Considering a some kind of Draft Inducer?

[RDabate]

OK, so, I've had my EKO 25 for few years now, and the darn things always leaks out so much smoke when I open the door to start a burn. I was thinking of setting up some kind of draft inducer that would only be used when I'm opening the door to load wood, or start the burn. Thoughts on this and suggestions?

 

[Fred61]

Why is the upper door open when you're lighting a fire? Are you lighting your fire through the loading door? Light your fire from the lower chamber through the nozzle. I have a draft inducer installed and don't use it. Doesn't work well.

 

[RDabate]

How would I start a fire from the lower door? The wood loads on top, that where the fire is?

 

[maple1]

I don't have an Eko, but I light mine thru the bottom chamber. I use a small propane torch & just stick it up through a bottom hole.

That said, before I do that I light off a couple of pieces of crumpled up paper in the upper (wood) chamber first to help start a draft going up the chimney.

 

[Fred61]

What Maple said except I don't use paper to enhance draft. Scrape as much charcoal as possible over the nozzle, add 2 or three small dry splits then 2 or 3 larger splits on top and aim a propane torch up through the nozzle until you see the reflection of glowing coals on the target bricks, remove torch, quickly close door start fan and close bypass damper.

I batch burn so I try to load just enough wood to achieve my desired storage temperature about the same time the fire is burned out but try to shut off the boiler master switch while there is still a good amount of charred wood in the chamber to have for starting the next day's fire. It's real easy and doesn't take me any more than 7 to 10 minutes.

 

[stee6043]

There are a few camps on "fire starting" here on the hearth. I'm with the guys above, I always start mine from the lower chamber with a propane torch. Ligh the torch, shove the tip up the nozzle from below (sounds dirty) and presto - fire with the upper door closed.

How you prepare the upper chamber for fire is a bit of an art. I use newspaper, some kindling and a few small splits of wood. I also usually use a very small chunk of fire starter stick to make sure she lights off on the first try.

As for the inducer, save your money. They aren't worth the metal they're made from if your ultimate goal is to open the upper door mid-fire and keep smoke from coming out. Even during cold starts they are marginally useful, if at all.

 

[RDabate]

so, do you guys keep the system / fan on while starting?

 

[Fred61]

Read my post above. I have the sequence listed in order. In the past, I used paper and kindling with small splits on top, started it with a torch up through the nozzle and left the bottom door open until the kindling ignited the smaller splits but that procedure took more time, burned up the valuable charcoal and smoked up the neighborhood in the process. The procedure I described above gives you instant gasification and doesn't smoke.

Actually I do use the fan. After performing the last task in the above sequence which is "close the bypass damper", I listen through the draft fan opening to confirm the rumbling which indicates gassing.

 

[stee6043]

so, do you guys keep the system / fan on while starting?

I do not have the fan on during start but the system is on. I don't start the fan until I see 400 degrees +/- on my flue temps. This usually takes 10-20 minutes after I light the fire, depending on the day.

 

[goosegunner]

I light mine like Fred61, except I light from top with a cane torch. I have a timer that I use to shut off fan so coals are left from previous burn. When my flue temp hits 200-220F I close the bypass damper. The left over coals allow instant gasification.

1. Rake coals over nozzle.
2. Get coals glowing with cane torch
3. Two pieces of crumpled newspaper, kindling, paper, wood
4. Light upper paper with torch
5. Fan on until flue temp 200-225F
6. Close bypass, rumble begins

You have to be fast when load but when using the cane torch from the top you have a good reach into the firebox and you don't have to get on the floor to reach into the nozzle.

gg

 

[rkusek]

I have my own way I guess. I used to use the propane torch but I'm never there to shut it off to save any coals and I don't use a timer setup either. I don't use newspaper or thick ardboard but I have a large trash can of thin cardboard (like from 12 packs) that I save from grocery packaging and tear them up in small pieces (4-5") so they pack nice in the trash can.

1) Place about dozen pieces of the thin cardboard pieces over nozzle leaving a path for air to flow through.

2) Add 2-3 of my smallest (I split small too) driest splits over the carboard oriented leaving a path for the air to the nozzle.

3) Light the cardboard from the upper door with a butane grill lighter with the lower door wide open. Fan stays off. The cardboard of course lights quick and takes about 10-15" to turn the very small splits to a red hot bed. Because this burns so hot the chimney warms up quick and I have nothing visible out of the stack much like when gassifying. This is usually when I bring a wagon load of wood inside to re-stock my supply. If for some reason, I would get sidetracked, there is not enough wood in the stove to cause an overheat issue.

4) After the 10-15", I can close the lower door, wait about 2 sec then open the upper door. The burn will change directions and flow down through the nozzle and back up through the fire tubes to the chimney like when gassifying even with the upper door open. I usually load the upper chamber fairly quickly at this point (<1 minute) without any smoke coming out the upper door. Close the bypass and start the fan.

I guess I didn't have enough charcoal left for the propane torch to work right. I also found it also started the whole load of wood on fire which seems to contribute to huffing and puffing later. Maybe the guys above are coming back later to load it full but I don't like to do that either because of the smoke issue. I'm sure you have found that reloading works best when it has burned down to a hot bed of coals to avoid the smoke. I think every person on here that bought the draft inducer said it was a POS and no longer use it. A smoke hood with exhaust fan outside (like the Wood Gun guys use) would be a better solution if none of the methods discussed in this thread work for you.

 

[Fred61]

Actually with the charcoal method I use, I can load the fuel chamber full at the time of lighting since I'm not trying to increase nor do I pay attention to the flue temperature. It really doesn't make much difference to me since I don't get any smoke out into the room when I open the door slowly if the unit is fully gassing. When or if I do reload, I don't even shut off the combustion fan which, I'm sure doesn't make a difference one way or another. If everything is hot I can see the gasses flowing down through the nozzle as opposed to going through the bypass which indicates to me that the natural draft is still causing gassing.

 

[RDabate]

Words can't describe how much I dislike starting fires with this thing. From a cold start, it takes me forever. I'm beginning to wonder if this is even worth my time and effort. I start a small burn, see some flames, turn the controller on, put some more logs on top, come back in ten minutes and it's all smoke!

 

[mr.fixit]

Words can't describe how much I dislike starting fires with this thing. From a cold start, it takes me forever. I'm beginning to wonder if this is even worth my time and effort. I start a small burn, see some flames, turn the controller on, put some more logs on top, come back in ten minutes and it's all smoke!

I don't get it. The only thing that would make these things easier to get started would be a gas fired auto start!
Maybe you need to do some tuning of your air adjustments,or is it possible that your wood is not dry enough?

 

[Fred61]

Words can't describe how much I dislike starting fires with this thing. From a cold start, it takes me forever. I'm beginning to wonder if this is even worth my time and effort. I start a small burn, see some flames, turn the controller on, put some more logs on top, come back in ten minutes and it's all smoke!

Not a problem for me. Takes only a few minutes out of my day. Try some of the techniques discussed above. I'm surprised to see this statement this far into this thread. I can only assume you haven't tried any of the suggestions.

 

[RDabate]

Had a bad day, and haven't tried anything new yet. I need to go out and get a propane torch.

 

[JP11]

I learned something after having a few really bad start experiences.

My raking the coals around and covering the nozzle was dumb! Not that it's not good to cover the nozzle.. it is. But I was CHOKING IT!

stuff I raked around a few starts in a row had too much ash. It wasn't allowing ANY draft thru.

After wondering why the heck dry wood would not catch. I discovered my error.

Poked a hole up thru ash from the bottom.. away it went.

Dumb! But I did it.

JP

 

[RDabate]

How do you handling not waking up to a dead stove with no coals? Do you wake up in the middle of the night and or do you have something automated that tells you when the temp get's to a certain point? I had a idea to get one of those high temperature wireless grill thermometers, and was thinking of placing the temperature sensor where the current one is, then placing the device next to my night stand, so when the temp get's to a certain point, I know to go down and put some logs on?

 

[maple1]

If the house won't take the heat from the boiler, there's no sense in keeping the fire going just to keep the fire going and void relighting it - that will lead to creosote buildup from idling to no end. Smaller more frequent fires.

Are you sure your wood is dry? And your boiler is clean? Everywhere?

It should be no problem to start a fire with a yes to both.

 

[RDabate]

My oil burner is still my secondary heat source for when the wood boiler stops working. Like right now, I burned most of the night, and now I hear my oil furnace going on because the fire went out. This is why I thought I'd try to keep reloading in the middle of the night just when there are just coals.

 

[Fred61]

If your boiler won't carry you through a 30 degree night it has to be severely undersized for your home.

 

[RDabate]

If your boiler won't carry you through a 30 degree night it has to be severely undersized for your home.

This has been my main concern for some time. I was sold this Boiler, but the installer really didn't know what he was doing. I think the missing part in my setup here is mass storage?

 

[Fred61]

Storage could help but if your boiler is running flat out all the time to maintain your heating needs then there won't be enough extra output to charge storage.

 

[RDabate]

Storage could help but if your boiler is running flat out all the time to maintain your heating needs then there won't be enough extra output to charge storage.

So, for your setup, you can make it through the night, and wake up to a burn, and or coals?

 

[stee6043]

This has been my main concern for some time. I was sold this Boiler, but the installer really didn't know what he was doing. I think the missing part in my setup here is mass storage?

Hmm...lots of things going on in this thread!

Your EKO 25 should be running somewhere in the 50-60k output btu per hour pretty consistently assuming you've got decent wood. With a full load I have a hard time believing you can't get 6-8 hours with some idling on a 2800 square foot home built this century. How many hours do you consider "overnight"? And are you filling that boiler 100% full before you hit the hay for the night?

Another thought - I never had any luck using the fan during cold starts. I start my boiler every day without a single coal left in the boiler. I really have to let the fire get going before hitting go to be successful. My experience is that the fan will put the fire out if its turned on too early. My experience only, however.