Job creation from a 1%er

[Seasoned Oak]

Companies determine wages based on many criteria. Probably the needs and wants of the employees are not at the top of the list.
I live in a town with very few good paying jobs. Mostly Min. wage. But there is still a lot of opportunity to start your own business.
Example: Your drain is clogged? Prepare to pay someone $100-$200 an hour to unclog it. Almost anyone can start their own business.
Iv started several business in the last 25 years with very little cash outlay. It was either that or go chase one of those Min. wage positions.

 

[Ashful]

I'm finishing up a roof at the blue route and rt 1 . Come on over I will pay you to roof with me.

Do you pay minimum wage?

I survived that; there are worse things in life - like working for a minimum wage without end.

Then get off your ass and do something better for yourself. This is the land of opportunity. There is no reason any legal citizen should be stuck making minimum wage for life, except by choice. You might never be a millionaire, but there's a lot of room between that extreme and minimum wage.

(I feel like we're back where we started...)

 

[razerface]

Then get off your ass and do something better for yourself. This is the land of opportunity. There is no reason any legal citizen should be stuck making minimum wage for life, except by choice.

exactly!

 

[Grisu]

Then get off your ass and do something better for yourself.

Not sure how literal I should take that statement but for the record: Where I grew up military service was mandatory and I certainly did something better afterwards. But I also realize that all that would have been hard without all the support my parents gave me throughout those years. Many children grow up without those chances; today even more so than when I was young. Is it really coincidence that countries with high welfare have a much higher intergenerational mobility than the US? And that this correlates with income inequality? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:The_Great_Gatsby_Curve.png

This is the land of opportunity. There is no reason any legal citizen should be stuck making minimum wage for life, except by choice.

It's a great attitude but what applies to one individual does not necessarily apply to the group as a whole. As long as people aim to amass monetary wealth there will always be a shortage of demand. (See my previous point 4; discuss it if you want to add substance instead of just going in circles) Without demand there will be a lack of wages which will equal unemployment. Jobs don't just grow on trees; you need someone to pay you. And you need to be paid first before you can add to demand! 20 million low-wage earners suddenly starting businesses is not giving them any better income without customers who would need an income to pay for that labor. It's a cycle; just saying "improve your skills" is not breaking that. We will still be short the money to pay for all that. Microeconomics will not help with a macro problem.

Not to mention that many low-wage earners provide a useful service we just don't want to pay for it. They should just go all on strike; we would quickly feel it and gladly pay more than what we are doing right now. Too bad that the poor are too busy fighting for their survival than for the social change they really need.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

. But I also realize that all that would have been hard without all the support my parents gave me throughout those years. Many children grow up without those chances; today even more so than when I was young.
.

I got zero help from my parents. Yes it was hard,but thats no reason not to try.
Friend of mine put himself thru medical school without help from his parents.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

Every person can be a job creator. Look around you ,there are needs everywhere. Find a need and fill it. Minimum wage jobs are certainly not the only need that has to be filled. They serve a purpose. Mostly to give a lot of HS dropouts a paycheck. I often hear "no one will give me a job" Dont wait for anyone to "give" you anything.

 

[Frozen Canuck]

Then get off your ass and do something better for yourself.

This does assume that there are at a minimum the same # of unfilled jobs as there are unemployed people. Is that assumption correct?

This is the land of opportunity.

This was quite likely true in the 50"s. Most global competition was busy rebuilding after WWII. Times & many other things have changed.

There is no reason any legal citizen should be stuck making minimum wage for life, except by choice.

Well if the # of unfilled jobs equals or exceeds the # of unemployed, that is somewhat true. Is this the case today in America?

Too bad that the poor are too busy fighting for their survival than for the social change they really need.

Well someone "gets it" these dirty, rotten, stinkin, evil, lazy, poor people are busy with hand to mouth issues & just don't have the time/ability to suggest the solutions to these macro problems, or they are just tired of being beaten down by someone in a better economic position. Weird how constantly wondering where your next meal will come from, or whether you will even have a next meal changes ones priorities. Makes one think immediately micro rather than macro.

BTW this all gets worse moving forward, new/better/more tech will create new waves of unemployed. Time for some macro thinking on these issues as opposed to well…..the status quo.

I will likely have checked out, but those of you left need to give up the "bogey man" & get to work on real solutions that work for the majority. Or get ready for WWIII, up to you.

 

[razerface]

They should just go all on strike; we would quickly feel it and gladly pay more than what we are doing right now. Too bad that the poor are too busy fighting for their survival than for the social change they really need.

yes, i agree,,this has been a plan of mine for a long time. If EVERYONE would go on strike,,, we could eliminate the gov't, since they do not make anything, and have no income except us taxpayers. How long will it take? A week? A month? I can last for a long time since all taxes will be suspended.

I can not believe it,,,we agree on something Grisu! Everyone,,,ON STRIKE!

(Scratching head),,,,that takes care of the gov't,,,but I sure don't see how it will help min wage. Oh! I see! With no gov't,,there will be no income tax,,,so min wage will get a 15% boost!

I like it. Brilliant!

 

[Seasoned Oak]

WHen the govt shuts down ,no one seems to notice or care.

 

[razerface]

This does assume that there are at a minimum the same # of unfilled jobs as there are unemployed people. Is that assumption correct?

Well if the # of unfilled jobs equals or exceeds the # of unemployed, that is somewhat true. Is this the case today in America?

This is something I do not joke about,,,in fact it pisses me off to no end. My company pays over min wage,,but you are required to work. We don't allow cell phones and bull like that,,, we work. I spent over $2000 on want ads to hire last year. We cancelled 1 shift due to lack of employees.

I got people who know nothing of CNC skills that wanted $20 hr to start,,while I trained them.

I got kids out of school who could not pull their pants up,,, who wanted the same thing.

I got TONS of people who just wanted to get us to sign the paper saying they applied for a job,,,so they could get more of the 99 weeks of unemployment that the gov't was giving away.

Sometimes we would go for 2-3 weeks with NO ONE applying,,,in a state where unemployment is high!

I hear the same thing from other business owners in this area.

I say all this with a smile,,,cause the guys we have now, are making killer overtime money, and do not want us to hire right now.

I hear on the radio that there are not enough workers in some states N Dak, Texas.

I did not check with Fox News though,,, so I guess it might not be true.

 

[Frozen Canuck]

Razer: Lots of micro instances, care to have a go at the macro issues? There will always be an exception to….well anything. Citing small micro exceptions to macro issues is fun but suggests a solution to nothing. Big picture is more important moving forward.

 

[Grisu]

This is something I do not joke about,,,in fact it pisses me off to no end. My company pays over min wage,,but you are required to work. We don't allow cell phones and bull like that,,, we work. I spent over $2000 on want ads to hire last year. We cancelled 1 shift due to lack of employees.

I got people who know nothing of CNC skills that wanted $20 hr to start,,while I trained them.

I got kids out of school who could not pull their pants up,,, who wanted the same thing.

I got TONS of people who just wanted to get us to sign the paper saying they applied for a job,,,so they could get more of the 99 weeks of unemployment that the gov't was giving away.

Sometimes we would go for 2-3 weeks with NO ONE applying,,,in a state where unemployment is high!

I hear the same thing from other business owners in this area.

I say all this with a smile,,,cause the guys we have now, are making killer overtime money, and do not want us to hire right now.

I hear on the radio that there are not enough workers in some states N Dak, Texas.

I did not check with Fox News though,,, so I guess it might not be true.

If, as suggested, wages are set by supply and demand and you have open positions than apparently your offered wages are too low. You have to raise them to fill all open positions. Either you believe in the market or you don't.

 

[ironpony]

I got people who know nothing of CNC skills that wanted $20 hr to start,,while I trained them.

.

why would they work for less?? the govt gives them that much to sit at home.

 

[ironpony]

Razer: Lots of micro instances, care to have a go at the macro issues? There will always be an exception to….well anything. Citing small micro exceptions to macro issues is fun but suggests a solution to nothing. Big picture is more important moving forward.

D$%# Canadians always making sense................

 

[Grisu]

why would they work for less?? the govt gives them that much to sit at home.

That is one reason we need a Job Guarantee! People will be paid for working, not for not working!! http://www.thenation.com/article/161249/job-guarantee-government-plan-full-employment#
Those jobs will improve our communities, set a wage floor, and keep people from just sitting at home and feeling sorry for themselves.

 

[Ashful]

Not sure how literal I should take that statement, but for the record: Where I grew up military service was mandatory and I certainly did something better afterwards.

That was a statement for the populace, not directed at you.

It's a great attitude but what applies to one individual does not necessarily apply to the group as a whole.... It's a cycle; just saying "improve your skills" is not breaking that. We will still be short the money to pay for all that. Microeconomics will not help with a macro problem.

I actually do not disagree with you guys on this. In fact, I don't think anyone on "my side" of this argument does. It's really more a difference in attitude, so let me spell it out more clearly: I have ZERO interest in helping able-bodied and able-minded citizens who will not help themselves. As you pointed out, my solution is microeconomic, but are those making minimum wage worried about anything more than their own microeconomics? Barring some unique unfortunate circumstances, which are not the topic of this discussion on minimum wage, any one person can fix their own situation.

edit: I have a little trouble believing anyone who's done well in life didn't have some help from their parents. At a minimum, you learned the skills and values that lead you to where you are. I didn't have an exceedingly privileged childhood, just a typical suburban kid who's mother struggled to make ends meet after father passed away young, but I definitely had it much better than some others. I might not be where I am today without some good fortune, but I surely wouldn't be making minimum wage, either!

 

[razerface]

I give up on you people,,,,too many excuses why people won't/shouldn't work. You are part of the problem.

 

[Grisu]

I actually do not disagree with you guys on this. In fact, I don't think anyone on "my side" of this argument does. It's really more a difference in attitude, so let me spell it out more clearly: I have ZERO interest in helping able-bodied and able-minded citizens who will not help themselves. As you pointed out, my solution is microeconomic, but are those making minimum wage worried about anything more than their own microeconomics? Barring some unique unfortunate circumstances, which are not the topic of this discussion on minimum wage, any one person can fix their own situation.

That is what I showed in my previous post: Our monetary system if not adjusted correctly has a tendency to force unemployment/low wages. Regardless what the skills of the people are. For the simple reason that we use money as a medium to exchange labor and people like to save it. If you provide one hour of labor and we would live in a barter economy you would immediately get one hour back. You are both better off. But we live in a money economy which means someone sells its labor but does not want to get any back right now. They save money! Now the other person cannot sell its labor anymore to acquire the things it needs. You have involuntary unemployment. Unless that unemployed person can force you to spend your money (mugging school anyone?) that is not going to change. Those links I posted that capital income increases while labor share decreases? People save too much money. How are the poor going to change that?

What all those "solutions" of hard work, better skills etc. would do is produce more output. They would not increase income (unless the new skill is to print money). Thus, you get deflation. And how well that works for the unemployed we saw 80 years and 5 years ago.

 

[bmblank]

If, as suggested, wages are set by supply and demand and you have open positions than apparently your offered wages are too low. You have to raise them to fill all open positions.

Precisely. The problem is, they have a better offer (in their eyes). They can live off of government subsidies and still get everything they need. Take away the subsidies and, her, $8.00/hr looks pretty good. Allow the market to regulate itself and good and services get cheaper due to competition. When the cost of God and services are lower $8.00/hr is worth more than previous.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

I got TONS of people who just wanted to get us to sign the paper saying they applied for a job,,,so they could get more of the 99 weeks of unemployment that the gov't was giving away.

Sometimes we would go for 2-3 weeks with NO ONE applying,,,in a state where unemployment is high!
.

These people may be poor, but they are not stupid. As long as the gravy train rolls you will always have riders.

I say all this with a smile,,,cause the guys we have now, are making killer overtime money, and do not want us to hire right now.
.

Keep working the OT, your govt needs all that tax money to pay the 99 Wks of UC

 

[Seasoned Oak]

I give up on you people,,,,too many excuses why people won't/shouldn't work. You are part of the problem.

Not me RZR I dont make excuses for anyone. THere is a % of the population everywhere who will do only just enough to get by,sometimes nothing at all and get by just fine. Who are the dumbs ones, them, or you for working OT and paying for it all?

 

[razerface]

People save too much money

LOL wow!

Who are the dumbs ones, them, or you for working OT and paying for it all?

I know,, some days I almost looking forward to it all ending. On those days I think we need to go bankrupt as a country and get it over with. Then it is work or starve. I have no plans to donate any food.

 

[BrotherBart]

I give up on you people,,,,too many excuses why people won't/shouldn't work. You are part of the problem.

Hey, we aren't the guy nobody wants to work for.

 

[Jags]

Good thing I wasn't drinking anything when I read that.

 

[Ktm300]

Do you pay minimum wage?


Then get off your ass and do something better for yourself. This is the land of opportunity. There is no reason any legal citizen should be stuck making minimum wage for life, except by choice. You might never be a millionaire, but there's a lot of room between that extreme and minimum wage.

(I feel like we're back where we started...)

No I do not pay minimum wage. You get paid for how you work. I have a hard time getting American workers that work and don't do heroin on the job. I have a Costa Rican crew that does not mess around. Been doing business with them for 15 years. And yes they are legal or have current work visas. Sometimes they make more than I do