another newb inquiring about the dreaded vogelzang

[ash bucket]

So, like everyone else, I'm on a budget. Desperately wanting an add-on wood burning furnace to compliment my LP furnace. Have been reading and reading and I am still stuck. A few threads I have found have talked about the Vogelzang Norseman's but no one seems to have any experience with them. My house is roughly 1300 sq. ft. and in unlike northern states, we only see about 0 degrees being the coldest over the winter. I have been looking hard at Northern Tool's Vogelzang Norseman 1500 as this is all I can spend on a unit at this time ($1000) not counting install. So, what I want to know is:

1. Does anyone have any experience or know of anyone with this model? What's your opinion?

2. Is vogelzang's reputation a thing of the past? Are they up to par these days with the competitors? (Even though they are the cheap end furnaces)

3. Am I wasting my time and money? Will this furnace help at all? Is it adequate for my application?

Thanks in advance

 

[stee6043]

One thing you may want to do while still deciding on which burner to purchase is to run a heat loss calc on your house. Google "slantfin" and you'll find a free program. This is typically a good place to start when trying to figure out how much burner you need.

As for Add-On furnaces I've heard nothing but good things about the Yukon-Eagle burners....but I'm not familiar with the V-zang...

 

[SolarAndWood]

How much natural gas do you consume and what is the rate? Given the price of natural gas, the size of your house and where you live, are you sure you are going to save any money doing this? Your money might be better spent on caulk, weatherstripping, insulation, windows, etc.

 

[ash bucket]

Well, I have only spent one winter in this house so far and I filled up my tank twice over the winter. I don't use LP for anything else besides heat. I spent roughly $1500 to heat the house last winter. I am in the process of having the windows replaced which I hope will help considerably. Which is another reason I don't have much extra cash for this project. I was hoping to reduce/almost eliminate my LP need so that the furnace would pay for itseld in the first year or two. Was thinking since it doesn't get extremely cold here that I could heat the house with the furnace alone and have the LP for back-up. Thanks for the quick responses. Any other comments are greatly appreciated

 

[SolarAndWood]

sorry, read LP but thought natural gas. I totally agree with eliminating or at least reducing the need for a relationship with a propane vendor. BTW, welcome to the forum.

 

[CrappieKeith]

Well, I have only spent one winter in this house so far and I filled up my tank twice over the winter. I don't use LP for anything else besides heat. I spent roughly $1500 to heat the house last winter. I am in the process of having the windows replaced which I hope will help considerably. Which is another reason I don't have much extra cash for this project. I was hoping to reduce/almost eliminate my LP need so that the furnace would pay for itseld in the first year or two. Was thinking since it doesn't get extremely cold here that I could heat the house with the furnace alone and have the LP for back-up. Thanks for the quick responses. Any other comments are greatly appreciated

get a BJ90(Yukon) with our 6 months same as cash.
Pay the bank instead of the gas co.
At the end of your winter the furnace is paid for and now you'll have something instead of blowing your cash on LP.

Keep in mind that not all furnaces are built to give you super long burn times.
If your furnace goes out...your loosing by having to pay for gas when you could have ..for the same money bought a furnace that would give you the kind of burn times you'll need so you can just fire it up twice a 24 period.
Your gonna pay someone to heat your home.It may as well be you your paying.
I heat 1400s/f with my BJ90...after 12 years I'm still on the same 100 lb. tank of LP....(half full)

 

[ash bucket]

Would love to have a BJ90. Looked at those also. Do they come with a circulating blower or is that the Optional 1460 cfm Blower/1/4 HP Direct Drive Motor for an extra $321. I like your thinkin but that's $1000 compared to $2000. And I dont like the idea of another payment. Like to pay in full when at all possible. I'm already gonna have a new window payment that I'm going to have to scrape the bottom of the bucket for. And I'm still making payments on the propane from last winter.

 

[Chris Hoskin]

since you won't be producing your domestic hot water with this unit, have you considered a woodstove? You won't get as good heat distribution as with a furnace, but a woodstove should do pretty well in a 1300ft home.

 

[ash bucket]

since you won't be producing your domestic hot water with this unit, have you considered a woodstove? You won't get as good heat distribution as with a furnace, but a woodstove should do pretty well in a 1300ft home.

Well, that was my first thought. I was going to put one in my basement hoping the heat would radiate up into my living area. But after reading this and that and with an unfinished and uninsulated basement, I wasn't going to be happy with the results as it would not do what I wanted. Then I stumbled upon these add on furnaces and it seemed to be a perfect fit for my place. I didn't even know they made such a thing until last week. Now I can't stop thinkin about having one. Always on the hunt for more information. Thats when I found this forum.

 

[CrappieKeith]

Would love to have a BJ90. Looked at those also. Do they come with a circulating blower or is that the Optional 1460 cfm Blower/1/4 HP Direct Drive Motor for an extra $321. I like your thinkin but that's $1000 compared to $2000. And I dont like the idea of another payment. Like to pay in full when at all possible. I'm already gonna have a new window payment that I'm going to have to scrape the bottom of the bucket for. And I'm still making payments on the propane from last winter.

I hear ya....I just thought to avoid the liquid bill you could redivert your payments for 1 season to the bank.
Yes the blower is 323$ but you could heat with a different blower maybe you could find one at a junk yard or something.
Maybe do gravity heat like I do.

I set up our financing so that you'd have something at the end of the season instead of just paying for liquid fuel with nothing to show.
We do have a hot rod to make your domestic hot water.
This furnace would last you for 30 years.

 

[Gooserider]

It might also be worth taking a look at England Stove Works they make (or made, I don't follow their product lines that close) an add-on unit that I think is fairly close to the VZ price tag, and most reports I've seen on the forums say that the products and company are both good... A couple of their honchos are also regular posters here.

Gooserider

 

[ash bucket]

Would love to have a BJ90. Looked at those also. Do they come with a circulating blower or is that the Optional 1460 cfm Blower/1/4 HP Direct Drive Motor for an extra $321. I like your thinkin but that's $1000 compared to $2000. And I dont like the idea of another payment. Like to pay in full when at all possible. I'm already gonna have a new window payment that I'm going to have to scrape the bottom of the bucket for. And I'm still making payments on the propane from last winter.

I hear ya....I just thought to avoid the liquid bill you could redivert your payments for 1 season to the bank.
Yes the blower is 323$ but you could heat with a different blower maybe you could find one at a junk yard or something.
Maybe do gravity heat like I do.

I set up our financing so that you'd have something at the end of the season instead of just paying for liquid fuel with nothing to show.
We do have a hot rod to make your domestic hot water.
This furnace would last you for 30 years.

So, I've been reading up on your BJ90 and I'm not sure exactly how they work as compared to a VZ. Correct me if I'm wrong but it comes with a wall thermostat that ties into the combustion blower to create more fire when needed. Now, does this tie into the existing furnaces blower and turn it on also? Just wondering what turns on the existing furnace's blower to get the circulation if you can run it without the optional additional blower. On the VZ, as with many others I'm sure, it has a blower limit control that turns on a blower that comes with it when the plenum in the furnace gets to a desired temp. Does the BJ have this? Just not clear in the reading of this model as to how it actually works, especailly without a blower to get the warm air into your existing ductwork. Is this the "gravity heat" you are referring to? If not, please explain.

 

[ash bucket]

It might also be worth taking a look at England Stove Works they make (or made, I don't follow their product lines that close) an add-on unit that I think is fairly close to the VZ price tag, and most reports I've seen on the forums say that the products and company are both good... A couple of their honchos are also regular posters here.

Gooserider

Wow. So many to choose from. I'm kinda glad I have a little while to save up some money for this purchase so I can gather as much info as possible and hopefully make the right decision for me. I like the idea of the glass door on the Englander so I can watch and check on the fire. I absolutley LOVE watching a fire. Only thing that I'm thinkin is that it can heat up to 3000 sq. ft. Think this might be too much for my small house. But hey, I'm new to all this. What do I know?

 

[laynes69]

The Vogelzang Norseman are a decent unit. Cheaply built but the same as the usstove basic furnace. They can give overnight burns and pump out the heat when needed. If your on a bugdet that would be the way to go. Our 1500 Usstove we replaced was 25 years old, and the only thing I did was replaced the grates and the baffle. For a basic woodfurnace and someone on a budget they would be happy with one. Chech into them. Parts are interchangeable from usstove to volgelzang. Not everyone has the $$$ to go for the great sytem, but those furnaces come with 2 550 cfms blowers, and in a smaller home they work just fine.

I also know someone who burns there englander add-on and they love it. Says its pretty efficient and burns little wood, plus you have a nice glass door to view the fire. Heres the link.

http://www.englandsstoveworks.com/28-3500.html

The englander will put out more radiant heat, then heat into the ductwork. A singe 8" duct into the ductwork wouldn't feed a 3000 square foot home. There are woodfurnaces out there that have huge plenums and they throw some serious heat through the ductwork with large blowers, and advanced heat exchangers. Of course they can get pricey.

 

[ash bucket]

So, I've been reading up on your BJ90 and I'm not sure exactly how they work as compared to a VZ. Correct me if I'm wrong but it comes with a wall thermostat that ties into the combustion blower to create more fire when needed. Now, does this tie into the existing furnaces blower and turn it on also? Just wondering what turns on the existing furnace's blower to get the circulation if you can run it without the optional additional blower. On the VZ, as with many others I'm sure, it has a blower limit control that turns on a blower that comes with it when the plenum in the furnace gets to a desired temp. Does the BJ have this? Just not clear in the reading of this model as to how it actually works, especailly without a blower to get the warm air into your existing ductwork. Is this the "gravity heat" you are referring to? If not, please explain.

 

[ash bucket]

Can nobody tell me how this thing works? A Big Jack 90. Does anyone have one? Or even a Super Jack 125? Are they no good?

 

[laynes69]

I'm not sure about the yukon, but on most add-ons they have a limit control, or a thermodisc that kicks in when a set heat is applied triggering the blower. My old woodfurnace I removed the blower, and ran it in series. The limit control would kick on the central furnaces blower when a set temp was met. I've heard claims of operating one w/o a blower. I'm sure if the unit was setup this way that clearances would have to be followed carefully. I wouldn't recommend it, only because a woodfurnace can get to very high temps quickly. The limit control if not using the central furnaces blower would control the blower on the woodfurnace and also the forced draft limit. The thermostat controls the forced draft, but the limit will shut it off in case of an overfire. On my 1500 hotblast, I found the forced draft to be a joke. I burned much more wood and it didn't make a difference on heat output other than just cooling the firebox. That forced draft was set above the fire, which was a poor design. Hope this helps.