burning with a Drolet Myriad: general creosote questions

[Dogbyte]

Im still learning how to load my stove, only had it since Christmas, so i know there have been times ive not burned it as i should have, but im getting the hang of it. took me a while to feel ok with leaving it burning while i was away at work, so for a while i was shutting the air down before the fire got hot enough, so i know now the consequences of that...dirty drippy creosote.

I do have some creosote buildup way up at the cap, and probably elsewhere, and i tried to get up there this past weekend to sweep it, but the cap wouldnt come off, i think the seam is glued tight, only thing left i guess is to unscrew the 3 screws that hold the top of the cap on.

over the past week, ive been getting good fires back to back to back, where its hot enough to shut down the air and the secondaries start up. flue temps are between 300-400 during this time, and stove top is around 500F. But i have noticed after i open the door the next morning, the gust of air evidently is jarring loose some flakes, and i can hear them falling down the flue. is this buildup that is flaking off from when i was burning it dirtier?

im burning red oak that was split last spring, so its not ideal, but i am now trying to let the fire burn wide open for about 30 minutes, then start shutting it down til its either all the way shut or almost. if its an over night burn or im away at work, i wont shut it all the way down cause i wont be there to crack it back open after the secondaries quit. when i have it dialed in, i think its the best ever, i can really tell the difference in the amount of coals left over the next morning. Hardly any smoke outta the chimney when the fire is hot enough, through the secondaries, and afterwards when they quit. It burns clean when i get it right.

 

[Dogbyte]

sorry if the question got buried in there, but mainly: should i be worried about this stuff i hear falling down the flue, and what exactly is it? From when i was not burning the stove less than desirable and its now jarring loose from the hotter fires im now able to keep up? i thought maybe its all drying out up there and falling down. still gotta get that cap unstuck, it may come off now that its dried up a little.

 

[USMC80]

sounds like second degree creosote. You need to get a brush in there

 

[Ashful]

My stove is a little different than yours, in that I put it into a bypass mode, where the secondary system (catalyst) is bypassed during the start-up cycle. It's normal to measure temperatures > 500F on the outside of my single-wall pipe by the time the wood is ready to engage the catalyst, and I do often hear the crackling similar to what you describe, in the moments after I close the bypass damper to engage your catalyst. I can say I've been doing it 6x per day for two years, and never a problem. When I open up the flue to brush it 2x per year, I never get much out of it, and my chimney cap screen stays clean (not even a little build-up), so I'm not concerned with whatever is causing that noise... in my particular case.

Since you're new at this, and you know you were doing some things wrong at the beginning, I think it would be wise to pull the pipe off the stove and have a look up the flue. Two weeks in is mighty early to see much, unless you were burning really green wood... but who knows? It's not much work to do this, so you might as well get it done.

A lot of us have bought a device called the Soot Eater, which is essentially a string trimer on a set of flexible shafts, which you connect to a drill motor. Run it up and down the flue a few times from below, and you can be sure your chimney is reasonably clean. There are many guides on how to do this without making a mess of your living room, and it's definitely preferable to going up on a roof in this weather. Check it out.

 

[Dogbyte]

Mine does have a bypass, i only use it when reloading so no smoke spills out of the door. I remember reading it said not to leave it open after the fire is good and started, but that may be a little subjective, especially if you're like me and not experienced enough to know what "started" really means.

i have a round wire brush and sticks, havent used them yet, i will though as soon as i can. the cap should come off by just working it side to side until it comes off right? i think there must have been some big green splits when i had it choked off too soon, and that tar collected at the cap seems and glued it on there. ive already been up there and cleaned off where it dripped, that was last weekend when i meant to sweep it but discovered the stuck cap.

 

[Hardrockmaple]

I have an Austral, the ugly sister to your stove. I let my flue temps climb to 250-300 before shutting the bypass on a cold start, try it, you may hear some 'tinkling' sounds going up your chimney.

 

[Dogbyte]

I have an Austral, the ugly sister to your stove. I let my flue temps climb to 250-300 before shutting the bypass on a cold start, try it, you may hear some 'tinkling' sounds going up your chimney.

Yeah im running single wall up to the support box, and when i peck on it, i can tell its not dull, but a bright sound. but when i really bump it, i can get more of that tinkling sound from up above, and its probably like USMC80 says, the flaky creosote, i just dont know if my hotter fires recently is jarring some of that loose, or if its building up to the point that its coming off on its own, and any sudden gust of air dislodges it. i will be able to know more when i get an eye on it, but i still dont think im running this stove like she is capable of. heat out put is fine, if it was any hotter it would run us out of the living room. i just gotta get to where im not throwing excessive moisture up the flue and condensing up there where its cooler. is 400F too hot for this stove, with the bypass open, with single wall pipe? The first section of pipe is that telescoping duravent, its only extended maybe 3 inches before it hits the first elbow, so its single wall pipe, but doubled up and still inside the sleeve. from the support box up to the cap is class A duravent, 12ft.

i guess it would help to know the upper limits on how hot i can get that single wall before shutting it down, because i think i do that too soon sometimes still, i see 400F on the thermometer 18inches up on the flue, and i feel like i have to start shutting it down.

 

[Hardrockmaple]

400 on single walled stove pipe is not to hot (measured external temp), I don't start shutting my stove down 'til the stove top hits 500-550. As the stove top temps climb and your slowly cutting back the primary air, your stack temps will drop back on their own. You may have to expand that room......

 

[Dogbyte]

It did it again today when I got home, and after this evenings small fire that I try to time for the overnight load, just to get a good coal bed. I burn the fire wide open, bypass open today til 400, then shut the bypass, and 50% air, a good hot fire. Flue temps came down on its own and parked at 300 til it was only coals. So just 10 min ago, I'm opening the door and I hear all that tinkling sounds again in the flue. I rake the coals forward, go outside, grab 3 good splits, load them in there, and as I shut the door I hear more tinkling. Now I hear random tinkling sounds as the fire is getting back up to speed.

So this has happened for the past half dozen fires or so. What I'd consider good low smoke fires, even when the temps drop below 200 in the flue, by then it's just red hot coals, hardly any smoke. I don't know if it's cleaning itself out or just dropping the days collection, can't imagine it's the ladder, hope it's the former.

 

[Dogbyte]

The glass has been good and clean for the past several weeks, so that tells me something at least.

 

[Ashful]

Cool! A non-cat stove with a bypass. Nice idea. I'm sure one of the more experienced non-cat owners will have better advice, but on my catalytic stove, I close the bypass damper when the outside of the single-wall pipe is reading 500 - 550F, about 12" - 14" above the stove flue collar. I wait 5 minutes for my catalyst to come up to operating temperature (akin to seeing your secondaries light off), and then start incrementally lowering the air (1/2, 1/4, 1/8, closed, on 5 minute increments... use a timer for consistent results).

Again, your non-cat will be similar in theory, but different on specifics.

 

[Dogbyte]

Here is the stove at its best I think.

 

[Hardrockmaple]

Cool! A non-cat stove with a bypass. Nice idea. I'm sure one of the more experienced non-cat owners will have better advice, but on my catalytic stove, I close the bypass damper when the outside of the single-wall pipe is reading 500 - 550F, about 12" - 14" above the stove flue collar. I wait 5 minutes for my catalyst to come up to operating temperature (akin to seeing your secondaries light off), and then start incrementally lowering the air (1/2, 1/4, 1/8, closed, on 5 minute increments... use a timer for consistent results).

Again, your non-cat will be similar in theory, but different on specifics.

The bypass on this series of stoves is not designed as those with a cat. The bypass hole is roughly the same size as a quarter and is tucked away in the rear left corner. Very simple operation/design. A steel tab drops down to cover the small hole (no gaskets). As per the manual, it is to be used "briefly" on start up or reload "if needed" to aid in allowing the initial smoke to find it's way up the chimney.

I expanded upon their directions as my stove just does not want to allow cold/cooler air to work it's way through the system.

From the manual:

Your stove is equipped with a bypass damper. This feature should be used, if needed, upon
start-up of the stove to help heat-up the chimney faster. The bypass damper should be closed
as soon as there is a fire going inside the firebox and smoke is moving upward through the
exhaust system. The bypass damper should also be used upon reloading to avoid smoke
spillage into the room.

 

[realstihl]

The bypass hole is roughly the same size as a quarter

I don't think so. There's two on the Drolet.

 

[Hardrockmaple]

I don't think so. There's two on the Drolet.

Perhaps I stand corrected, I've never had my stove apart. Your saying there are two, one beneath each small flap?

Nevertheless, the Drolet bypass is not designed with the same intent as stoves with cats and a bypass. There are no gaskets to prevent leakage, I can turn the bypass by hand, and they are (as per the manual) designed to partially bypass the secondaries for a minimum amount to time. My cat stove requires the damper to be open until the cat probe reads 500.

Two different animals.

 

[realstihl]

Two different animals for sure. I'm trying to get my Baltic dialed in. Seems it either two much (burning wood too fast) or not enough ( smoldering).

 

[Dogbyte]

yeah the bypass on the Myriad is two ~5inch square flaps im guessing, one on either side of the stack. The big lesson i had to learn, was coal management. having the right amount of coals, to where a load of wood will ignite really well with the bypass open and then start shutting it down somewhere past 400F. This morning, i had enough coals to start the fire back just fine, so i ran it with the bypass open for about 20 minutes ( i was in a hurry), then backed it down to about 10% air in 5 minute increments. starting with 50%, then 25%, then the final setting. when i left the house, i looked at the chimney, and there was absolutely zero smoke, only heat signatures. stove top was reading 500F, and by the time i left, the flue temp came back down below 400F, and it probably settled in somewhere around 300F like it normally does until it starts to decline with only coals... tonite when i get home, i will put a few small splits in to get another decent bed of coals around 9pm, then rinse wash and repeat. If i can keep this up, im sure my creosote issues will not come back like they were.