Hearthstone Heritage burn cycle, stove temps, and heat.

[BrowningBAR]

There have been a few things that I've mentioned and noticed about the Heritage, and a few things that Highbeam has mentioned as well about the Heritage.

-Highbeam has noticed high stack temps (probably applies for me as well, but I do not have a thermometer on my double wall pipe)

-I've noticed ash accumulating at a faster rate than the Encore, even though the Encore has been used more over the last two weeks.

-Coaling; the Heritage goes into the coaling stage much faster than the Encore. In some cases two to four hours quicker. I still need to watch this a bit more, but I am definitely seeing the Heritage go into the coaling stage at a much faster rate.

- I have been using the damper a lot more this year. The damper seems to keep more heat in the firebox without smothering the flame. I am consistently closing the damper as soon as my fire is set in and I begin to adjust the air controls. The difference in how the stove temps climb is night and day. This seems to go against how an EPA stove should work.

- Air controls work completely different than in the other three stoves I've used. I shut the air down in stages to increase the stove temps. When done correctly I can achieve 550-600° on a consistent basis. If I leave the stove air open to much Anything more than 3/4 closed it proves to be very difficult to get temps over 500°.

The stove produces great heat, but it operates kind of oddly. Consistent. But odd. I'm beginning to think that some of it's oddness leads to shorter burn times and more ash.

 

[remkel]

Interesting observations, BB.

I would have to say I am seeing somewhat the same thing with my F600. This is the first EPA stove I have ever operated in my life, and I am still learning how to get this baby really cranking (although last night I had a great burn around 570 with glowing secondary tubes!). I do notice quick coaling, but long burns, especially now that I am into some longer logs.

The heat is amazing, my house warmer than it has ever been, and I am enjoying the learning curve.

Keep experimenting!

 

[BrowningBAR]

Interesting observations, BB.

I would have to say I am seeing somewhat the same thing with my F600. This is the first EPA stove I have ever operated in my life, and I am still learning how to get this baby really cranking (although last night I had a great burn around 570 with glowing secondary tubes!). I do notice quick coaling, but long burns, especially now that I am into some longer logs.

The heat is amazing, my house warmer than it has ever been, and I am enjoying the learning curve.

Keep experimenting!

I didn't think much of the coaling until I had another stove EPA stove to compare it to.

 

[NH_Wood]

BrowningBar - I've been goofing around with the Mansfield this fall. I decided to try smaller load - 2/3 full and leave the pipe damper wide open to see how the fire and stove behaved. I had noticed last year that when I would close the pipe damper, I'd get a real 'bowels of hell' firebox - I think the secondaries were working on overdrive. So....with the damper open, I've noticed shorter burn times with earlier coaling and harder to get the stove above 500*. Last year I was more concerned about keeping the stove under 600*! So...perhaps there is a sweet spot I need to find with the pipe damper. All this said, I vent into an oversized interior clay tile chimney (11" square), so, perhaps my setup is too different for a good comparison. BTW - I do burn well seasoned wood. Cheers!

 

[BrowningBAR]

BrowningBar - I've been goofing around with the Mansfield this fall. I decided to try smaller load - 2/3 full and leave the pipe damper wide open to see how the fire and stove behaved. I had noticed last year that when I would close the pipe damper, I'd get a real 'bowels of hell' firebox - I think the secondaries were working on overdrive. So....with the damper open, I've noticed shorter burn times with earlier coaling and harder to get the stove above 500*. Last year I was more concerned about keeping the stove under 600*! So...perhaps there is a sweet spot I need to find with the pipe damper. All this said, I vent into an oversized interior clay tile chimney (11" square), so, perhaps my setup is too different for a good comparison. BTW - I do burn well seasoned wood. Cheers!

Interesting. So, your damper is working like mine. Which seems to go against how an EPA stove is suppose to work. I also noticed a big difference in secondaries when the damper is closed.

My install is double walled pipe venting into a chimney with a 6" liner and with poured in insulation.

 

[woodmiser]

What damper are you guys talking about? Do you have one in the stove pipe?

 

[certified106]

I would think that if you are using a pipe damper it would help during the burn cycle by increasing the secondaries while slowing the burn down but one would also think that once the secondaries quit firing the draft would decrease with the pipe damper closed and that would lead to the coals not burning down just like you are experiencing.

 

[Rob From Wisconsin]

I'm noticing the exact same things on our Tribute.
I'm finding that I get my hotest, cleanest & longest
burns when I "Double Damper" for a fully loaded burn
(air control down & stovepipe damper closed).
It's incredible to watch and interesting to see how long
and effective the burn is. Like you said, this is contrary
to what I would expect to have seen on my other EPA stoves.

 

[woodmiser]

To reduce your coals you can open er up full on when near the end of the coaling stage. I have very few coals when doing this. I only do it once every few cycles if the unburnt coals start to accumulate. Depending on the wood you burn your results might vary. The goal is to have enough coals to restart but not so much that you can't load up good. Plus it's a lot easier to shovel out ashes when there are only a few hot embers left.

 

[BrowningBAR]

What damper are you guys talking about? Do you have one in the stove pipe?

Yes, we are referring to a stove pipe damper.

 

[BrowningBAR]

I would think that if you are using a pipe damper it would help during the burn cycle by increasing the secondaries while slowing the burn down but one would also think that once the secondaries quit firing the draft would decrease with the pipe damper closed and that would lead to the coals not burning down just like you are experiencing.

I'll have to experiment with that. I don't recall a difference in the amount of ash between the damper open versus closed, but I wasn't really paying attention to the ash when I was comparing the two. I want to disagree with it due to the fact the stove stays hotter longer, but that might not have anything to do with coals breaking down more completely.

 

[BrowningBAR]

To reduce your coals you can open er up full on when near the end of the coaling stage. I have very few coals when doing this. I only do it once every few cycles if the unburnt coals start to accumulate. Depending on the wood you burn your results might vary. The goal is to have enough coals to restart but not so much that you can't load up good. Plus it's a lot easier to shovel out ashes when there are only a few hot embers left.

I'm not experiencing coal build up, just more ash. With the damper closed the coaling stage does not come as quickly. I have not determined if the ash is from the damper being closed or if it is just how the stove operates since I did not have an EPA stove of roughly the same size to compare it to last year.

 

[BrowningBAR]

I'm noticing the exact same things on our Tribute.
I'm finding that I get my hotest, cleanest & longest
burns when I "Double Damper" for a fully loaded burn
(air control down & stovepipe damper closed).
It's incredible to watch and interesting to see how long
and effective the burn is. Like you said, this is contrary
to what I would expect to have seen on my other EPA stoves.

I am glad to read others have been doing this successfully.

I need to dig up my manual. I am almost positive it mentions not to use a damper and it really seems these stoves work better with the damper.

 

[Todd]

I wonder if the pipe damper is reducing the draft or pull which in turn reduces the primary air but some how increases the secondary air? With the lack of primary air I could see why there could be more ash or lack of complete combustion. Most manufactures state no need for a pipe damper and I bet it's because they know it effects how they engineered the stove to work.

 

[Rob From Wisconsin]

I wonder if the pipe damper is reducing the draft or pull which in turn reduces the primary air but some how increases the secondary air? With the lack of primary air I could see why there could be more ash or lack of complete combustion. Most manufactures state no need for a pipe damper and I bet it's because they know it effects how they engineered the stove to work.

The ash that remains intially seems like a lot, but a couple of scrapes with my rake and it
settles down quite considerably. Seems to be mostly "air".

 

[leeave96]

I wonder if the pipe damper is reducing the draft or pull which in turn reduces the primary air but some how increases the secondary air? With the lack of primary air I could see why there could be more ash or lack of complete combustion. Most manufactures state no need for a pipe damper and I bet it's because they know it effects how they engineered the stove to work.

My guess is that the top of the stove stays hotter with the pipe damper closed - setting off more secondary burn + more smoke staying in the box to burn too.

I tried it one time on my Englander, but only for a few minutes - didn't have time to mess with it. I think I'm going to give it a work out though. It makes sense that if the secondaries are going and no smoke out the chimney, you are good to go - as long as smoke doesn't want to back out of other parts of the stove, like the damper inlet, etc. But if that don't happen on an old smoke dragon stove where stove pipe dampers were used all the time, I doubt it will happen on the newer EPA stoves either.

Bill

 

[Milton Findley]

The manual says,

"In general, you do not need to install a stovepipe damper
with the Heritage. Some installations, however, could
benefit from a stovepipe damper, such as a tall chimney
which can create a higher than normal draft. In such
cases, a damper can help regulate the draft. The Heritage
requires a draft between 0.06" wc and 0.1" wc. For drafts
above 0.1" wc, install a stovepipe damper."

With my minimal height 15 foot chimney, I do not have one yet. I have noticed that with the primary shut down all the way, coals sometimes go out before burning up, so this bulks up the ashes. If I am letting it die off, I open up the primary to burn them up. Since I am burning wood pellets this year, there is not much in the way of ash to concern myself with.

 

[NH_Wood]

I have noticed that I burn better with damper open in the shoulder season when draft is more sluggish, and can start to make use of the damper more when the draft is much stronger during winter. Cheers!

 

[BrowningBAR]

I have noticed that I burn better with damper open in the shoulder season when draft is more sluggish, and can start to make use of the damper more when the draft is much stronger during winter. Cheers!

Is there a way to test how strong my draft is myself? I've always suspected I have strong drafts in all three chimneys, but I have never confirmed this. I can run the Heritage in shoulder season the same way I do in winter.

 

[Stump_Branch]

If i can find it theres a calculation that can give you a good guess of the draft.

 

[BrowningBAR]

Spent the time today and re-split some existing splits to load up the stove as much as possible. Never bothered to do that previously. Just kind of poked around until I got 4-7 splits that would fit. I think I got 8-9 splits in, plus a quarter of Super Cedar, plus cedar shake kindling.

Had the stove top up to 300° in 30 minutes with the damper closed. Stove is now at 430° with the air closed at around 50-55%. Within the next 30 minutes I should be able to shut down the air control all the way or close to it.

External temps on the double wall pipe have been no more than 220°

We'll see what this does to the burn time.

 

[Stump_Branch]

Curious above or below the pipe dampner are you getting the 220?

 

[BrowningBAR]

Curious above or below the pipe dampner are you getting the 220?

Above. My pipe damper is right after my flue collar. Not much to measure below it.

 

[Stump_Branch]

Interesting. Only place id have room not that id need. But the more heat thing you mention has me.

 

[BrowningBAR]

Interesting. Only place id have room not that id need. But the more heat thing you mention has me.

Not sure if it will work the same, since it's a different manufacturer, and I'm assuming the internal design is a little different. But, there is no harm in trying. It's cheap to intall one.

I have a damper on the Vigilant that I use a lot less than the damper on the Heritage.