Insert or Freestanding – I just can’t decide!

[DJS-1]

Thanks to the cold winter, something good happened. Yesterday my wife (and house CFO) said she was ready to look at new stoves. We moved into a new-to-us house last year, leaving our well loved Jotul 450 insert behind. The buyers really wanted it, so I let it go, as it was probably a bit undersized for the new house (2900 SF) anyway.


Our current house has gas insert and we just haven’t “warmed up” to it. It’s installed in a fairly standard, 35w x 30h fireplace with a raised brick hearth that was originally wood burning, with a standard brick chimney. The house was built in ’86.


Just about any insert would fit into this opening, but I think I prefer a stove following reasons:


No blower needed – full radiant heat. (The Jotul seemed to heat the chimney and garage behind it with no blower on)

Larger stove sizes are available, and more stove options in general

Water pot can go on top, and maybe some cooking too, in case of a zombie apocalypse

Side loading makes a lot of sense for the location

Stove on hearth makes for less stooping when tending the fire and loading


But there are cons:

I’d need the hearth extended another 18”

The look of a stove in front of an old, well charred fireplace opening just won’t work in this not so rustic house. It’s very visible, and really needs to be a clean install, as if the hearth were build for the stove. (If anyone has achieved this clean look – I’d love to see pics and understand how you did it.)


Any thoughts? The insert would be so easy, that’s why it’s tempting. But the stove experience is really what I want.


Thanks!

 

[DAKSY]

Just a couple more towards the CONS...The hearth will need to be extended 16" from the FRONT loading door, so adding that to the depth of your stove, that number could get to be pretty substantial. You mentioned side loading capability. That means the ENTIRE stove will sit PROUD of the fireplace opening. Gonna need a big hearth pad.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Welcome to the forums DJS-1.

You should be able to find many pictures of free standing stoves installed in fireplace openings. Here are just a few pictures that I have:

 

[Boiler74]

I went from this:



To this:



Josh

 

[DJS-1]

Thanks. That's a good looking conversion. I like the tile.

 

[Boiler74]

Thanks. That's a good looking conversion. I like the tile.

Thanks. I originally wanted to do all brick, but I didn't have enough either salvaged or leftover once I tore the old hearth down. So I used slate for the top. And I'm glad I did. The smooth surface is easier to clean.

 

[seabert]

In my case I went with a VC Montpelier Insert. The prime reason for selecting this unit was the great clean and flush look. Granted I had an existing fieldstone hearth so mine may look a bit rustic. However, I have seen this model in other colors and configurations that would seem to work well in a modern or mid-century home. The other thing I like is the fact that it does not stick out from my hearth like some of the other units I was considering. Perhaps it is not the most efficient insert but the wife loves the look.

Cannot cook with it but I do have an iron water pot that I use to keep some humidity in the room.

 

[Charles1981]

I went from this:

View attachment 126375

To this:

View attachment 126376

Josh

That looks damn good. I have a similar setup. I think I'm going to have to do something similar to what you have done in the near future.

 

[DJS-1]

Thanks. I originally wanted to do all brick, but I didn't have enough either salvaged or leftover once I tore the old hearth down. So I used slate for the top. And I'm glad I did. The smooth surface is easier to clean.

Agreed. My hearth is a very rough brick surface, which will be tough to clean. Yours worked out well.

 

[DJS-1]

In my case I went with a VC Montpelier Insert. The prime reason for selecting this unit was the great clean and flush look. Granted I had an existing fieldstone hearth so mine may look a bit rustic. However, I have seen this model in other colors and configurations that would seem to work well in a modern or mid-century home. The other thing I like is the fact that it does not stick out from my hearth like some of the other units I was considering. Perhaps it is not the most efficient insert but the wife loves the look.

Cannot cook with it but I do have an iron water pot that I use to keep some humidity in the room.

That's a great looking setup! Love the fieldstone! Cost no object, I'd rip the whole thing out and do fieldstone floor to ceiling. We'll see.

 

[kmcgovern]

I have a similar situation. I have a fireplace opening that is quite large and most faceplates for inserts won't cover the opening anyway. So i am looking at a freestanding woodstove. The firebox dimensions are: 33"highx 36" wide at front to 29" wide at back and it's 19" deep. Is there any reason, if a freestanding stove will fit, I can't push it as far back into the opening as i can? This is a full masonry fireplace.

 

[begreen]

Welcome. Should work. Start a new thread on your setup with pics and we'll talk about your needs.

 

[kmcgovern]

Thanks, I'll take some pictures tonight and post them up.

Welcome. Should work. Start a new thread on your setup with pics and we'll talk about your needs.

 

[Hogwildz]

Go with what you really want & like.
You can: cook on some insert tops, boil water also, etc. etc.
Many freestander owners will try and persuade you to go that route, touting they will heat better, etc.
Insert owners will try and sway you the other way.
I can heat with or without the blower, I have cooked in and on my insert. No I can't put a 5 quart pot on top, but I have cooked plenty of other things as I said in and on.
Heating 2666 sf with an insert just fine. And actually, the blower in my set up, circulates more hot air from the insert in to the rest of the house very well. Also heats without blower during power outages.
But that is just me and my set up.
Bottom line, you prolly already have a preference, so go with your likes and be happy with what you want.

 

[kmcgovern]

would the wooden mantle over the hearth be a concern? A free standing stove will stick out about 8". Not much more than an insert.

 

[Hogwildz]

Depends on the stove/insert, and the required clearances. Each stove or insert has it's own set of clearances required.
There is also the option of a mantel shield.

 

[DJS-1]

Go with what you really want & like.
You can: cook on some insert tops, boil water also, etc. etc.
Many freestander owners will try and persuade you to go that route, touting they will heat better, etc.
Insert owners will try and sway you the other way.
I can heat with or without the blower, I have cooked in and on my insert. No I can't put a 5 quart pot on top, but I have cooked plenty of other things as I said in and on.
Heating 2666 sf with an insert just fine. And actually, the blower in my set up, circulates more hot air from the insert in to the rest of the house very well. Also heats without blower during power outages.
But that is just me and my set up.
Bottom line, you prolly already have a preference, so go with your likes and be happy with what you want.

Thanks. Good perspective. There is a Pacific Energy dealer minutes from my house, and I've heard good things about them.

 

[Ashhole]

You have thought out pro and cons of each option well. A insert will definitely be more formal looking. 14 years ago my dealer kept steering me towards a stove instead of a insert. I held to my guns and am still happy with it. Given the space I had a hearth extension for a stove would have been a boat anchor in the room. Of course the first insert I received was a bomber but the replacement 3 year later has not given me any trouble (VC Winterwarm).

 

[Bigg_Redd]

Do whatever you want. I hope this helps.

 

[DJS-1]

Is there much advantage to greater log size other than a little less work splitting? I imagine the physics of this is more complicated than larger log fireplaces/stoves giving off more heat. I'd like to get the largest possible BTU output.[/quote]

 

[Bigg_Redd]

Bigger logs/splits = longer burn times

 

[DJS-1]

Depends on the stove/insert, and the required clearances. Each stove or insert has it's own set of clearances required.
There is also the option of a mantel shield.

What kind of burn time do you get with your PE?

 

[jeffesonm]

I switched from an insert to a freestanding stove to get more heat output and because I was tired of hearing the blower run. Happy with the switch, and the stove is not as imposing in the room as I thought it might be.

I went with a Jotul F55. It needs embers-only protection so instead of permanently extending the hearth, I put down a piece of tempered glass: https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/new-jotul-f55-installed.115534/

 

[Hogwildz]

What kind of burn time do you get with your PE?

I typically load 2x per day, every 12 hours. Burn time is so many things to so many people. I just know that I can load it up, and not have to touch it again for at least 12 hours or more depending on outside temps and wind. etc. There will be a temp swing in the house during that time anywhere from 2 or 3 degrees to 5 or 7 degrees again depending on outside temps & wind. I am okay with the temp swings though.
The last few hours are coals, but still putting out some heat.
The first couple years I was loading 3x a day every 8 hours.


I get those times with cherry, maple, ash usually during the day, and I try to do a full load of Oak at night.
I am partial to Oak, but have a crapload of cherry to burn up and get gone. Too much ash, and not my favorite wood, so been burning that mostly during the day.

 

[DJS-1]

I typically load 2x per day, every 12 hours. Burn time is so many things to so many people. I just know that I can load it up, and not have to touch it again for at least 12 hours or more depending on outside temps and wind. etc. There will be a temp swing in the house during that time anywhere from 2 or 3 degrees to 5 or 7 degrees again depending on outside temps & wind. I am okay with the temp swings though.
The last few hours are coals, but still putting out some heat.
The first couple years I was loading 3x a day every 8 hours.


I get those times with cherry, maple, ash usually during the day, and I try to do a full load of Oak at night.
I am partial to Oak, but have a crapload of cherry to burn up and get gone. Too much ash, and not my favorite wood, so been burning that mostly during the day.

A consistent 12 is pretty good. I had a really tough time getting 8 out of my Jotul 450, except during the seasons when I was burning mostly hickory.