Flue and Chimney cleaning

[Gaitley]

New to wood stoves and Hearth. Had my chimney cleaned (Napoleon S9 with flue and chimney) a couple weeks ago. Now I am hearing a lot of what I assume is creosote falling in the flue when I light a fire.

I was nervous about safety because I bought this house a year ago and don’t know the history of the stove/chimney or cleaning, and had been using the stove almost daily for heating.

Something had made my suspicious about whether the chimney sweep had actually opened the baffles and cleaned vs just vacuuming out the ash (unfortunately I was not able to be in the room much of the time for the cleaning); I did not see any equipment other than the vacuum though he assured me he had done the full cleaning.

Just opened it up myself and to me it looks like it was not cleaned at all (2 weeks ago, and I did make a few fires in the last 2 weeks). Having never used a chimney sweep or stove before I’m just not familiar enough with what things should look like, or what is or isn’t normal or safe.

The photos aren’t the best but does this look like a flue that was cleaned recently? Clearly they didn’t clean in the stove itself.

I’d like a second opinion or input from people with more expertise before I go back to the chimney sweep and make an issue of this.

Thank you!

 

[vbu]

If this is what your flue looks like after a few fires then you have a real problem. I would think that it was not cleaned two weeks ago, but it's hard to prove that after a few fires. Looks like a straight up shot, you may be better off doing it yourself with a soot eater if you're up for it

 

[begreen]

It looks like a layer of creosote is forming. How well seasoned is the firewood? Has it been checked for moisture content?
What are the extra firebricks sloped in the firebox about? Is the fire burning briskly or lazily with some smoldering?

 

[Gaitley]

Thanks for your replies. The firebricks are just out of position as I removed some of them in order to remove the baffles.

The wood is seasoned and I check it all with a meter before burning.

In terms of burning sometimes it all burns great but I’ve often had challenges with getting the fire going and keeping it burning briskly. It seems like an air issue (as opposed to wood). I’ve tried many things to isolate the issue and I suspect it is related to air and/or draft.

I’m at a bit of a loss really between the possible 2 issues of the sweep simply not cleaning it and a potential issue with the flue/chimney assembly.

 

[begreen]

Got it. They are the baffle bricks. Just to verify, was the wood moisture checked after being resplit and tested on the freshly exposed inner core of the wood?

How tall is the flue system on the stove from stove top to chimney cap?

Where is the stove located? main floor, basement? Try opening a nearby door or window an inch and see if that improves performance.

 

[Gaitley]

Got it. They are the baffle bricks. Just to verify, was the wood moisture checked after being resplit and tested on the freshly exposed inner core of the wood?

How tall is the flue system on the stove from stove top to chimney cap?

Where is the stove located? main floor, basement? Try opening a nearby door or window an inch and see if that improves performance.

Yes, I have resplit most of the wood before I burn it, and check again, and never burn anything if the moisture is 20%+. I’ve been really conscious of the moisture levels because of the issues I’ve had.

The stove is on the main level of a raised ranch (so there is a level below it), and the chimney cap is about 18-20 feet above the stove. Runs straight up through ceiling, small attic, and then about 8ft above the roof penetration.

My neighbor told me a tree fell on the roof a few years ago and damaged the chimney. It is quite possible the previous owner did not fix it correctly and that is part of the problem with actually getting a good burn.

I also would not be surprised if they never cleaned the chimney and what we are seeing now is multiple years of buildup. And, that the sweep I hired also did not actually clean it.

I’d like to find another pro to clean and assess the whole assembly but of course I have no idea how to find someone who is both reputable and an expert. Is it usually chimney sweep companies that would do this or stove/chimney stores that deal with the fulle flue and chimney assessment or installation?

I appreciate your replies, I know it’s not necessarily a total clear situation.

 

[Gaitley]

Re: the chimney. Here is a photo. The connection to the roof (under the silver section) looks unusual to me. But the house inspector didn’t mention it.

 

[begreen]

Is this stove in a prefab, zero-clearance fireplace?

The chimney shot gave me a WTH moment. Someone tacked a length of class A chimney onto an old air-cooled chimney with a liner in it. This was likely done to improve the draft. Napoleon stoves with the Tbar secondary manifold perform poorly with marginal draft.

If the wood is good, how did the fire burn? If it burned hot with good secondary combustion, then it is doubtful that this was recently cleaned.

I agree that a professional should review. There should be some good, certified sweeps in your area. Ask around at stove shops. Ask for references. There is also this site to check for listings. www.csia.org.

 

[Gaitley]

Is this stove in a prefab, zero-clearance fireplace?

The chimney shot gave me a WTH moment. Someone tacked a length of class A chimney onto an old air-cooled chimney with a liner in it. This was likely done to improve the draft. Napoleon stoves with the Tbar secondary manifold perform poorly with marginal draft.

If the wood is good, how did the fire burn? If it burned hot with good secondary combustion, then it is doubtful that this was recently cleaned.

I agree that a professional should review. There should be some good, certified sweeps in your area. Ask around at stove shops. Ask for references. There is also this site to check for listings. www.csia.org.

No, stove is just sitting in the living room. You mean the silver part is class A and the dark connecting pieces is the old air cool? Is class A the same as HT (the manual says to use HT chimney)? I am guessing using the air cooled part isn’t good in terms of safety.

The wood did burn fine/same as always after ‘cleaning’. I’d hear a little debris/creosote falling (thought didn’t know what it was). But then after a few fires right when I stated the fire it started sounding like a ton of debris falling in the flue. So much so that I killed the air to put out the fire immediately as it didn’t sound right.

Thanks again, and thanks for the link. I will try to find someone else to look at it all. It’s so frustrating when you feel you’ve been hustled by someone.

 

[begreen]

That mess needs to be removed and done correctly. The air-cooled pipe definitely is not rated HT for wood stoves. If the air-cooled pipe is 8 or 10" ID then it is also slowing down the flue gases.

 

[rudysmallfry]

Considering how much people charge in CT for chimney cleaning, that's a pretty bad cleaning job. Hopefully you can find someone more competent to get things cleaned up and that chimney section fixed. I know there's a good wood stove store in Ridgefield. Maybe they can give you some suggestions on who to contact.

 

[Gaitley]

Considering how much people charge in CT for chimney cleaning, that's a pretty bad cleaning job. Hopefully you can find someone more competent to get things cleaned up and that chimney section fixed. I know there's a good wood stove store in Ridgefield. Maybe they can give you some suggestions on who to contact.

Thanks! I’ll check in Ridgefield.

 

[Caw]

Even if you weren't in the room for the cleaning you should have been able to hear the soot eater working. The drill is loud and the process itself is loud slapping against the liner. I'm sorry that you seem to have gotten taken. I also second getting that chimney inspected/updated. That's the most important part of the whole system!

Good luck.

 

[Echo Parking Lot]

do people have a good rule of thumb about frequency of chimney cleanings?

we get ours cleaned by a sweep once a year and i wouldn’t stop using him for a big yearly clean, but what about DIY during the fire season with a sooteater etc.? Every couple of weeks? as needed?

 

[Caw]

I personally burn 3-4 cords a year of 3 year old mixed hardwoods. Its good, dry wood and burns hot. I get one professional cleaning a year in April and usually end up with a coffee can full or less and some ash. So with good results at the end of the year there's no need to do it more often.
On the other end of the spectrum I have a friend who had wet wood issues and had a seriously clogged flue after only a couple weeks. If you're burning less than ideal wood and/or had smoldering issues I'd want to clean more often to be safe and if you aren't sure there's no harm in a quick clean.

You know your wood and how your stove has been behaving. Let that along with past cleaning results be your guide!

 

[Eman85]

do people have a good rule of thumb about frequency of chimney cleanings?

we get ours cleaned by a sweep once a year and i wouldn’t stop using him for a big yearly clean, but what about DIY during the fire season with a sooteater etc.? Every couple of weeks? as needed?

If you have a sooteater and you cleaned every couple of weeks you would have a good idea to know if it needs it and then base your schedule from there. All you would be doing is good with no downside except for having to let your stove go cold.
I haven't been in years but I used to go to W Ma near the Housatonic River, still have inlaws up there.

 

[kborndale]

I clean my stove once a year with a sooteater.

 

[30WCF]

I probably clean mine more than others. It gives me peace of mind, and I do lots of short burns as on weekends rather than season long burns. It also depends on what wood I’m burning too. Sometimes 2x a year, sometimes every 2 weeks if I change a variable.