Constant smoke when door is open

[ylekyote]

I have a new Vogelzang Durango wood stove (it's a box stove style, 26" depth by 11" width/height firebox). I put it in my home where my previous EPA stove sat, and an older catalyst stove before that. Both of those burned fine.

This stove puffs smoke out of the front when lighting it cold, and after it's hot too, if the door is opened. If the fire is tall some flame will also leap out the front a few inches. Not all of the time, and maybe not all of the smoke chooses to wrongfully exit out the door, but at least 50% time/quantity. Once I close the door it burns fine. The exit port for the firebox is in the top front of the stove, where the door opens. I have checked all the joints and even added foil tape to them to see if there was a leak by chance. Did not make a difference. I've looked for obstructions and there aren't any.

I have 6" Duravent double wall pipe from stove flue collar to ceiling (almost 6 feet), and then it expands to an 8" stack (13 feet) to the cap above the roof. Stack top is 3 feet above highest portion of roof, which is about 17 feet away. I called manufacturer and sent pictures of system. Adjusted some interior insulation and fiber boards above the reburn pipes. Manufacturer says system seems very good, possibly too good. It thinks I possibly have too much draft due to too much chimney. Really? Too much draft is causing it to billow smoke from the open door? Wouldn't too much draft cause it to burn more aggressively?

Again, my two previous stoves had no problems. It lights and burns fine. I have two temp gauges, top of stove reaches 850 deg F, and 18" above collar on pipe reaches 250 deg F within 20 - 25 minutes of loading it half full (3-4 splits). I've tried cracking doors and windows, opening them wide too, and fans. I've also tried opening the stove door slowly, fast, a little and wide. The wind isn't blowing and it's presently mild weather...about 45-50 degrees F. My elevation is 6,000 feet, western central CO. Nothing changes the misbehavior. Please help. Manufacturers phone agent (didn't sound very sure of herself) suggested if draft was too strong it can cause symptoms similar to poor draft. Is that true? What else can I try? Thank you very much! Winter is almost here! andy

 

[realstihl]

Not too much draft, I can tell you that.

 

[begreen]

The increase to 8" is not helping. Some stoves need more draft than others and a lot more chimney is required for high altitude installs. This chart is from Enviro for the Kodiak stoves. Click to enlarge.

 

[begreen]

The exit port for the firebox is in the top front of the stove, where the door opens.

Not following here. The Durango's flue exits at the rear of the stove.

 

[begreen]

One thing to check is to make sure that the ceramic blanket on top of the baffle is laying flat and not bunched up toward the back of the stove under the flue collar opening. That will restrict draft. Some manufacturers place a ~4"sq. flat plate on the blanket to help it lay flat and stay in place. I don't see one in the diagram for this stove.

 

[ylekyote]

The flue is at the rear, but the smoke/heat exits the firebox at the front top of the firebox, travels across the insulated blanket that lays across the fiber boards (that cover the return pipes) and then goes out the flue pipe at the rear. It has a good long heat run before going out to the pipe, which I guess is why it heats up so well.

Oh, let me add it misbehaved the same when I cured it outside with 4 good burns. Cold to hot and hot to cold. At the time I only had a 4 foot segment of pipe on the collar, and it was on my patio with the air partly blocked because it was 20 feet away from my walkout basement. I assumed it was due to that so I installed it anyway.

Actually my total stack height is closer to 21 to 22 feet. Almost 6 inside, and 16+ feet (ceiling box plus exterior pipe, also double or triple walled).

Yes I'll let it cool and check the stove and pipe again tomorrow. I found it odd it did the same when I cured it outside with 4' pipe and beside my lower level, over a 3 day period. Thanks!

 

[ylekyote]

Hey I was reading mishaps and/or defects with wood stoves and when people are talking about temperatures are they speaking of readings taken 18" up from the flue collar on the pipe right? My stove top reaches 800+ 1/3 to 1/2 loaded, on the top middle of its plating, but only 250 - 300 on the pipe. People are freaking out about 700 degree pipe temps right? It would be hard to keep my stove top below 700.

 

[jb6l6gc]

Outdoor air or makup air???

 

[ylekyote]

Outdoor air or makup air???

Hi. What do you mean or which part of my questions are you referring to? I'm still seasoning, sorta green...lol

 

[Huntindog1]

I dont see how you can have a 850 degree stove top temp and only a 250 degree pipe 18" up.

One of your gauges must be not working.

Can you switch the gauges and see what they read.

 

[Huntindog1]

I have an over sized 7" x 11" Masonry Flue with a 8" thimble. I had the Vogelzang Ponderosa with the 6" outlet.

I had trouble feeding the larger flue with 6" pipe so I put an adapter right on top of the stove and ran 8" all the way to the larger flue.

Worked much better as the more volume 8" pipe starting at the hottest part of the system, the top of the stove fixed the poor draft issues.

 

[jb6l6gc]

Hi. What do you mean or which part of my questions are you referring to? I'm still seasoning, sorta green...lol

I mean is it possible you are creating a negative pressure in house when stove running. Needing outdoor air or makeup air

 

[Huntindog1]

I mean is it possible you are creating a negative pressure in house when stove running. Needing outdoor air or makeup air

Try cracking a window and see if it helps.

 

[Grisu]

I have 6" Duravent double wall pipe from stove flue collar to ceiling

Do you have a probe thermometer? If not your flue temp readings from your surface thermometer are not really telling you anything. For double wall pipe you need a probe thermometer to measure internal flue temps. You may be sending a lot more heat up the flue than you are thinking.

 

[Copper44]

I just put one in a barn that I have and it works great. I only have about 13' feet of chimney though.

Wonder if you got a defective unit.

 

[begreen]

Cooper, could be, though you're at a much lower altitude I would guess. With 850F stovetop temps that stove is not going to last long. Something isn't right. Doesn't help when the support person sounds like he/she is blowing smoke too.

Check the blanket so that at least you can cross that off the list of possible issues.

 

[Wisneaky]

If your hitting 850 degree stove top temp I'd hate to know what your internal flue temp is because it has to be really high.

 

[Huntindog1]

Once you get it burning ok , take note of this, that the stove has a really long burn time for its size. Now most ratings can be thrown out the window but with this stove being 26" deep, if you in the future cut your wood lets say 25" you can rake your coals forward to the front so the only hot coals are at one end of your 25" long splits. This makes for a cigar burn, burning one end then the burn moves towards the back. Should increase your burn times.

 

[ylekyote]

I just put one in a barn that I have and it works great. I only have about 13' feet of chimney though.

Wonder if you got a defective unit.

What temp does yours reach on the top? Also, was your door really hard to close at first until the seal got smashed in some? Mine is REALLY hard to close. Maker said it was the new seal...but its ridiculously hard. My wife can't even lock it entirely.

I swapped gauges and they both report the same on top. Neither seems defective.

I've tried cracking windows/doors and opening them full...no difference.

I'm checking the insulation blanket tomorrow after it cools down, and the stack run again just in case. I will also check how level it is. Someone said just a little off (if front is a little higher than rear) it's possible to cause a little issue. But I can't imagine it's unlevel for one, or that's true to begin with if draft is really good.

My last EPA stove with same pipe run, but different brand pipe on the interior, was also double walled. My same temp gauges would commonly read (on the pipe) up to 500+ on a good hot burn. Someone said the best EPA stoves rob so much of the heat that the pipe gets less than traditional stoves.

This makes no sense. If the top and pipe is clear, it must be a defective stove.

 

[bholler]

My same temp gauges would commonly read (on the pipe) up to 500+ on a good hot burn.

you were getting 500 on the outside of double wall pipe? Wow if that is right you were seriously overfiring that stove. for double wall you need a prope themometer

 

[ylekyote]

you were getting 500 on the outside of double wall pipe? Wow if that is right you were seriously overfiring that stove. for double wall you need a prope themometer

Why what's the max supposed to be 18" above the flue collar?

 

[bholler]

Why what's the max supposed to be 18" above the flue collar?

Are you taking the readings on the outside of double wall pipe? If i have no idea what the max is but if you are at 500 on the outside you have to be over 1000 inside. If you are measuring that on the outside of single wall you are in the upper range of normal.

 

[ylekyote]

Are you taking the readings on the outside of double wall pipe? If i have no idea what the max is but if you are at 500 on the outside you have to be over 1000 inside. If you are measuring that on the outside of single wall you are in the upper range of normal.

Outside of duravent brand double walled. I didn't know there was an interior gauge for double walled pipes. When I looked for gauges in stores and online those didnt show up. Makes sense though. I had pondered that but never looked into it.

So if my exterior wall reads 300 it's double that on interior wall?

What's the correct nomenclature for these interior probe gages?

 

[Wisneaky]

You are closing that front intake damper right?

 

[ylekyote]

When it's good and started and I'm not observing it, yes. Those temps I listed are with it fully open as I watch it.

When I leave room or go to bed I close it 2/3 way.