Did you ever cheat on your wo.........

[Shari]

If you're going to be out of town, turn your water off at the outside source, then turn all your faucets on to let the water that was in the pipes drain out. The end!

~Rose

Ah but you still have water in your sink/tub/toilet drain traps. Our 'vacation spot' is a travel trailer. When we 'winterize' it, we disconnect water input, open all faucets, flush the toilet and then use an air compressor to blow any remaining water out of the fresh water lines. After that is done we add RV antifreeze to all sink traps and the toilet. Oops - almost forgot - also drain the water heater. Considering Wisconsin can get sub-zero temps the above method has worked well for us.

Shari

 

[BrotherBart]

I have always loved the "water in the traps" thing. With the rest of the pipe empty there is more than enough expansion room for the water to freeze without hurting anything. As the water freezes and expands it takes the path of least resistance. That being into the empty part of the pipe. Not through the wall of the pipe.

 

[Shari]

I have always loved the "water in the traps" thing. With the rest of the pipe empty there is more than enough expansion room for the water to freeze without hurting anything. As the water freezes and expands it takes the path of least resistance. That being into the empty part of the pipe. Not through the wall of the pipe.

Not to differ with your opinion, but in my 30+ years of selling real estate has shown me vacant homes 'winterized' with antifreeze in sink/tub/toilet traps and specifically tagged "Do Not Use - Winterized". Just as ice will follow the path of least resistance it also causes sideways pressure: http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/137244/how_to_help_prevent_frozen_water_pipes.html?cat=6

and here is another example: http://www.hammerzone.com/archives/plumbing/systems/supply/burst_pipe.htm

Shari

 

[BrotherBart]

Actually reading those enforces what I said. It needs room to expand. If the rest of the pipe is empty then it just expands to that portion of the empty pipe. This theory has been tested in this joint at least five times in twenty five winters.

Now leaving a toilet tank and bowl full in the draining process is majorly stupid. But traps with an open sink above, and empty pipe below ain't gonna bust a pipe.. :smirk:

 

[Shari]

BB,

Given the forum we are in my only concern, with wood heat supplying heat to our ranch style home living area, is "When it is -30 degrees outside, will my pipes freeze in my unheated basement?" Considering we have only had full-time wood heat from February-May 2010 we haven't had any problem (yet). This is something I plan on keeping a close eye on this season - plus we can always switch on the oil heat for a burst of heat to the basement if the temps down there get too low as there is one heat vent in the basement.

Shari

 

[fire_man]

Sorry if this is a little off topic - just king of an interesting point that describes why iced pipes actually burst.

I found this on weather.com:

Why Pipes Burst

Surprisingly, ice forming in a pipe does not typically cause a break where the ice blockage occurs. It's not the radial expansion of ice against the wall of the pipe that causes the break. Rather, following a complete ice blockage in a pipe, continued freezing and expansion inside the pipe causes water pressure to increase downstream -- between the ice blockage and a closed faucet at the end. It's this increase in water pressure that leads to pipe failure. Usually the pipe bursts where little or no ice has formed. Upstream from the ice blockage the water can always retreat back towards its source, so there is no pressure build-up to cause a break. Water has to freeze for ice blockages to occur. Pipes that are adequately protected along their entire length by placement within the building's insulation, insulation on the pipe itself, or heating, are safe.

 

[SolarAndWood]

Our supply lines have frozen a number of times since we sent the propane man packing. Whatever the wonder material they plumbed the house with in the 60s has never failed even with long sections frozen solid. The copper at our family's camp hasn't done so well even with the compressed air trick. A garden hose now runs through it until the recycled copper makes a down payment on the latest wonder material to replace it.

 

[North of 60]

Actually reading those enforces what I said. It needs room to expand. If the rest of the pipe is empty then it just expands to that portion of the empty pipe. This theory has been tested in this joint at least five times in twenty five winters.

Now leaving a toilet tank and bowl full in the draining process is majorly stupid. But traps with an open sink above, and empty pipe below ain't gonna bust a pipe.. :smirk:

You are very wrong with this one my friend. The two exposed faces of the water in the traps freeze 1st. Then the water between the frozen ends freeze after. A 1/2" of frozen water in a pipe can hold back over 500psi. I do tie-ins and valve installs using freeze kits holding back water. I have been in buildings after major power outage and have had to repair the damages. Seen it done it.

 

[North of 60]

If you're going to be out of town, turn your water off at the outside source, then turn all your faucets on to let the water that was in the pipes drain out. The end!
Rose

You forgot to add, CALL A PLUMBER when you return. Just the beginning!

 

[begreen]

Actually reading those enforces what I said. It needs room to expand. If the rest of the pipe is empty then it just expands to that portion of the empty pipe. This theory has been tested in this joint at least five times in twenty five winters.

Now leaving a toilet tank and bowl full in the draining process is majorly stupid. But traps with an open sink above, and empty pipe below ain't gonna bust a pipe.. :smirk:

You are very wrong with this one my friend. The two exposed faces of the water in the traps freeze 1st. Then the water between the frozen ends freeze after. A 1/2" of frozen water in a pipe can hold back over 500psi. I do tie-ins and valve installs using freeze kits holding back water. I have been in buildings after major power outage and have had to repair the damages. Seen it done it.

The difference between a 25°F freeze and a -25°F freeze? or 38° north and 62° north?

 

[nate379]

Boiler says on all year as it makes hot water for the tap. I keep the thermostats on the house at 65* as well. I don't like to pay the gas bill, but no sense in being cold or having pipes freeze cause I'm too cheap to turn the heat on!

I have worked on many frozen pipes and it's not often I see them split other than the thin wall copper (yeah which was used in my house... awesome huh?)

I did a washer drain, complaint was that it was flooding the floor every winter if they didn't have a special switch turned on. Odd right? Well the previous owner of the house had put a heat tape on the PVC pipe and wrapped it in like 1/2" thick of tape and "wired" it with lamp cord to an outlet that was hanging off the back of the washer! The heat tape had melted almost all the way into through the pipe!

Anyhow, the pipe which was about 3ft long was completely froze up. What I couldn't understand was the trap was not frozen or anything after that, just the stand pipe from about 6" at teh top to about 6" from the trap. The pipe was in an exterior wall, but on the inside wall of a double 2x6 construction. I don't know why but in the wall was freezing cold.

I ended up running the pipe on the inside of the wall behind the washer and down through the floor into the crawlspace. Fixed with under $10 of parts. Makes you wonder why on earth they let it go for so long! Not as nice as having the washer box, but it was better than tearing out the wall to fix the insulation issue.

 

[OhioBurner©]

Folks dont actually drain there whole plumbing just for a weekend out of town do you? Were gone frequently, but not usually more than 2 days. I've never heard of anyone doing this before. I've shut off the hot water heater before, on once-a-year longer trips, but never bothered to drain all the plumbing in winter - I'd leave the furnace on. For folks without any backup though I suppose have no choice. I gotta hand it to you folks that get by without any backup...

 

[RoseRedHoofbeats]

Well, it's what we did at my house whenever we took a long trip cause my parents didn't want to leave the furnace on. But that was in South Texas where the coldest it will ever get is MAYBE down into the twenties at night for about fifty seconds. So probably different from what people with -20 temps deal with!

~Rose