save the polar bears and ice caps. :lol:
Stevebass4
Minister of Fire
true however the supply and demand effect should take placeBackwoods Savage said:
if i could heat my house at the same temp and same cost between oil and wood - you can bet i'd just turn the dial plus labor costs should drop given the amount of people looking for work (no raises for us this year and many folks i know who still work took a pay cut)
we still see csd around 250 - 300 so it's about equal if one buys csd - on the other hand i buy logs so it's still cheaper
Todd
Minister of Fire
savageactor7
Minister of Fire
Good to hear that gas prices are coming down for you. We replaced our oil burner with an LP stove and imo LP does not heat the house like oil did so were I in your shoes I'd continue to heat with wood. But like you in the house I yield to the whatever the wife thinks.
I used natural gas as a backup during the really cold months. My company, Columbia Gas, is claiming that this month is the lowest price that consumers will be paying in the past 7 years due to high supply and low demand. I typically don't turn the furnace on till December and it is off by March. Even with low prices, I will stick with wood. I prefer to heat my house with my two hands and wood heat feels much warmer than gas to me.
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