Do I have good stove? Can run for 14+ hours on a single load of cottonwood.

[onlinefunner]

Conditions:

It prob averaged 50 degrees outside here today (30 degrees now), and
the house is probably average or below average insulated (builders were cheap on things here).
I filled the firebox with cottonwood, cut prob a year ago, and not covered during that time.

House stayed about 75 degrees all day, and after 18 hours, the house was jr 70 degrees. By 22 hours, there were still hot coals.

I measured the interior of the firebox to be 17x18x21". Seems to smolder most of the time (maybe because its cottonwood), which i dont know if thats a problem.


QUESTION:

I am thinking of replacing my stove with a BK, since mine is from a manufacturer in Montana that no longer exists (LA stove from Filson), but since I never have owned a wood stove before, would I be wasting money to swap this out?

14 hours of burn time seems high, but not sure due to conditions I listed.

What do you think?

 

[Highbeam]

Old smoke dragons could smolder wood for a long long time while polluting like crazy. That long burn ability is mostly lost with modern stoves but you can still get it with a catalytic BK and sometimes with a catalytic Woodstock stove. I've burned cottonwood in my BK and it works fine. 20 hours is not out of the question using large splits and a very low burn rate. Of course, when you need more heat the burn time can be reduced in order to release more heat faster. The wood only has so much energy stored up.

 

[begreen]

Sounds like a decent stove based on the burn times. We see very little about the LA stove. Could you post some pictures of it? Interior pictures of the stove would also be helpful.

There were several old designs that smoldered wood. They earned the nickname of smoke dragons. Modern stove designs are made to burn cleanly. In order to burn smoldering wood cleanly, Blaze King uses a catalytic combustor which chews through the smoke and burns the wood gases. They add a thermostat to keep the stove producing a steady heat level, based on the user setting. This not only dramatically reduces emissions, it also greatly increases efficiency over old designs so that less wood is burned for the given amount of heat.

 

[onlinefunner]

Thanks! Did not know about the dragons of yore.

I understand BKs are cleaner. I was surprised at the burn time on my unit, considering how long the house stayed warm--still hot coals after 24 hours.

I'm all for cleaner air, but spending $3k is just a big expense, esp considering I dont use the stove that often.

P.S. No, the stove is not running with all that stuff around it

 

[onlinefunner]

I just measured the interior, and seems about 3.9 cu ft. maybe even 4.

 

[moresnow]

The beast
That's a really large unit. One big old box of heat! I'll reserve comment on replacement as it sounds like you are a hit and miss pleasure burner at this juncture. Just don't fall into that thing while loading.

 

[onlinefunner]

i am also relying on it to be a full time unit when the world finally falls apart.

 

[begreen]

The long burn is coming from the sheer volume of the box. There are not many fireboxes of that size, but for comparison a Blaze King King is close. It can achieve 30+ hr burns on a regular basis. But it does have a layer of technology (the cat) to accomplish this. If simplicity is the goal then the Drolet HT3000 or Austral III may be a better bet.

 

[onlinefunner]

I see a lot of non-catalytic models on the EPA database which have a higher efficiency than the two you mention, so why those two?

E.g. Summit Classic LE and also Quadra Fire 5700 Step Top Wood Stove both have a 3 ft firebox, but no thermostat. These seem like top non-catalytic competitors.

In fact, a thermostat seems to be a pretty useful feature for max burn and comfort, but seems a rather rare feature, unless its hiding under useless names like Extended Burn Technology (EBT) and Automatic Combustion Control (ACC) burn technology, but not sure if these are basically the same or not.

 

[snaple4]

My understanding, all are thermostat tech but used in a different way. BK uses the thermostat for primary air, the others mentioned use the thermostat for second or cat air.

 

[begreen]

I see a lot of non-catalytic models on the EPA database which have a higher efficiency than the two you mention, so why those two?

E.g. Summit Classic LE and also Quadra Fire 5700 Step Top Wood Stove both have a 3 ft firebox, but no thermostat. These seem like top non-catalytic competitors.

In fact, a thermostat seems to be a pretty useful feature for max burn and comfort, but seems a rather rare feature, unless its hiding under useless names like Extended Burn Technology (EBT) and Automatic Combustion Control (ACC) burn technology, but not sure if these are basically the same or not.

Each tech is different. The BK thermostat shines with low heat burns. When it's cold out the stove runs more like a non-cat in that it is being pushed for heat. It regulates primary air. The EBT is a barometric damper on the secondary air feed. The ACC controls boost air on a timer for easier startups.

Note that the Drolet HT3000 has a 3.5 cu ft firebox as does its brethren, the Osburn 3500.

 

[onlinefunner]

Just called the local dealer for Alderlea T6 ($3,200) with fan ($400), and thats $3,600. Yikes. For the money, BK sounds better, but I like that the Alderlea is designed to cook on with the removable grates. If the world crumbles (likely) want something good for daily cooking use--yes you can cook on BK, but never read about regular usage for such

 

[SpaceBus]

If you want to really cook with wood and don't have a chimney where you cook expect to invest a lot more than $3,500. A wood cookstove usually does not make a good house heater, I can only think of one that would come close to your current stove.

Based on your needs a BK King would make a good choice, as Begreen already mentioned. Begreen also has an Alderlea (T5 orT6 I can't recall) and can share his experience of cooking on it. Part of the high cost on the Alderlea line of stoves is the beautiful cast iron exterior compared to the flat steel panels on the BK King. @bholler has experience with longer burning non-cat stoves, but I don't recall which one.

 

[onlinefunner]

Thanks, that really helps.

I am looking for a heater that acts as a stove as a backup, not the other way around.

As for the King, it's huge, so thinking Princess/Ashford. Interesting side note: the Princess is 80% efficient and Ashford is 76%, but wonder if that 4% is just a random fluctuation considering they are the same.

 

[Highbeam]

Thanks, that really helps.

I am looking for a heater that acts as a stove as a backup, not the other way around.

As for the King, it's huge, so thinking Princess/Ashford. Interesting side note: the Princess is 80% efficient and Ashford is 76%, but wonder if that 4% is just a random fluctuation considering they are the same.

Nope, the 30 box BKs have always been less efficient. They gave up a little to keep the glass cleaner. The princess has better performance specs but used to have higher emissions until the new 2020 model, now the princess is better in every way except for looks. Also of note is that the 30 box (ashford/sirroco/chinook) seem to be more prone to cat clogging but dang it, they look better than the princess. The other big benefit of the princess is that it has a super deep ash belly that holds 6 inches of ash before you need to start thinking of emptying it. Super helpful feature for a working girl.

If you want to cook, use your oven. If power is out, bust out the coleman stove or your BBQ. I don't understand the obsession of many to try and cook on their heater but it is possible.

 

[bholler]

If you want to really cook with wood and don't have a chimney where you cook expect to invest a lot more than $3,500. A wood cookstove usually does not make a good house heater, I can only think of one that would come close to your current stove.

Based on your needs a BK King would make a good choice, as Begreen already mentioned. Begreen also has an Alderlea (T5 orT6 I can't recall) and can share his experience of cooking on it. Part of the high cost on the Alderlea line of stoves is the beautiful cast iron exterior compared to the flat steel panels on the BK King. @bholler has experience with longer burning non-cat stoves, but I don't recall which one.

I have used a regency 3100 and the big step top quad I think the 5700 but I don't remember

 

[bholler]

i am also relying on it to be a full time unit when the world finally falls apart.

If that is really you criteria stick with what you have it is simple and pretty indestructible. Is it a good stove? In my opinion no but if your main concern is something that will work no matter what it fits the bill pretty well. But I wouldn't use it to heat my house

 

[begreen]

FWIW, I've cooked several times on the T6. The trivet top affords wide temperature control. It works great with a dutch oven on top for slow cooking. If high heat is needed for boiling, etc. then the stovetop is just a swing away.

 

[Doublebogey]

As another FWIW I reloaded the 2.5 cubic foot fire box in my Enviro Boston last night around 10:15 pm. It was the biggest load I have had in it yet (I just installed it a month or so ago) but I would say that if I was careful I could have packed another 3 or 4 smaller peices in it. I had the air control turned all the way down when I went to bed at 11 and had a nice firebox full of beautiful secondary flames. When I got up at 6 it was still pumping a ton of heat out with a very substantial glow showing out of the glass. Even though it was 29 degrees when I got up it was supposed to get in the high 60's today so I didn't reload this morning and left it as it was.

The thing that really surprised me is that when I got home from work at 5 I walked past the insert and was surprised to feel some heat still coming off of it. The cast iron surround was just warm but the glass was still too hot to touch.. I opened it up and stirred the coals around and actually had enough of them glowing that I threw a piece of brick slat (admittedly the thinnest kindling in existence) in the firebox to see if it would light. 15 minutes later I had flames.

My wife swears that she didn't reload the box this morning so a relight on a 19 hour load in a non catalytic epa stove seems a little crazy to me but it just happened.

 

[onlinefunner]

Plus, upgrading to an 8" flue for the King = $1500 or some crazy amount. Now the dealer said lots of guys in Montana use a 6 inch with the King, but the pipe goes straight up in those cases, but probably still some extra risk there.

As for heating the house on a regular basis with wood, maybe I should consider it more because:

1. I need exercise, which is fulfilled by cutting, hauling, and splitting wood
2. Saves on gas bill, however the hourly rate for cutting wood is probably a lot lower than what I could make doing extra work jobs.
3. It is a good way to get out in the forest and spend quality time with the kids on the weekend.

Am I missing any points?

 

[bholler]

Plus, upgrading to an 8" flue for the King = $1500 or some crazy amount. Now the dealer said lots of guys in Montana use a 6 inch with the King, but the pipe goes straight up in those cases, but probably still some extra risk there.

As for heating the house on a regular basis with wood, maybe I should consider it more because:

1. I need exercise, which is fulfilled by cutting, hauling, and splitting wood
2. Saves on gas bill, however the hourly rate for cutting wood is probably a lot lower than what I could make doing extra work jobs.
3. It is a good way to get out in the forest and spend quality time with the kids on the weekend.

Am I missing any points?

You don't have to go with a King

 

[SpaceBus]

What's the size and layout of the house?

@Highbeam does the king offer much more on output, or does it mainly have more capacity for longer burns?

 

[bholler]

What's the size and layout of the house?

@Highbeam does the king offer much more on output, or does it mainly have more capacity for longer burns?

They are rated to very similar btus but the king is higher

 

[Highbeam]

What's the size and layout of the house?

@Highbeam does the king offer much more on output, or does it mainly have more capacity for longer burns?

Not much different as bholler says. The princess is much more popular in really cold places like Alaska. Since the heat output of both is long and constant you just don’t need that high peak heat output level.

The huge fuel tank is the best reason to pick the king but it’s really big, needs 8”, and a more expensive catalyst.

 

[onlinefunner]

Layout:

Blue is stove. Red is upstairs. I called BK and sent them a video of house and he thought Princess would be fine, but of course, good to get multiple opinions. Surely my proportions are off (not as long as+ seen).

P.S. I failed art class