Inserts used as free standing stoves?

[Larry43]

Can inserts (esp. the Quadrafire Mt Vernon) be used as free standing stoves. Any problems connecting the exhaust?

 

[joescho]

I guess if you had a really long chimney liner that stretched into your living space where the insert was it would work. The outside portion of the stove does not get hot, but I cannot speak to the portion that normally sits inside the fireplace.

I'm not sure why you would want to do this because the free standing stove is identical to the insert in how it works and internal parts, except that its a stove and not an insert.

 

[Larry43]

Thanks. I don't have a fireplace, but I may have access to a pellet stove fireplace insert, so I just want to know if it will work for replacing the wood stove in the place I just bought.

 

[Grisu]

You may get into trouble with your local code authority and your home insurance as the insert is probably not listed for that application. You may need to observe clearances for an unlisted stove. Ask them and the manufacturer about the requirements for your install.

 

[stoveguy2esw]

Grisu is correct

inserts are generally purpose built to be placed in an existing masonry (and in a few cases a zero clearance fireplace which was purpose built for wood fuels)

inserts do not have a pedestal or legs which would move the firebox off the floor, and have not been tested and approved for freestanding use so your insurer will not be happy with it being installed.

first thing to check is to see if the insert can be converted to a freestanding version with a factory kit from the manufacturer. a "diy" conversion not using a purpose assembled kit for the conversion will void the UL listing of the insert as well.

all in all, its probably more headache than its worth.

 

[bas157]

What about buying some brick and making a 'box' of brick to put it in, wonder if the would keep the UL listing intact?

 

[Grisu]

What about buying some brick and making a 'box' of brick to put it in, wonder if the would keep the UL listing intact?

As said, the local code authority, the homeinsurance, and the manufacturer are the authorities here. They will decide what is acceptable and what not. Anything you read in a forum on the internet is like the weather forecast.

 

[stoveguy2esw]

What about buying some brick and making a 'box' of brick to put it in, wonder if the would keep the UL listing intact?

nope, as the floor of a fireplace is several courses of brick deep, brick actually does not have that big an "r" factor (1" of common brick has an r factor of 0.20 so an R factor of 1 would require 5 inches of brick) you should note that we do not know what the r requirement is for the insert for floor protection as it was not tested for a freestanding application.

would enough brick under the stove render it "safe" but it does not alleviate the code issue

 

[stoveguy2esw]

Considering that free standers are better than inserts anyway the idea of having the worst of both seems odd. Seems like a hard way to save a few bucks.

I think our new friend (the OP) has the potential to acquire this insert at an attractive price, and the quad Mt Vernon is a proven solid unit made by a solid company. so the front end cost would be reduced quite a bit I imagine leading us to the "can I" side of his question.

to the Op , im not trying to be mean spirited or anything of that sort im just trying to give you the "letter of the law" on what you may have to expect especially if your local code official (and in California I suspect you will have to go through your county for a permit and inspection) if your code guy is a stickler he will not permit an insert unless its installed in a fireplace. every code ever written on this matter starts with "install according to manufacturers instructions" and if those instructions do not give an outside of the fireplace installation option, its not going to pass code inspection no matter how safe it may be.

trust me my friend, this is what I do for a living, explaining this and other questions about my product line in the hearth industry to my own potential customers, I deal with code officials a lot also who call me for clarifications. Im actually writing a book on the subject (for woodstoves , not pellet, maybe in the future) my intent is safety and code compliance. inviting fire into your home is not something you want to take shortcuts with.

 

[stovelark]

Hello Your local building authority has final say as to whether they will allow a permit to be done for that install. Hearth and Home Technologies (Quadrafire's parent company) will tell you that is not how the stove was designed and listed to be installed. Do the right thing, get a free standing unit. We all understand you are prob getting a good deal- but its not the correct deal. There's a reason a free stander and an insert are made.....

 

[Pellet-King]

Insert has no sides, the "gut's are open and "ugly", freestanding are enclosed with there controls built in the side and most have leg's or a pedestal, otherwise there exactly the same

 

[Oregon aloha]

I'm not sure about Quadrafire, the Kuma and Enviro use the same box for there free standing stoves and inserts. It takes separate testing for each application that cost a lot of money, so in Enviro's case they did not test each to be used interchangeably. Kuma uses a different way to mount the firebox flanges for insert application and have tested and certified a number of their stoves to be used in multiple applications. Code uses tested certification for approval not the box itself so if code is not an issue just check with Quadrafire and see if they use the same box.

 

[stovelark]

Hello- As a seller of both Enviro and Quadrafire, I know what you're saying. Quad does not use the enclosed box on their inserts, the closest is prob the Santa fe, which has panels that have to be removed for servicing. The others are pretty much open. The Empress insert from Enviro is open as well, as is the M55 that mounts into its frame. The Meridian and EF3 are pretty much enclosed.