I'm cold!

[Josh Carmack]

Installed and fired up my furnace around Sept 13th this year. At first I only had my flat plate exchanger in the loop, as I was waiting on the local HVAC man to build me a transition to hold my water to air heat exchanger for my existing duct work. After waiting several weeks I decided if I wasn't worth his time he wasn't worth my money, so I improvised the exchanger to fit in the dead space inside my central unit it self. at this time, I finalized the installation by moving everything I needed into it's permanent position, which included relocating the FPHE into position very near the existing water heater to simplify plumbing. After a few more days passed I noticed my Earth Woodsman 405 no longer needed to be filled each morning with water. A few days later I noticed it would not stop dumping water out on the ground every time it fired. Figuring the fill valve on the furnace had failed I was biding the time till I could get some time off. About a week ago the water line to my ice maker busted and my wife disconnected the house water supply til I could get home. Once I repaired the ice maker I decided to install a cutoff valve to the furnace to stop the overflow til I could get the time to look into it. Well, a few days later, and it still had not stopped dumping water out. Got home from town yesterday and my wife was complaining that the clothes wouldn't dry and the house was cold. She said she filled the furnace with wood to no avail. Upon checking the furnace, I discover my circulation pump has failed. Once I removed the pump I was also able to definitively determine, that the furnace was getting it's water abundance from the plate heat exchanger for our domestic water. Called up earth outdoor to let them know about my troubles. I honestly was expecting a tad bit of the could shoulder because they had already failed to call me back about the water dumping out.On top of that I was already aware that their warranty does not cover the pump/exchangers, or anything else they didn't manufacture themselves. Got a call back and after I explained my troubles they said they would get me a pump in the mail, but would have to call me back about the plate exchanger after they talked to the owner. Got a call back about the exchanger an hour or so later. They are sending me one of those free of charge as well. Kudos to earth for doing the right thing, when technically, they didn't have to. I even told the guy on the phone, if another year had passed, I would have just bitten the bullet and replaced both failed units without asking them to. Since it only had only been in operation for 3 months I felt they should eat them. Joe, and I forget the other guys name agreed. IF the units arrive as promised, I must say I'll be a satisfied customer.

Our propane fired central unit keeps tripping it's rollout sensor, so our only source of heat for the moment is a 5 plate ventless heater, and oil/electric space heater. I got the electric water tank heater fired back up, but man does it hurt my feelings to know that I'm having to buy all that heat right now....

IF anyone lives in the West TN area has a taco or other brand flange mount circulation pump they can lend or sell I really would appreciate it! Not one vendor within a reasonable driving distance has anything but the high dollar stainless units in stock.

/end rant/

 

[mike van]

Home Depot or Lowes doesn't stock those pumps? I've seen them here.

 

[GENECOP]

Yup, HD has the green Taco pumps sitting on the shelf.

 

[Josh Carmack]

Round my neck of the woods hydronic heating is unheard of. There are a total of three of us, in the entire county, and perhaps a total of 15-20 of us in all the surrounding counties. Of the other two in my county, one is my uncle, and his system is 40 years old. The other is a buddy/ church member, and his system was installed by his father about 30 years ago.
The only circulators in my neck of the woods were the little hot water circulators that keep water moving from your water heater to give you instant hot water. I would have bought one of those and adapted the fittings, but they wanted 249.00 for it. I have called small mom and pop shops, and even the big commercial plumbing suppliers. Most of the big guys knew what I was talking about, but did not stock them, or stocked the $300.00 plus stainless/potable water units.

 

[maple1]

You can order online too, look for supplyhouse.com. Call them up (or one of your chosing) & see how long it would take you to get one - then maybe order two to have a spare. Or even order from HD website or via phone?

The hot water recirc ones won't do the job anyway, they don't have the capacity.

 

[brenndatomu]

Our propane fired central unit keeps tripping it's rollout sensor,

Can't help you with the pump...but on the propane furnace, reset the sensor and then try cracking a window before you light 'er up again. Could be a bathroom fan or something is pulling a negative pressure on the house. Those sensors are very sensitive

 

[maple1]

I don't know anything about propane furnaces - but is there a chance the new 'exchanger in the dead space' could be messing things up?

 

[mike van]

You an order online from Home depot and they'll ship to your closest store for free, pick up there. I've done that. Also, check Amazon.com, sometimes they have stuff on there you'd never expect.

 

[heaterman]

Make sure all your lines and heat exchangers are purged of air before you fire up the new pump. I'd hazard a guess that the original pump failed due to a no flow or air lock situation after the re piping that was done. Typically, the circulating pump on the system will not purge air from the coils on a furnace type heat exchanger. You have to include provision in your piping to force flow through it under good pressure to get all the tubes purged out.

BTW........although a lot of people use standard cast iron circulating pumps in open systems, a stainless or bronze pump is really what you should be using to reduce corrosion related failures.
If you read through te warranty of any Taco, Grundfos, B&G, Wilo.......etc., is will plainly say for use in closed system applications. No warranty if installed on an open.unpressurized system.

 

[Josh Carmack]

Heaterman, thanks for that info.

I already had roll-out issues before installing the water/air exchanger. A mouse built a small nest in the unit and created all kinds of heck in there. never worked right since. The three swirl inducers were damaged and it won't ever be right until I can replace the entire flame heat exchanger at a mighty high tune of 850$ plus shipping. It is my absolute last resort. I already have a pump now on order from supplyhouse, on top of the pump that Earth has promised me. When I bought this unit I wanted to purchase a backup pump and induction fan to go with it, the sales woman at the home office discouraged me because she said they rarely ever have to replace them, and are known to operate for decades before failing. I'm wishing I had ignored that advise, as good as it may or may not have been.

I THINK my pump failure was caused by either an air pocket, or boil over Or perhaps corrosion deposits from the steel in the furnace. All that water dumping into it pretty much negated any corrosion treatment I had already added.

 

[Josh Carmack]

I should add that Earth Outdoor came through They wasted no time at all in getting me both the pump and FPHE sent right out. They arrived two days after calling them. Also, rather they mistakenly, or intentionally did so, they upgraded my FPHE from a 30 plate to a 40 plate. Installing them was no problem. I used a garden hose to back flush the entire loop to ensure no air pockets were left lingering.