Englander 32-NC: Earthbound home stability?

[s57nomad]

Like Begreen said, it’s no more risky than an asphalt shingled, or rubber roof. I’m a sheetmetal worker by trade and if you cut the flashing to fit the roof ribs as in the picture properly (not all hacked up) and use a good sealant (I’m partial to Solar Seal for this application) it shouldn’t ever leak.

Thank you good Sir. I can look for the product you mentioned.

 

[s57nomad]

Okay, so update time. The stove is dollied on the covered porch for the night, all umpteen 300# of it. Chimney and stovepipe time.

Room has cathedral ceilings no attic. 24" O.C. rafters, 5/12 pitch (the flashing is on order from begreen's mention earlier), sealant (from mention is being located). DuraTech 6" SS pipe and chimney (will measure heights tomorrow and distance from ridge). What parts do we need for the roof penetration, support box, reduced clearance? barrier, framing, trim ring...? I don't think the kits are complete but could be wrong.

Could you all recommend a few online dealers? Thanks again all!

 

[weee123]

This the cheapest I found the Solar seal online for a single tube https://buymbs.com/p-7262-npc-seala...KDNmXTSt8SdfZ1aWfv1XJ84U1pP4_BshoClKsQAvD_BwE

Also I would definitely wear rubber gloves when using it and try not to get it on anything you don’t want it on as it definitely doesn’t like to come off.

 

[s57nomad]

Thanks weee123.

 

[s57nomad]

Well I'm back after a long couple of years on the road for work. Tonight I will get the new flooring removed in the hearth area and start the placement of the stove. 3 years of promise to the Misses ya know it's time now.

Looking for insight on these outlets that will interfere with the framing of the hearth and stone faced rear protection. I did read the Gwleo topic and that's the route I'm headed. I'll include the 1 inch air gap at the bottom of the hearth and same for the rear at the bottom and the top.

Could someone explain the 1 in air gap under the hearth please? Is it to be continuous or is it a volumetric calculation in the size of the openings for proper flow? Say 1-1/4" high x 4" long and 2 feet apart across the front of the hearth base.

We've got some warmish weather coming soon and try to avoid poking a hole in the roof in the freezing temps. Also, what to do with the outlets?

Here's the location of the stove in the corner. Praying not to hit the ridge with the stove placement or rafters in the cathedral ceiling and still be able to maintain the clearances.

 

[begreen]

Typically, there is no air gap under the hearth pad (base?). It's only for the wall shielding. What is " the Gwleo topic"?
Looks like the hvac vent will need relocation.

 

[s57nomad]

Typically, there is no air gap under the hearth pad (base?). It's only for the wall shielding. What is " the Gwleo topic"?
Looks like the hvac vent will need relocation.

I understand now that there's no need for breathability under the hearth pad. What about the wall shielding with the drywall behind it?

The member is Gwleo. He wrote a topic that's an Article here about building a hearth. See here:

Wood Stoves and Fireplaces Thread 'WOODSTOVE HEARTH CONSTRUCTION'

Oct 18, 2015

One of our fine forum members (Gwleo) recently constructed a nice built-in wood stove hearth and shared his method and pictures with us. In this case, a stone platform was desired along with two adjacent corner walls.

A step by step process:

1. I did research on clearances on this web site and printed off the wood stove owners manual I was fairly sure I was going to buy (Englander NC30).

2. I drew a sketch on paper so as to visualize the plan.

3. I taped out the outline of the hearth and of the stove (I lived with this for a couple of months) I played with different heights of the wall...

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The Vent is just for crawl space ventilation but it's slab on grade with 2x12 joists. I planned on sealing it up in lieu of this install.

I plan to build similarly.

 

[begreen]

If there is a need to reduce wall clearance to a permissible distance, then an NFPA 211 wall shield is the way to go. What is unclear is whether in your case it's necessary. Is this still for the 32NC? If yes, does it have the side shields? Will single or double-wall stove pipe be used to connect it? What is the planned distance for the stove corners to the drywall?

 

[s57nomad]

If there is a need to reduce wall clearance to a permissible distance, then an NFPA 211 wall shield is the way to go. What is unclear is whether in your case it's necessary. Is this still for the 32NC? If yes, does it have the side shields? Will single or double-wall stove pipe be used to connect it? What is the planned distance for the stove corners to the drywall?

Thank you begreen for the evening reply!

To answer the questions:

Reduction of wall clearance necessary? No, but in the event of contacting a roof truss I'm trying to avoid it. It looks as though it'll be 3 inches away from the truss above. Also, for insurance purposes I want to be as compliant as possible in Missouri as there's no real code inspection for my chimney in my area.

Is this for the 32NC? Yes

Side Shields? Yes

Stove pipe single or double wall? Double wall

Stove corner clearance to drywall? 9 inches to the calculated stone face of the wall shielding. I'm just trying to stay safe.

I'm probably overcomplicating it! Ha.

 

[s57nomad]

Current measurements to drywall from corners.

 

[s57nomad]

The Centerline of the stove outlet to the pipe/chimney:

 

[s57nomad]

I almost forgot that I do plan an OAK (outside air kit?). The cold air return is about 12 feet left of the stove on the wall.

 

[weee123]

I have the side shields on my 32NC and set it to the clearances without any shields as per the placard. I don’t have any air gapped wall shielding and it is also a corner install. Single wall pipe as well. I believe you’re overthinking this.

 

[begreen]

It's best to break this project and communications into the two separate clearance issues. The stove pipe requirements (6") and the stove requirements (8" corner).

Provide more details on locating the support box and stove pipe clearance.

Stove corner clearance to drywall? 9 inches to the calculated stone face of the wall shielding. I'm just trying to stay safe.

I'm probably overcomplicating it! Ha.

Yes, as described there is no need for a wall shielding system as long as double-walled stove pipe is used. For better support, there should be cement board instead of drywall. In that case, the studs behind the cement board are the nearest combustibles. There is no need to do metal studding or have an air gap behind the cement board in this circumstance.

One shortcoming of the of the 30 and 32-NC is the short pedestal. I would consider making the compliant hearth taller to compensate for this shortcoming.

 

[s57nomad]

I have the side shields on my 32NC and set it to the clearances without any shields as per the placard. I don’t have any air gapped wall shielding and it is also a corner install. Single wall pipe as well. I believe you’re overthinking this.

Thank you and I see the Englander in your signature. Very nice!

 

[s57nomad]

I have the side shields on my 32NC and set it to the clearances without any shields as per the placard. I don’t have any air gapped wall shielding and it is also a corner install. Single wall pipe as well. I believe you’re overthinking this.

Thanks you and I see the Englander in your signature. Very nice

It's best to break this project and communications into the two separate clearance issues. The stove pipe requirements (6") and the stove requirements (8" corner).

Provide more details on locating the support box and stove pipe clearance.

As to the stovepipe clearance we will be running double wall stovepipe. It'll be Excel or Duratech DVL.

The 8 inch corner clearance will be increased to 10 inches from the corners with the side shields installed. We will be, per Misses, using veneer brick and 1/2" Durock to finish the walls behind the stove and hearth in lieu of no air gap as you suggested.

 

[s57nomad]

It's best to break this project and communications into the two separate clearance issues. The stove pipe requirements (6") and the stove requirements (8" corner).

Provide more details on locating the support box and stove pipe clearance.

In regards to locating the support box we'd been considering the Roof Support Bracket that mounts to the roof and clamps the chimney. It looks like 2 inches of clearance is required with Duratech or Excel chimney sections. It will be close to the ridge cap upon exiting the roof. I'll get some photos up of an outline on the ceiling for reference. Here is one where you can see the green laser dot above the stove with the 14-1/4" corner clearance currently.

 

[s57nomad]

One shortcoming of the of the 30 and 32-NC is the short pedestal. I would consider making the compliant hearth taller to compensate for this shortcoming.

The height of the hearth will be raised 1-1/2" with Durock and an additional 3-5/8" with the 20 gauge steel stud framework under it and 1/2" thick ceramic tiles. Looks to be a raised height of 5-5/8" minimum. Not accounting for thinset mortar.

 

[s57nomad]

Rafters located above at 16" on center. I laid out the chimney location for ease of reference. Clearance to the rafters based on 10" diameter. Off to verify roof location at the ridge cap. Fingers crossed.

 

[s57nomad]

I didn't fall off the roof and here are the layout results. Approximately 53" from the facia to the centerline of the chimney penetration and 14-1/2" down from the ridge cap. Centerline of the chimney is 5" down from the edge of the ridge cap.

 

[weee123]

One shortcoming of the of the 30 and 32-NC is the short pedestal. I would consider making the compliant hearth taller to compensate for this shortcoming.

I can attest to this I have a kneeling pad I keep with the woodstove supplies. I also tend to just sit in front of the stove when adjusting the air after a reload.

 

[s57nomad]

Is this list complete for install? I feel as though I'm missing something. I will order roof flashing from Excel per the recommendation of begreen earlier in this conversation.

 

[begreen]

The Duravent flashing will not be necessary if the Excel metal roof flashing will be used.

We need more details about the install but I am wondering if a short, cathedral ceiling support box wouldn't be better.

 

[s57nomad]

We need more details about the install but I am wondering if a short, cathedral ceiling support box wouldn't be better.

- Corner install
- Roof is 6/12 pitch ) chimney will be close to the ridge cap 5" under to the center of the chimney. Suggestions?)
- Rafters are 16" on center (14-1/2" between)
- 6" Duratech chimney (8')
- 6" DVL stovepipe (9')
- Clearance to corners will be 10-12" (8" required with side shields installed)
- 6 inch raised tiled hearth
- Brick veneered vertical walls behind stove for aesthetics (clearances exceed manufacturer specs no air gap)
- electrical outlets retained
- floor vent register sealed
- 18-20" front stove clearance and to sit near for loading and maintenance (manufacturer minimum is 16")

Am I missing anything as far as the details?

Is there a Ceiling Support Box required for install? I'm not opposed and am open to a complete component list so I can get it ordered. Thank you very much for the help thus far sir.

 

[begreen]

A cathedral ceiling support box gets hung between the rafters. It solves a couple issues because it can be hung plumb and is the trim + support, all in one. This is in lieu of the roof top support bracket, trim collar, and finishing collar.. Download the Duratech installation manual for more details. Note, the order is missing a storm collar. Also, save receipts. The DVL stove adapter is not needed for several stoves and a sloppy fit. In many cases the DVL pipe itself fits a lot better.



The hearth base needs at least an R=1 rating. What are the construction details for this?