Advice from chimney pros

[Garyxring]

Hi. I am brand new to the site and wood stoves. I moved into an old farmhouse over a year ago, and decided recently that we wanted to replace the old Montgomery Wards Franklin stove with something considerably more airtight and efficient. We decided on a Hearthstone Heritage and have it ordered. I've had 2 fireplace professionals survey the installation and give proposals. Both were very different, leading me to ask here. Here is the situation as I see it. The original house was built in 1860 with an addition in 1920, which is where the stove is to be installed. The chimney is brick, is on the interior of the house, 3 floors including the attic, and has what appears to be a 8" stainless liner in it. When we had the chimneys cleaned a year ago, the contractor told us the chimney was lined and packed with vermiculite. After a recent survey from a proposed stove installer he confirmed this from the fireplace end. Now, the previous owner appears to have built the fireplace out from the rear wall (I'm guessing to accommodate the Franklin stove. When they did that they blocked off about half of the 8" liner, and squeezed the pipe from the stove to an oval shape to fit it through and into the liner. Obviously, I need to correct that and remodel the fireplace/ hearth. My question is, why is this guy telling me I need to have a 6" insulated liner installed, either inside the 8" liner if it will fit, or pull the 8" out and put the 6" insulated one in after. Isn't a 8" to 6" reducer available, and wouldn't the existing 8" liner draft better? He's selling it as safety, which I'm all for, but I don't understand why the vermiculite packed 8" liner is suddenly no good, and haven't gotten an explanation . Any help or advice would be great. Thanks.
Gary

 

[brenndatomu]

8" chimney is too big for a modern stove. Most use a 6". You can usually go up or down 1" on the chimney size, but any more than that, you are asking for problems. Just have a 6" liner pulled into the 8", that shouldn't be real expensive, and with a 3 story height house, it should draft like crazy!

 

[mellow]

I would try it with the reducer, if it doesn't draft good (which it should) then have the 6" liner run down the 8", no need to insulate the 6" if the 8" is already insulated. Plus an insulated 6" liner wont fit in the 8".

 

[Garyxring]

Thanks guys. So the packed vermiculite is a adequate insulation?

 

[mellow]

If it is going from bottom to top it sounds like it should be insulated. If you have any doubts an NFI or CSIA certified sweep should be able to let you know for sure.

 

[Grisu]

Old, probably drafty farmhouse, 3 floors; why did you not go for something bigger like the Hearthstone Equinox or the Kuma Sequoia? Both use an 8-inch liner and I have the feeling you will need that additional "firepower". How many sqft are you trying to heat?

Plus, since you are new to the site: Do you have dry wood available with a moisture content of less than 20%? Seasoned split and stacked for a minimum of one year better two to three? Any modern, EPA-approved woodstove will need dry wood to function properly.

 

[Garyxring]

Good question on the size of the house and stove. 3700 sq ft total, but alot is on the floor below the den where the stove will go, and its all rather sprawling. There is a large fireplace in the basement with thick stone walls, but the layout with two stairwells and two additions to the original house doesn't lend itself to getting the heat to where we spend most of our time. The addition where the stove will be is definately a drafty room, with 3 exterior walls, but on the medium to smaller side. It has an open doorway to my dining room and kitchen on the other side, and an open stairway leading upstairs to the bedrooms. We are really only concerned with keeping the upstairs and rooms adjacent to the den warm with the stove. With four zones of baseboard radiant heat fired by oil, I can easily burn 210 gallons of oil in 30 days in the colder windy months, so you can see why we wanted the stove. On the other side of the dining room is our large great room addition, with a high 20'+ ceiling. This room is slated for a eventual fireplace and chimney to be added, as the chestnut beam construction just screams for a view of some flames as you relax and socialize. It will surely get a larger stove in it, and 2 antique appearing ceiling fans to get the heat moving down from the high ceiling. Unbelievably though, it is the warmest and best insulated room in the house, being added in 1960, and having 4 large south facing modern windows the size of sliding glass doors.
As for wood, I had the luxury of having a 25' section of a 25-30" locust laying on the ground when we moved in a year ago. It was cut up and stacked, but not split until recently, so it may wait til next winter, though a neighbor told me he cut the smaller top section off of it nearly a year before. Should it be considered seasoned though it sat whole for a year before being cut into logs? I also have several piles of split maple that has been stacked for about about 15 months since being cut, and I'm planning on that being my main source for this winter. Is there a reliable method or device for checking moisture content?
Thanks

 

[mellow]

Is there a reliable method or device for checking moisture content?

Lowes or Home Depot sell moisture meters over by the tools section. If you are looking to save a few bucks Harbor Freight has a cheap one: http://www.harborfreight.com/digital-mini-moisture-meter-67143.html

 

[Grisu]

From your description I get that you would like to heat the den, kitchen/dining area and the upstairs bedroom. How many sqft are those? You may have settled on the Heritage and that is certainly fine. But if you have second thoughts due to the liner you are welcome to post a floorplan and get some recommendations here. Should the 6 to 8-inch reducer not work then you are looking at another $800 to $1000 for dropping a 6-inch liner down the flue. For that money you could have bought a larger stove that would give you more heating power and connects right away to the 8-inch liner.

I am not in any way connected with Kuma but their Sequoia model sounds like a good fit. It is a catalytic model which means it gets excellent burn times and can be run on a low setting for a very long time ensuring that you don't heat yourself out of the room. There are certainly other stoves with an 8-inch flue requirement if you are interested.

Wood does not dry when not split and stacked. The locust will at least need until next winter but you will need to get it split and stacked ASAP. The maple sounds good, stick with it for this winter.

 

[CenterTree]

I would try it with the reducer, if it doesn't draft good (which it should) then have the 6" liner run down the 8", no need to insulate the 6" if the 8" is already insulated. Plus an insulated 6" liner wont fit in the 8".

Why do you say it won't fit?

A 6 inch liner may have a 6.25" OD.(smooth wall)
Then add 1/2" insulation wrap + wire mesh wrap, that should be about 7.75".
Correct? or not??

Is my math wrong?