Harman Room Mode Settings

[TomPajak]

we have a dicussion going that says Harman Room temp mode will feed itself for 22 secs if on feedrate of 2 NO MATTER WHAT THE TEMP SENSOR IS READING
Im saying the stove will feed itself whatever it needs to reach that given temperature even if it has to feed itself for more than 22 secs and once it reaches set temp it will feed for less than 22 secs...the feedrate in ROOM TEMP MODE is overriden by the control board
here is the only proof of my argument
heres HARMANS ANSWER
Room Temperature Mode
Most consumers use the stove in the Room Temperature Mode because it is the easiest and most efficient method of keeping the room at a given temperature. In the Room Temperature Mode, the Room Sensing Probe constantly monitors room temperature. As the weather changes outside and your home needs varying amounts of heat to be at a desired temperature, the stove will automatically increase size and heat output of the fire so that a constant even temperature is maintained. If the weather warms up and no heat is required the stove will gradually shut down. When the house cools down the stove will automatically bring the room temperature to the precise temperature you desire

is there something I'm not seeing?

 

[THE ROOSTER]

I just started using room temp setting after a ice storm knocked out power to my home... I used to run on stove temp only, but I noticed the stove only seemed to put out 130* heat no matter what setting I put the stove on... My living room got down to 67* and I had eveything MAXed out, I switched over to room temp and three hours later the room was 78*...

I do recommend buying Harmans "battery backup", I rewired my 36V golf cart to 12V and the unit ran my stove 13 hours, voltage was only 11.7 then, so I belive I had a few more hours left, but I got the generator going

 

[Lousyweather]

we have a dicussion going that says Harman Room temp mode will feed itself for 22 secs if on feedrate of 2 NO MATTER WHAT THE TEMP SENSOR IS READING
Im saying the stove will feed itself whatever it needs to reach that given temperature even if it has to feed itself for more than 22 secs and once it reaches set temp it will feed for less than 22 secs...the feedrate in ROOM TEMP MODE is overriden by the control board
here is the only proof of my argument
heres HARMANS ANSWER
Room Temperature Mode
Most consumers use the stove in the Room Temperature Mode because it is the easiest and most efficient method of keeping the room at a given temperature. In the Room Temperature Mode, the Room Sensing Probe constantly monitors room temperature. As the weather changes outside and your home needs varying amounts of heat to be at a desired temperature, the stove will automatically increase size and heat output of the fire so that a constant even temperature is maintained. If the weather warms up and no heat is required the stove will gradually shut down. When the house cools down the stove will automatically bring the room temperature to the precise temperature you desire

is there something I'm not seeing?

yep


heres my take.....

stove temp mode: the unit totally ignores the RSP (room sensing probe), and all input comes from the ESP, and the stove adjusts its fire accordingly, given the temperature setting on the temp control dial. The feed control at this point is just a MAX setting....most likely the stove wont ever run at max, but it can be forced to to test the theories herein.

room temp mode: The unit uses the RSP to regulate the fire. Again, the feed rate knob really is just a max setting guideling for the stove, and in normal use it likely wont ever run at its max setting, but to try it, all you need to do is keep the setting the same, stick the probe out the window, forcing the stove to run at its max feed rate setting.....roughly 20 secs set on 2, 40 secs set on 4, you get the picture

 

[TomPajak]

we have a dicussion going that says Harman Room temp mode will feed itself for 22 secs if on feedrate of 2 NO MATTER WHAT THE TEMP SENSOR IS READING
Im saying the stove will feed itself whatever it needs to reach that given temperature even if it has to feed itself for more than 22 secs and once it reaches set temp it will feed for less than 22 secs...the feedrate in ROOM TEMP MODE is overriden by the control board
here is the only proof of my argument
heres HARMANS ANSWER
Room Temperature Mode
Most consumers use the stove in the Room Temperature Mode because it is the easiest and most efficient method of keeping the room at a given temperature. In the Room Temperature Mode, the Room Sensing Probe constantly monitors room temperature. As the weather changes outside and your home needs varying amounts of heat to be at a desired temperature, the stove will automatically increase size and heat output of the fire so that a constant even temperature is maintained. If the weather warms up and no heat is required the stove will gradually shut down. When the house cools down the stove will automatically bring the room temperature to the precise temperature you desire

is there something I'm not seeing?

yep


heres my take.....

stove temp mode: the unit totally ignores the RSP (room sensing probe), and all input comes from the ESP, and the stove adjusts its fire accordingly, given the temperature setting on the temp control dial. The feed control at this point is just a MAX setting....most likely the stove wont ever run at max, but it can be forced to to test the theories herein.

room temp mode: The unit uses the RSP to regulate the fire. Again, the feed rate knob really is just a max setting guideling for the stove, and in normal use it likely wont ever run at its max setting, but to try it, all you need to do is keep the setting the same, stick the probe out the window, forcing the stove to run at its max feed rate setting.....roughly 20 secs set on 2, 40 secs set on 4, you get the picture

yup tried it and it worked like u said..so my apologeeeeez..
FEEDRATE isn't about the amount of pellets it feeds(was my thinking) but the amount of TIME the auger turns...HARMAN explaination is not thorough enough then..so lets re edit how it SHOULD READ...

FEEDRATE DIAL 1-6 - DIAL IS USED TO DETERMINE THE MAXIMUM AMOUNT OF TIME THE AUGER TURNS IN A GIVEN MINUTE CORRESPONDING TO THE NUMBER CHOSEN..ex. 1=10secs.,2=20secs.,3=30secs..etc...
within that given minute though ,the auger WILL turn for less amount of secs. BUT NOT MORE THAN the number that was chosen..as it approaches the set temperature..
for example
as the temperature starts to approach the set room temp of 70 at feedrate 3..the auger WILL start turning less than 30 secs. but no more than 30secs.

so in reality the stove will NEVER be able to reach the desired room temp unless you set your feedrate(auger turn time in secs.) high enough..so if you want your house warm say 75 or more..NEVER EVER set the feedrate(auger turn time in secs.) too low
the stove just won't put the heat out it needs to reach that temp

so again thank you for letting me figure this out now if someone asks I'll give them the right answer(unlike what my dealer told me..poopie info)

 

[Lousyweather]

I thought we agreed basically, harmanp68! That last post was put quite well, actually......Ive found alot of folks, and thats dealers included, dont really understand the feed rate setting. In fact, you can boost it up to 6, and in normal operating conditions, theres no difference (you said this in a previous post). I think the last post of yours is going to be used for reference and stickydom for a bit! Good explanation of how it does work.

 

[crausch]

This is just some additional food for thought directly of Harman's site:

The feed rate knob sets the maximum time per minute the control will let the feed motor run. The feed rate knob is set to have the stove perform its best depending on the ash content of the pellets you are burning. A feed rate of 4 to 4 ½ works best for most applications. Once you set the feed rate knob, no further adjustment is needed unless you make a change in pellet quality. A common misconception about the feed rate knob is that turning it to a lower setting will cause you to burn less fuel. Since turning the feed rate knob down will lower the maximum time you allow the feed motor to run every minute, the stove will feed at this maximum rate longer to satisfy the temperature setting, resulting in increased fuel consumption.

 

[exoilburner]

This is just some additional food for thought directly of Harman's site:

The feed rate knob sets the maximum time per minute the control will let the feed motor run. The feed rate knob is set to have the stove perform its best depending on the ash content of the pellets you are burning. ......................

Does this mean if you have slower burning smokey pellets you should turn the FEED RATE knob down until it quits smoking? I am having questions about how to adjust the fuel/air mix for variations in stove draft and pellet quality. I assumed it was done with the LOW DRAFT ADJUST and FEED RATE knob.

 

[THE ROOSTER]

So do you all feel "Room Temp" is the way to go??? The reason I ask is, because on my stove the fan is on then off, on then off... Do you run your fan on high or at a slower rpm???

 

[GVA]

the way I always explained it is stove temp puts it in woodstove mode.....
It just chugs along pumping out a constant heat (based on exhaust temp) regardless of the room temperature...

room temp regulates the heat based on the room sensor, more like a central heating system.....
If you put the blower speed in between L and H the blower will ramp up and down based on the room temp

It depends on what floats you're boat.....
Me personally.......... I prefered room temp........and so did my wife... ;-P

 

[crausch]

exoilburner:
Does this mean if you have slower burning smokey pellets you should turn the FEED RATE knob down until it quits smoking? I am having questions about how to adjust the fuel/air mix for variations in stove draft and pellet quality. I assumed it was done with the LOW DRAFT ADJUST and FEED RATE knob.

I am not familiar with the PF100 model and its controls. On my Advance, there is no fuel/air adjustments to make...its all automatic. On the Advance, the low draft should be set after installation and does not need to be adjusted after that. You want the feed adjustment set (which is a maximum feed setting) so that your ash is about 1" at the front of the pot. Too high and pellets will feed unburnt over the edge, too low and your pellets will be burning up too fast making your feeder have to constantly feed since the low setting is limiting the rate. Of course the pf100 may be a whole different animal. If you have slow burning smokey pellets, I would mix them with some better pellets. They are probably smoking because they are damp. Your efficiency will be way down, low BTUs. I would think that you would need more air to burn them hot but I am not sure how to do that on the pf100.

 

[THE ROOSTER]

This is just some additional food for thought directly of Harman's site:

The feed rate knob sets the maximum time per minute the control will let the feed motor run. The feed rate knob is set to have the stove perform its best depending on the ash content of the pellets you are burning. A feed rate of 4 to 4 ½ works best for most applications. Once you set the feed rate knob, no further adjustment is needed unless you make a change in pellet quality. A common misconception about the feed rate knob is that turning it to a lower setting will cause you to burn less fuel. Since turning the feed rate knob down will lower the maximum time you allow the feed motor to run every minute, the stove will feed at this maximum rate longer to satisfy the temperature setting, resulting in increased fuel consumption.

Ok, how can it burn more pellets, if the auger is only running for 10 seconds every minute??? Am I understanding this correctly???

 

[investor7952]

I always use room temp .It is fantastic when the outside temp is above 30 because my room comes up to temp and stays there. Once temp is achieved flame slowly goes down and just feed enough to maintain temp.
On another note of feedrate and temp settings. If its below 20 outside my feed is on 6 and temp on 75. It doesnt matter if I put temp on 90 because my room isnt going to hit 75 when its that cold out.
I do know one thing my accentra insert is a twice a week maint task.If I dont clean it every 3rd -4th day forget about any settings I am not going past 69-70 in my room.The day I clean it I can get 76 out of the room the next day 74 the next 72 the next 69-70.alot of work but worth it

 

[Steve_in_NH]

You must have a huge room. I have an Accentra insert as well and with feed rate set at 4 and fan set at mid point, temp setting of 75 (on the stove dial) my stove keeps large open living-dinning room area and a large kitchen at a very constant 73 and a hallway and remote bedroom at 68. I can get the temp up to 85 if I turn it up. Even when the temp was down to Zero we had no problem keeping the temp up at 73......

 

[TomPajak]

This is just some additional food for thought directly of Harman's site:

The feed rate knob sets the maximum time per minute the control will let the feed motor run. The feed rate knob is set to have the stove perform its best depending on the ash content of the pellets you are burning. A feed rate of 4 to 4 ½ works best for most applications. Once you set the feed rate knob, no further adjustment is needed unless you make a change in pellet quality. A common misconception about the feed rate knob is that turning it to a lower setting will cause you to burn less fuel. Since turning the feed rate knob down will lower the maximum time you allow the feed motor to run every minute, the stove will feed at this maximum rate longer to satisfy the temperature setting, resulting in increased fuel consumption.

Ok, how can it burn more pellets, if the auger is only running for 10 seconds every minute??? Am I understanding this correctly???

you are understanding perfect..although it may not make sense how something turning for less can actually use more fuel maybe this might help..I hope..fingers crossed

in low feedrate 1=10 secs the auger would turn out only a small amount of fuel in those 10secs. while 50 secs. are given to burning it...so the stove has to play catchup in the feeding game but since there is a limit of only 10 secs of feeding time it can't stuff its face fast enough..

sort of like a fat man at an all you can eat buffet with only a baby spoon and 10 secs at a time to eat
he'll be there ALL day stuffing his face...BUT if you tell him he can eat for 40secs at a time he may eventually get filled up enough to only eat for 30 secs at a time then 20secs till eventually he just sits there twirling his spoon telling himself "My god..I gotta stop."..just like you stove..ummmmmmmm..buffet....biscuits...gravy..ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh..................drooling

sorry... got off track but anyways...the stove works the same way and for some reason now Im hungry damnit..lol
anyone offended by fats jokes please note:5'8" and 260lbs here..if you cant joke about your weight then someone else will.. so beat them to the punch and if they start raggin on you ,just sit on em!!

IF the room temp was NOT reached the cycle would continue because the stove just can't get hot enough to reach your desired room temp on such a low feedrate(auger turn time) it just keeps chuggin away every minute to turn for 10secs...never getting the stove hot enough to start the next phase which would be the idling down process..so the stove just keeps going and going and going.......go energizer rabbit......................as opposed to the room reaching the temp and the stove idling down and sitting there till needed(manual mode) or just shutting down till needed(auto mode)

also Im beginnig to think the stove has a built in program to tell how many pellets it should feed per number...the manual says max feedrate(6) should feed at the most UPTO but NOT beyond 8lbs./hr...so Im guessing a lower feedrate corresponds perhaps to less pellets also..

so low feedrate#=lower secs. of turning along with lesser amount of pellets?????anyone??sound sortof on the right track???
HARMAN dials are maximum settings Im beginning to see.
.the fans speed in room mode sets the max speed the fans can turn UPTO but NOT beyond
..the feedrate turns the auger for # of secs but NOT more than the number you set 1=10..2=20 and so forth...so 6 will NEVER turn the auger for more than 60secs..but will turn for less as the room approaches the set temp
and the temp dial determines how much air is going to get used to burn those pellets..higher the dial =more air=more BTU's????????????

 

[Lousyweather]

well put, P68! great to start the day with a laugh!

 

[tinkabranc]

so funny! good explanation :lol:

 

[crausch]

HarmanP68:

Thanks for answering that for me! I've been too busy to respond right away to my posts. I agree with your response and found the analogy very humorous but correct.

Does that help "Rooster"? It seems like reverse logic but by allowing your stove a higher maximum feed limit your stove will reach temp quicker and then maintain that temp at a lower feed rate. If your stove can't reach the set temperature, then it will continue to feed at the set limit, and a higher limit would then burn more pellets then a lower limit. However, if your stove is not reaching temp at the higher limit setting, then you are probably asking too much out of your stove anyway.

I probably just made it more confusing again, so just stick with the explaination by "HarmanP68".

[EDIT] - BTW...I kind of don't like calling the feed knob the "Feed rate" because it gives the impression that you are setting a constant rate. I think it would more correctly be called a "Feed limit" as it only sets the maximum feed allowed.

 

[exoilburner]

exoilburner:
Does this mean if you have slower burning smokey pellets you should turn the FEED RATE knob down until it quits smoking? I am having questions about how to adjust the fuel/air mix for variations in stove draft and pellet quality. I assumed it was done with the LOW DRAFT ADJUST and FEED RATE knob.

I am not familiar with the PF100 model and its controls. On my Advance, there is no fuel/air adjustments to make...its all automatic. On the Advance, the low draft should be set after installation and does not need to be adjusted after that. You want the feed adjustment set (which is a maximum feed setting) so that your ash is about 1" at the front of the pot. Too high and pellets will feed unburnt over the edge, too low and your pellets will be burning up too fast making your feeder have to constantly feed since the low setting is limiting the rate. Of course the pf100 may be a whole different animal. If you have slow burning smokey pellets, I would mix them with some better pellets. They are probably smoking because they are damp. Your efficiency will be way down, low BTUs. I would think that you would need more air to burn them hot but I am not sure how to do that on the pf100.

codebum,
Thanks for the good advice. Sounds like my PF100 operation is similar to your Advance. My question is not so much about what the FEED RATE knob does but how to use it. Maybe I should have started another thread; but I thought it fit here. What you say about mixing pellets makes sense. I have two brands one is a bit smokey. But they look dry and brittle. I mixed the two brands and that eliminated the smoke. But if I didn't have the drier brand I'd be stuck.

My thinking is: there's no way to adjust the combustion air but if the amount of fuel per minute could be reduced with the FEED RATE it would be possible to adjust the fuel/air mix for slightly smokey pellets. Maybe the 1" of ash at the front of the pot is what to adjust for when changing pellet brands. I'm going to test this next time I load the hopper up.

 

[investor7952]

You must have a huge room. I have an Accentra insert as well and with feed rate set at 4 and fan set at mid point, temp setting of 75 (on the stove dial) my stove keeps large open living-dinning room area and a large kitchen at a very constant 73 and a hallway and remote bedroom at 68. I can get the temp up to 85 if I turn it up. Even when the temp was down to Zero we had no problem keeping the temp up at 73......

My House is 3200 sqft. The area my stove is in is a big open space.Family room eating area kithchen all open also to the 1 side is my living room. The only time I stay at 73-74 with room setting on around 73 is when outside temp is above 28.My best heat comes within the 24 hrs of a cleaning.I also do a quick vac on my vent twice a month.I am pretty sure I got a crappy load of Lignetics because my stove wasnt this dirty with my last ton of Lignetics.

 

[crausch]

Exoilburner:
Maybe the 1” of ash at the front of the pot is what to adjust for when changing pellet brands.

I think that would be a good plan of action. It's pretty much what my the manual recommends, but if you have some "not-so-good" pellets, then you will probably have to play with it some.

 

[THE ROOSTER]

Thanks for all the input, going to use the setting of 4 on "feed rate or feed limit", and use room temp from now on... One last question, where and how high off the floor is your sensor???

 

[TomPajak]

I now have mine coiled up behind ...hanging on the stove...

 

[crausch]

Thanks for all the input, going to use the setting of 4 on "feed rate or feed limit", and use room temp from now on... One last question, where and how high off the floor is your sensor???

I have mine run up and along the wall behind the stove. I also have the end of the probe wire facing about 3" out from the wall. It's the tip that senses the temperature so you don't want it directly agaist a external wall or the stove will run until the wall meets the specified temp instead of the room's temerature.