Ok I love this site and have been reading it for a while. Right now I have a OLD Earth Stove 1003C catalytic stove that works fine but uses a lot of wood even more than in the past. Had to load 4-5 times a day this winter. I got a price for a BK princess Parlor w/blower for 2300.00. I have no idea if this is typical on these or not? I have read enough about this model to know this is what I want (I think) This is not install just the price of the unit. Simple switch out for me. Both 6" flue and have similar clearances. Is this a good deal from you Blaze king owners and is it worth it really? Thanks!
Buyers remorse before I buy-Blaze king..
- Thread starter jstorms
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That seems like a good price. I thought they usually go for about $2600-2800
How big is your house and how large is the firebox of the Earth Stove you are currently using?
How big is your house and how large is the firebox of the Earth Stove you are currently using?
Hmm, a quick search says it is a 3 cu ft firebox. I would be concerned that the BK may not throw as much heat as the old Earth Stove.
Is this your stove?
(broken link removed to http://www.mikesheating.com/wsi/1003ces.htm)
Is this your stove?
(broken link removed to http://www.mikesheating.com/wsi/1003ces.htm)
That's not a bad price at all. I was qouted around $3600 for a princess ultra here in Michigan.
You'll be pushing the limits of a princess on the cold days, depending on insulation and drafts. It can throw heat like a 3 cu ft stove, just don't expect the long burns when you're working it hard.
You'll be pushing the limits of a princess on the cold days, depending on insulation and drafts. It can throw heat like a 3 cu ft stove, just don't expect the long burns when you're working it hard.
Thats a decent price on the Princess, has your earth stove always operated like that? Maybe you can fix it.
Sounds like you may need a new cat in that earth stove, might want to check the gaskets as well.
About $300 for a new cat and gaskets.
(broken link removed to http://www.woodstovecombustors.com/earthstove2.html)
About $300 for a new cat and gaskets.
(broken link removed to http://www.woodstovecombustors.com/earthstove2.html)
I was going to suggest the same thing...if this is doable, it certainly is a lot cheaper.
The price of the princess seems like a reasonable one.
Everybody's situation, and home construction, is different so what I'm about to say may be useless information for you...
My house is 2300 square feet...when it is below freezing for 24 hours straight, I have to load my king 1-1/2 times during that 24 hour period...1 fully packed load at night, and about a half load in the late morning on the following day. With normal temps of 20 at night and 40 during the day...24 hours on a full load is pretty typical.
Im heating about 2800 sf with my princess but when its cold I load it three times a day, I work from home so I can baby sit it and I turn the tstat up as the load burns down so I end up going through a load quicker to get more heat.
I would also check this place out for cats, very good products
http://www.firecatcombustors.com/category-s/1227.htm
I would also check this place out for cats, very good products
http://www.firecatcombustors.com/category-s/1227.htm
Thats why I plan on buying a second stove for my other floor, it has to be small due to the FP opening but I have it narrowed down to a few that fit at this point. That way I can let the BK burn on low all day on one or two loads and I can tend the second stove as needed. My choices in order are Morso 5660, Rais and the Alterra, price and wife preference will play a role.
coldsmoke
New Member
My family owns a small hearth store in Salcha Alaska where it gets 50 below and one of our best sellers are the inexpensive Timberwolf line from Napoleon. The 2200 model on average gets 10 hours which is more than the company states and can heat 1200sqft in on low fire, Napoleon says 800sqft on low but our houses are very tight up here. Our customers burn a combo of Birch and Spruce with fantastic results. I was very skeptical about Napoleon but their product has really proven it’s self.
Another great brand that gets overlooked is Archgard. The 1800 Archgard gets fantastic burn times with only a 2.0 firebox. The gasification tubes are located high in the top of the stove which makes for easy loading of the stove. Customers have reported solid 8-10 hour burn with one load and 18 hour coal life for easy restarts.
Osburn (SBI) builds a rock solid unit as well. I don’t recommend their bay front units like the1800 or the 2200 because they can be a little difficult to get fully loaded due to the design of the firebox and they are double decked meaning that they have upper shield over the upper surface of the stove. If you do get an Osburn 1800 or 2200 get the blower you'll be happier with the stove. When stove companies make statements about burn times and how their stove will magically make your cord wood last longer look at the facts.
Firewood only contains a certain amount of carbon energy and a BTU is a BTU. Example heating 1000sqft at 0 degrees outside using a Pacific Energy T5 VS a BlazeKing Princess. Get a good hot fire going in both stoves and then load 20lbs of wood into each stove. You will need roughly 32000 btus per hr.from each stove. Once going and heating the room you will find that the 2 units will burn through the same amount of wood in the same amount of time to heat the same amount of space. Remember a BTU is a BTU and no stove can make energy from nothing.
A Catalyst does not give you better burn times, all catalysts do is clog up, break apart, and rob energy that you could use to heat your home. Catalytic stoves can be turned down lower than non-cat stoves but you will notice that you will never see your fire and creosote will start to form on the inner walls of the catalytic stoves. This happens because the catalytic stove has no combustion efficiency and relies on a costly catalyst to maintain efficiency, not to mention when they are run so low your flue gas temps drop to 200 degrees or less (water vapor starts to condensate at 200) and condensation ruins chimneys and creates crystallized creosote which causes chimney fires. Then we come down to catalytic stove break down, cats have to be replaced, cats have to be made in a factory and you have to pay for them... so how efficient is a stove that relies on a part that is made in a chemical factory on the east coast that creates pollution in order to make a catalyst to make a wood stove efficient and uses precious metals like platinum and palladium. The simple fact is that a catalyst will need to be replaced, whether it is in the first year of owning the stove or 10 years down the road...it will have to be replaced eventually and more than once, usually 4-5 times within the life of the stove and at $250-$300 a pop.
In any modern stove you will have what is called Pyrolysis. When organic material (wood) is exposed to heat of 390-550 degrees F Pyrolysis starts which is the release of gas and liquid from the organic matter. This gas that is released from the wood is highly combustible and can be used to heat your home if you have the right stove. The only thing the "wood gas" does for you in a catalytic stove is help maintain catalytic temperature (cold cat=no efficiently and a blocked up cat) so in other words you don’t get to use the energy from the gas to heat your area. With a non-cat stove you have under fire air and over fire air so your combustion efficiency is spectacular, catalytic stoves like BlazeKing only use one source of combustion air, no over fire combustion air which reduces combustion efficiency. When you have a non-cat stove you will notice when you shut down the air supply you will get a brilliant blue/orange flame over your wood in the top of your stove, this is the gases produced by Pyrolysis being burnt or "lit off", my customers call it their caveman TV or Aurora in a box and it is beautiful to watch. The energy you get from the gases burning off is used to heat your area. So with a non-cat stove you have two sources of fuel to burn and get useable heat from, the "wood gas" burns first and when that is depleted your stove will burn the carbon rich fuel left behind called char.
Non-cat stoves have fewer moving parts which is great because when metal is heated and cooled it becomes week and can break and when parts break its not going to be 60 degrees outside and it sucks when you have a catalytic stove with a bypass damper that won’t open or close because of a part failure. In my opinion, if it’s not evident by what I wrote, I would go with a non-cat stove every time. Select a non-cat stove that will heat your area properly on its low to medium setting so you have room to turn the stove up during cold snaps, use properly seasoned fire wood, if at all possible, and enjoy an appliance that will treat you and your wallet respectfully.
Happy burning
Another great brand that gets overlooked is Archgard. The 1800 Archgard gets fantastic burn times with only a 2.0 firebox. The gasification tubes are located high in the top of the stove which makes for easy loading of the stove. Customers have reported solid 8-10 hour burn with one load and 18 hour coal life for easy restarts.
Osburn (SBI) builds a rock solid unit as well. I don’t recommend their bay front units like the1800 or the 2200 because they can be a little difficult to get fully loaded due to the design of the firebox and they are double decked meaning that they have upper shield over the upper surface of the stove. If you do get an Osburn 1800 or 2200 get the blower you'll be happier with the stove. When stove companies make statements about burn times and how their stove will magically make your cord wood last longer look at the facts.
Firewood only contains a certain amount of carbon energy and a BTU is a BTU. Example heating 1000sqft at 0 degrees outside using a Pacific Energy T5 VS a BlazeKing Princess. Get a good hot fire going in both stoves and then load 20lbs of wood into each stove. You will need roughly 32000 btus per hr.from each stove. Once going and heating the room you will find that the 2 units will burn through the same amount of wood in the same amount of time to heat the same amount of space. Remember a BTU is a BTU and no stove can make energy from nothing.
A Catalyst does not give you better burn times, all catalysts do is clog up, break apart, and rob energy that you could use to heat your home. Catalytic stoves can be turned down lower than non-cat stoves but you will notice that you will never see your fire and creosote will start to form on the inner walls of the catalytic stoves. This happens because the catalytic stove has no combustion efficiency and relies on a costly catalyst to maintain efficiency, not to mention when they are run so low your flue gas temps drop to 200 degrees or less (water vapor starts to condensate at 200) and condensation ruins chimneys and creates crystallized creosote which causes chimney fires. Then we come down to catalytic stove break down, cats have to be replaced, cats have to be made in a factory and you have to pay for them... so how efficient is a stove that relies on a part that is made in a chemical factory on the east coast that creates pollution in order to make a catalyst to make a wood stove efficient and uses precious metals like platinum and palladium. The simple fact is that a catalyst will need to be replaced, whether it is in the first year of owning the stove or 10 years down the road...it will have to be replaced eventually and more than once, usually 4-5 times within the life of the stove and at $250-$300 a pop.
In any modern stove you will have what is called Pyrolysis. When organic material (wood) is exposed to heat of 390-550 degrees F Pyrolysis starts which is the release of gas and liquid from the organic matter. This gas that is released from the wood is highly combustible and can be used to heat your home if you have the right stove. The only thing the "wood gas" does for you in a catalytic stove is help maintain catalytic temperature (cold cat=no efficiently and a blocked up cat) so in other words you don’t get to use the energy from the gas to heat your area. With a non-cat stove you have under fire air and over fire air so your combustion efficiency is spectacular, catalytic stoves like BlazeKing only use one source of combustion air, no over fire combustion air which reduces combustion efficiency. When you have a non-cat stove you will notice when you shut down the air supply you will get a brilliant blue/orange flame over your wood in the top of your stove, this is the gases produced by Pyrolysis being burnt or "lit off", my customers call it their caveman TV or Aurora in a box and it is beautiful to watch. The energy you get from the gases burning off is used to heat your area. So with a non-cat stove you have two sources of fuel to burn and get useable heat from, the "wood gas" burns first and when that is depleted your stove will burn the carbon rich fuel left behind called char.
Non-cat stoves have fewer moving parts which is great because when metal is heated and cooled it becomes week and can break and when parts break its not going to be 60 degrees outside and it sucks when you have a catalytic stove with a bypass damper that won’t open or close because of a part failure. In my opinion, if it’s not evident by what I wrote, I would go with a non-cat stove every time. Select a non-cat stove that will heat your area properly on its low to medium setting so you have room to turn the stove up during cold snaps, use properly seasoned fire wood, if at all possible, and enjoy an appliance that will treat you and your wallet respectfully.
Happy burning
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coldsmoke
New Member
I have plenty of opportunity to sell cat stoves from Regency,VC, Kuma, Etc. but we choose to sell and burn non-cat stoves. We have customers and friends that have cat stoves and they like them but they also have non-cat stoves and rave about them. Cat stoves are good for some but just not for me. We burn an absurd amount of wood in the Interior of Alaska because of our extreme low temps of 50 below or colder condensate is a major issue.
As we all know crystallized creosote is dangerous and that’s what forms when stack temps are too low not to mention some people burn wood that has too much moisture content and cat stoves just can’t take the higher moisture and I’m talking about 18-20% which really isn’t that high (too high for me I prefer about 10%). If you have an out then up chimney then you can get into trouble quick if you don’t have an insulated chase built around your chimney, chimney fires and yes they can and do happen often with BlazeKing,VC,Kuma, Etc. No stove is perfect and they are all susceptible to chimney fires if you don’t maintain your chimney.
We sell Olympia Chimney for a reason, life time guarantee as long as you purchase their 316 Stainless Steele and yes its lifetime no replacement cost ever even if you burn coal. There’s nothing I hate more than telling a customer that they have to purchase replacement parts or the chimney they purchased has failed because of a stack fire and its going to cost $$$ to get it fixed. We have to sell product to stay open yes but I want to sell products that are simple to use, cost effective, and last years trouble free. In my opinion Masonry Heaters with a TEG generator are the best choice but they cost a bundle
Thanks for the warm welcome.
P.S. Take a look at these pictures, these came from a stove owner who has been burning wood for over 40 years and this is in his second blaze king. The moisture content in his wood was 7.8% and all of this was accumulated within 2 months during a cold snap of -50. He ended up having to replace all of his chimney because of damage caused by the creasote and he replaced his blaze king with a non-cat stove because of the higher flue gas temperatures and he has never looked back.
![[Hearth.com] Buyers remorse before I buy-Blaze king..](https://www.hearth.com/talk/data/attachments/65/65048-1a28ce3fc2d439097533198788ee7f24.jpg?hash=uotI7XK5Qc "[Hearth.com] Buyers remorse before I buy-Blaze king..")
![[Hearth.com] Buyers remorse before I buy-Blaze king..](https://www.hearth.com/talk/data/attachments/65/65051-f0283464d44e867a1a6cf7a364d111c1.jpg?hash=5D0Uap0Ioq "[Hearth.com] Buyers remorse before I buy-Blaze king..")
As we all know crystallized creosote is dangerous and that’s what forms when stack temps are too low not to mention some people burn wood that has too much moisture content and cat stoves just can’t take the higher moisture and I’m talking about 18-20% which really isn’t that high (too high for me I prefer about 10%). If you have an out then up chimney then you can get into trouble quick if you don’t have an insulated chase built around your chimney, chimney fires and yes they can and do happen often with BlazeKing,VC,Kuma, Etc. No stove is perfect and they are all susceptible to chimney fires if you don’t maintain your chimney.
We sell Olympia Chimney for a reason, life time guarantee as long as you purchase their 316 Stainless Steele and yes its lifetime no replacement cost ever even if you burn coal. There’s nothing I hate more than telling a customer that they have to purchase replacement parts or the chimney they purchased has failed because of a stack fire and its going to cost $$$ to get it fixed. We have to sell product to stay open yes but I want to sell products that are simple to use, cost effective, and last years trouble free. In my opinion Masonry Heaters with a TEG generator are the best choice but they cost a bundle
Thanks for the warm welcome.
P.S. Take a look at these pictures, these came from a stove owner who has been burning wood for over 40 years and this is in his second blaze king. The moisture content in his wood was 7.8% and all of this was accumulated within 2 months during a cold snap of -50. He ended up having to replace all of his chimney because of damage caused by the creasote and he replaced his blaze king with a non-cat stove because of the higher flue gas temperatures and he has never looked back.
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![[Hearth.com] Buyers remorse before I buy-Blaze king..](/talk/data/attachments/65/65050-5ec0a28042047b0c257ea4a8aeeac57d.jpg?hash=5D0Uap0Ioq)
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I think he is saying they couldn't get a dealership agreement with a cat stove manufacturer.
My thoughts exactly, Id also like to sell him a paragraph or two.
Theres several burners on the forum from Alaska burning BK's and Im pretty sure they dont have a creosote problem like the one your showing, there must have been something else going on to get creosote built up like that.
I'd like to know how you get wood down below 10% moisture? I can see where your coming from with low flue temps but if a cat stove is burned properly in a proper setup there shouldn't be any creosote making nasties left after it gets burned up in the cat.
The reason for creosote is not a catalyst, it is burning poor fuel or not operating the stove properly. We used to get creosote with our old stove but 5 years ago we purchased a Woodstock cat stove. In those 5 years (wood heat is our only heat) we have cleaned our chimney one time and got about a cup full of soot and no creosote. Today that chimney is still clean. If memory serves me we cleaned at the end of our second winter. Nope. No creosote here. We love our cat stove.
coldsmoke
New Member
Well Im through here. Not going to argue with someone from Massachusetts, not worth my time. I prefer intelligent conversations. When the temp drops below -20 wood dries quicker than it does in the summer, it still has to be split. Wood dries better in the interior of Alaska better because we are classified as a desert and we have very low precipitation and humidity. The wood Im burning now is 8.8% moisture. Its hard to get it below 4% and thats too dry.
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