Blazeking or Pacific Energy - 1st time buyer

[kborndale]

Wood here in the Boston area is $450 a cord seasoned mixed hardwood.

Wow, at those prices it would be cheaper for me to just run my furnace. Can you get green wood cheaper?

 

[moresnow]

In my area we call the described basement a daylight basement

We call it a walkout basement around these here parts.

 

[Highbeam]

We call it a walkout basement around these here parts.

I like that term better. More descriptive.

at $200 a cord for oak (mixed birch, poplar, ash, maple is cheaper), buying enough wood to run all winter could cost me more than my electric heating system does.

Those cords might be some sort of banana cord, rick, or face cord. 200$ for a real cord does sound super cheap but this is Fargo after all and everybody has a chippah. I wonder how low the electric costs are if wood at 200 is still more expensive.

 

[begreen]

Sounds like a deal to me, as well. That was the price for mixed hardwoods here, years ago; I haven't checked lately.
Don't expect wood from a dealer to be dry, though. Here, I need two years split, stacked and top-covered, at least, for most woods, three years for Oak. Now, if your stacks get a lot of wind and you have low humidity most of the time, you may be able to get wood dry faster. Regardless, I'd start stacking some of that Boxelder ASAP; That should dry pretty quickly, I'd think.

Echoing Highbeam's sentiment. Could be a face cord?

 

[Mikey98e]

I'm just west of Boston and I got 2 cords for $750 delivered that filled up my 3 cord shed after I split them smaller to fit my stove.
-mike

 

[Fargo]

I had no idea my wood was inexpensive compared to others. Although, it might not be as cheap as it sounds, because a lot of guys call a pickup load a cord. But I don't think that's a full cord. So I probably need to read more closely what they are calling a cord. Others that actually measure a 4x4x8 cord always have cheaper woods mixed in. So price is hard to figure out. Our electricity is about $.09 per KWH at full price and off peak is around $.052. Since my furnace uses a ceramic block storage system, most of my heat comes at the cheaper rate. So my 3 coldest months of winter heat bills are around 4000kWh hours ($200) more expensive than my cheapest bills.

NOTE:
Hmm, I just did some math. Maybe wood is cheaper. If chatgpt is close to accurate then I could get the same 4000 kwh from a half cord of oak. Maybe it is worth buying oak to burn 24/7.

 

[GG Woody]

FWIW...
Not apples to apples, not even close...
We have a P.E. insert on the main floor, maybe 15yrs old, it's great, puts out a bunch of heat. We haven't fired it up yet this year because of the Blaze king stove in the basement. The Blaze King has been cruising for the last 5 weeks or so nonstop, slowish and lowish. (halfish throttle on the dial whatever that equates to)
I think that the basement would be cooked out with a tube stove this early (and a month ago) in the year, hypothetical since I have never had one down there. I burn 99% Douglas Fir and all my loads last at least 12hrs.
If I was to buy another stove today I would stick with P.E. or Blaze King , but probably mostly because they manufacture pretty local to me.
I think that the Blaze King might take me about 2 extra minutes per reload to deal with the bypass, non-issue.
I load, turn down, and leave either and or both running for entire loads every day 5 months of the year, non-issue.
My wood supply keeps getting better and better, the wood itself really is more of a variable than the stove.
We also have a nice natural gas furnace and heat pump, (I work in the HVAC trade) I haven't burned any gas in it this fall as I prefer burning wood.

 

[Woody Stover]

a lot of guys call a pickup load a cord. But I don't think that's a full cord....Our electricity is about $.09 per KWH at full price and off peak is around $.052.

Yep, a thrown-in pickup load is about 1/3 of a cord, or a rick (face cord) cut at 16", 4x8' row.
AI sez;


I just took the total of my bill, minus state tax, and divided by kWh, came out to 25 cents/kWh.
Yeah...solar... that's the ticket. 😏

 

[Highbeam]

To be fair, I can stack a cord in my pickup bed. I measured, I'm an engineer. It's not even to the top of the cab but does require sideboards to get the full cord. Full size, 3/4 ton and up trucks can haul the weight no problem though wet doug fir is lighter than oak.

Thrown in, to the top of the bedrails, is pretty dependably 1/3 of a cord or slightly over with my 6'-8" bed. This is how I sell wood because it's easier to load, cheaper for the buyer, and safer to transport. Plus I get to sell more smaller loads and I like to drive around.

 

[Burnin Since 1991]

Wow, at those prices it would be cheaper for me to just run my furnace. Can you get green wood cheaper?

yes, unseasoned, split hardwood mix is 275-300 a cord. I have very limited storage area so I can't buy the unseasoned until the spring, in which case, I'd be better off buying the seasoned wood. Although the seller I use knows his wood. He runs a very large tree service North of Boston and all the burnable wood he sells as firewood. He splits them a little big so I maul them down or cut them in half so I can load n/s in my stove. The seasoned wood he sells is very seasoned and even the oak is 16% and better.

Unfortunately, NG Propane and Electricity are taxed very high in MA and the state has pushed the utilities for funds to help low income people and with subsidies, grants, low interest loans and rebates, that are all paid for when we buy those utilities. I will go look up our local rates and get back to the thread in a bit.

 

[Burnin Since 1991]

yes, unseasoned, split hardwood mix is 275-300 a cord. I have very limited storage area so I can't buy the unseasoned until the spring, in which case, I'd be better off buying the seasoned wood. Although the seller I use knows his wood. He runs a very large tree service North of Boston and all the burnable wood he sells as firewood. He splits them a little big so I maul them down or cut them in half so I can load n/s in my stove. The seasoned wood he sells is very seasoned and even the oak is 16% and better.

Unfortunately, NG Propane and Electricity are taxed very high in MA and the state has pushed the utilities for funds to help low income people and with subsidies, grants, low interest loans and rebates, that are all paid for when we buy those utilities. I will go look up our local rates and get back to the thread in a bit.

Here is what the utilities cost in MA and the charges they add into our bills. Above when I said tax, the correct term should probably be surcharge to the utility provider, who in turn pass their increased costs on to the consumer :

Note: I copied and pasted the figures for Electricity and NG from my last months utility bills so we can see also the price per month.

Electrical Distribution (I used 442 kwh in October)

Customer Charge 10.00
Dist Chg 0.09242 x 442 kWh 40.85
Transition Charge -0.00036 x 442 kWh -0.16
Transmission Charge 0.05798 x 442 kWh 25.63
Energy Efficiency Chg 0.02879 x 442 kWh 12.73
Renewable Energy Chg 0.0005 x 442 kWh 0.22
Net Meter Recovery Chg 0.01724 x 442 kWh 7.62
Distributed Solar Charge 0.00729 x 442 kWh 3.22
Electric Vehicle Charge 0.00174 x 442 kWh 0.77
Total Delivery Services $ 100.88

Electrical Supply 0.14011 per kwh

NG Delivery Services (I used 10 therms in October)

Minimum Charge 9.67
Delivery Peak 1.5313 x 1.72 therms 2.64
Delivery Off-Peak 1.3401 x 8.28 therms 11.09
Dist Adj - Energy Efficiency 0.29854822 x 10 therms 2.98
Distribution Adj - Other 0.51501376 x 10 therms 5.16
Total Delivery Services $ 31.54

NG Supply Services
Gas Supply Peak 0.9557 x 1.72 therms 1.65
Gas Supply Off-Peak 0.2543 x 8.28 therms 2.10
Total Supply Services $ 3.75

I don't use propane, however according to the state the average this month per gallon is approx. $3.40

 

[Fargo]

I didn't look at my bill close enough. I have some surcharges and flat rates as well. So rates are closer to $.11 and a monthly rate of $45+/-. But still cheaper than you guys. But thats because I live in coal country. ND had lots of coal power plants. Talking with my wife tonight, she stated that across the river in MN their power company is going to raise rates by $.18 per kwh because they want to be more environment and don't want to buy coal powered electricity. She also pointed out how the power demand of AI data servers. Electricity could get expensive in the future. I'm all electric, so my wood stove might see more use than I am currently anticipating. So that might make the Blazeking more appealing if I have to run it more long term.

 

[EbS-P]

I didn't look at my bill close enough. I have some surcharges and flat rates as well. So rates are closer to $.11 and a monthly rate of $45+/-. But still cheaper than you guys. But thats because I live in coal country. ND had lots of coal power plants. Talking with my wife tonight, she stated that across the river in MN their power company is going to raise rates by $.18 per kwh because they want to be more environment and don't want to buy coal powered electricity. She also pointed out how the power demand of AI data servers. Electricity could get expensive in the future. I'm all electric, so my wood stove might see more use than I am currently anticipating. So that might make the Blazeking more appealing if I have to run it more long term.

Here is my favorite cost calculator comparison.

Residential Heating System Cost Calculator | Efficiency Maine

Our heating cost comparison calculator can help you estimate your annual home heating costs for different heating systems.

www.efficiencymaine.com

 

[Burnin Since 1991]

Here is my favorite cost calculator comparison.

Residential Heating System Cost Calculator | Efficiency Maine

Our heating cost comparison calculator can help you estimate your annual home heating costs for different heating systems.

www.efficiencymaine.com

Thank you for posting that. Based on my rates here for a year it costs 2448 per year to heat with firewood. That is for 5 cords.

I realistically burn about 2 cords which is 950 per year and electrical baseboard heat is actually the most expensive heat at 9267 per year. I have a large family room addition of 900 s/f that is where the woodstove is located. The room has 2 wall mounted electric heaters. One I have never used and the other one I only run sporadically based on outside/ inside temps.

Most of the heating season I only run the woodstove in the family room and one baseboard heater in our living room. The woodstove and baseboard heat both contribute to keeping the kitchen warm. Our house is a balcony cape cod style house and the second floor is open to the living room. The heat from the living room rises to the bedrooms upstairs and we've never run any of the baseboard in the bedrooms or bathroom upstairs.

My actual electric use is about 4000 per year and that includes all of the electric used in my house.

There is a discount rate for electricity for those who use heat pumps.

 

[EbS-P]

Thank you for posting that. Based on my rates here for a year it costs 2448 per year to heat with firewood. That is for 5 cords.

I realistically burn about 2 cords which is 950 per year and electrical baseboard heat is actually the most expensive heat at 9267 per year. I have a large family room addition of 900 s/f that is where the woodstove is located. The room has 2 wall mounted electric heaters. One I have never used and the other one I only run sporadically based on outside/ inside temps.

Most of the heating season I only run the woodstove in the family room and one baseboard heater in our living room. The woodstove and baseboard heat both contribute to keeping the kitchen warm. Our house is a balcony cape cod style house and the second floor is open to the living room. The heat from the living room rises to the bedrooms upstairs and we've never run any of the baseboard in the bedrooms or bathroom upstairs.

My actual electric use is about 4000 per year and that includes all of the electric used in my house.

There is a discount rate for electricity for those who use heat pumps.

I would like to see average cost of new system and retrofit in a chart. But is so variable. Wood heat is still the cheapest but if you have cheap electricity and have to pay for wood a heatpump can be cheaper.

 

[Dieselhead]

I’ve never burned a PE so I can’t comment on one of those, but am on season 11? with my blaze king. It’s everything you read about, boring to operate, sips wood, steady consistent heat with long burn times. I ripped out a free breathing tube stove to install this when my work had a change of shift times and I’d be away much longer than previous. I wanted to come home to something at least. Today since reloading 37 hours earlier I still have a warm house with a coal bed enough to keep the stove around 200+ degrees ready for a reload off wednesdays coals. This is with hardwoods, with softwoods cut that time roughly in half.
Any other questions feel free to ask.

 

[all night moe]

I’ve never burned a PE so I can’t comment on one of those, but am on season 11? with my blaze king. It’s everything you read about, boring to operate, sips wood, steady consistent heat with long burn times. I ripped out a free breathing tube stove to install this when my work had a change of shift times and I’d be away much longer than previous. I wanted to come home to something at least. Today since reloading 37 hours earlier I still have a warm house with a coal bed enough to keep the stove around 200+ degrees ready for a reload off wednesdays coals. This is with hardwoods, with softwoods cut that time roughly in half.
Any other questions feel free to ask.

That HUGE firebox of a true king must be a contributing factor......to an extent?

 

[all night moe]

Our house is an old farm house with too much glazing so not the best for holding heat.

Mine is the same with something like 33 windows. All need to be re glazed.
Most have their outer storms.

I have made interior storms from 1x2'' wood frames and wrapped with clear 4 mil plastic on both sides. I used packaging tape on the edges to help with wear when removing and installing between seasons. I also left a little room when I made them for weather stripping. They are pressure fit. I screwed in 2 eye screws in the bottom corners to aid in removal.

They work quite well in the aid of eliminating drafts. They're even working well on a couple without exterior storms, although I had one drift inwards of a very gusty day. This was an outside corner window. As a bonus, they're good sound deadeners as well. Not that there's a lot of traffic on these roads.....

I hope you can make use of this.

 

[Dieselhead]

That HUGE firebox of a true king must be a contributing factor......to an extent?

Absolutely. It’s 4 cubic feet and I try to use most of it. I heat 2400 sqft floor space with a great room with 2 story ceilings with a loft if that equaled floor space it would be 3ksqft. The BK line in general have the same characteristics, princesses can go 24+ hours as well. Especially with a smaller house and relevant thermostat setting. This was the 37 hour tank of fuel;

 

[Fargo]

Here is my favorite cost calculator comparison.

Residential Heating System Cost Calculator | Efficiency Maine

Our heating cost comparison calculator can help you estimate your annual home heating costs for different heating systems.

www.efficiencymaine.com

Thanks for posting that. It might not be perfect but its really easy to get an idea of what you have. I noticed they used the price of a delivered cord of wood. That makes sense. My wood at $200 a cord is if I pick it up. So its probably twice that if I can even get it delivered. So, if you guys were talking about the cost of wood delivered, my wood is not as cheap as I thought it was.

I’ve never burned a PE so I can’t comment on one of those, but am on season 11? with my blaze king. It’s everything you read about, boring to operate, sips wood, steady consistent heat with long burn times. I ripped out a free breathing tube stove to install this when my work had a change of shift times and I’d be away much longer than previous. I wanted to come home to something at least. Today since reloading 37 hours earlier I still have a warm house with a coal bed enough to keep the stove around 200+ degrees ready for a reload off wednesdays coals. This is with hardwoods, with softwoods cut that time roughly in half.
Any other questions feel free to ask.

Wow thats impressive. Do you know specifically which hardwoods you had in there? I'm guessing the wood quality was a big factor.

 

[Fargo]

Hey guys, do you recommend the stove fan kit for $450? It seems kind of crazy expensive compared to a box fan from Walmart for $20. Do you use your fans or is just the radiant heat enough. It seems like the fan might be able to better move the air to get it up to my staircase. But so would a cheap stand fan or box fan. How often do you use your fans?

(I'm ordering the Ashford 30.2. I can cancel if it doesn't ship on time.)

 

[EbS-P]

Hey guys, do you recommend the stove fan kit for $450? It seems kind of crazy expensive compared to a box fan from Walmart for $20. Do you use your fans or is just the radiant heat enough. It seems like the fan might be able to better move the air to get it up to my staircase. But so would a cheap stand fan or box fan. How often do you use your fans?

(I'm ordering the Ashford 30.2. I can cancel if it doesn't ship on time.)

If you need to push the stove hard to heat the space regularly or heat a cold space up quickly you want the blower.

 

[Highbeam]

This is with hardwoods, with softwoods cut that time roughly in half.

Of course you would reduce the burntimes with lower btu woods but I don't think 50% is realistic. red oak (24 mbtu per cord) compared to doug fir (18 mbtu per cord) would be a loss of 25%. And it's not a hardwood vs. softwood issue, since some hardwoods are low density junk like cottonwood that is actually less MBTU than softwoods. The BK cat stove is really a superior replacement for a furnace. Steady heat with minimum operational effort and maximum efficiency.

Do you use your fans or is just the radiant heat enough.

I bought the fans and would not buy them again. The BK fans are quite good and quiet but just unnecessary for my single level home. All stoves make both radiant and convective heat. The fans just act to increase the portion of convective heat. You can always add the fans afterwards if you feel like you want more hot air to try and extend the "range" of the stove.

Is your basement ceiling insulated? Do you spend most of your time in the basement? Some folks prefer putting the stove up on the main floor where they live or even two stoves.

 

[EbS-P]

Is your basement ceiling insulated? Do you spend most of your time in the basement? Some folks prefer putting the stove up on the main floor where they live or even two stoves.

I will second putting the stove where you spend the most time.

 

[GG Woody]

I didn't want to pay for the fans, I was almost going to design some sort of alternative fan system around it, glad I didn't. I do have central HVAC moving a bunch of air in the stove room.
With the fans you can move a lot more heat away from the stove, but then the thermostat behind the stove will be opening up more to make up for the heat that's been moved away. I would try without the fans first as Highbeam suggested.

We do spend most our time on the main floor but I do like having the stove in the basement, it is definitely a different climate to move to if I want to warm up, especially after being outside in the winter. We all spend way more time downstairs than we used to, especially the kids. We used to spend close to zero time downstairs.