JTWall EKO 25 Nozzle Plate

[shoeboxlen]

Hey Guys,

After reading the eko nozzle thread by JTWALL https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/eko-orlan-model-25-nozzle.115017/ I noticed he made a nozzle top cover to help prevent the fuel from falling into the lower chamber unburned. His first design was ceramic and proved his theory of it helping however the ceramic was not able to withstand the heat. his next try was made of 1/4 inch stainless steel. I have been annoyed by the large amounts of fuel that slipped through since I purchased our eko. So I decided to give him a shout and see if he was willing to sell one to me to try out. He agreed and I have been looking forward to checking it out.
Well I got home to find it delivered to my home today. and I have to say I am super impressed with the workmanship he put into the piece he even ground all the edges so there were no sharp burs. my wife had let the fire go out so I was able to install it right away and it fit perfectly I am burning with it as I type. I will update the thread as I use it for a bit but I have to tell you other EKO guys it is definitly a worth while investment it will save you nozzle wear and save you precious fuel.

My family and I would like to send a big shout out to JT and a huge thank you. Highly recommend his upgrade to anyone and he is a heck of a nice guy ta boot!

Len M

 

[shoeboxlen]

I am kind of shocked at my wood savings thus far I have to say my wood consumption is down by about 1/3 which is a big deal. and I am not cleaning the ashes out 2 times a week any more once a week and it is about a half a bucket load. I highly suggest this modification to any eko guy out there.

 

[JTWALL]

Hey Len! I was going to send you a note to see how the nozzle plate was working for you. Great to hear!! My Eko is operating better than it ever has. My ash container has not been emptied in almost 3 weeks. What is there would barely fill a gallon pail. I see no nozzle plate deterioration either. I will do a accurate ash measurement at the end of a full month of operation. When I get time, I'll post video showing the difference in nozzle output now versus back in 2008; impressive to see the difference. Regards.

 

[McKraut]

JTWall,

You need to market those things, and any other ideas you can come up with, including your nozzles. Sounds like they're better then the manufacturer's!

 

[JTWALL]

I am kind of shocked at my wood savings thus far I have to say my wood consumption is down by about 1/3 which is a big deal. and I am not cleaning the ashes out 2 times a week any more once a week and it is about a half a bucket load. I highly suggest this modification to any eko guy out there.

Len - I forgot to ask you if you made any changes to the air adjustments?

Kinda I nice finding just ashes in the lower chamber and not chunks of unburned wood, eh?

Regards,

JT Wall

 

[maple1]

Can you post a pic and add dimensions? Your plate might be able to be used by owners of other boilers too.

And/or: would you consider making plates that would fit other boilers using supplied measurements? (I guess that would be customizing ).

I'd like to have something like this for mine, except in my case it wouldn't be a row of holes but they would rather be in a circle, kinda. Been meaning to ask a fab guy here about something like this, but haven't gotten around to it.

 

[Clarkbug]

Can you post a pic and add dimensions? Your plate might be able to be used by owners of other boilers too.

And/or: would you consider making plates that would fit other boilers using supplied measurements? (I guess that would be customizing ).

I'd like to have something like this for mine, except in my case it wouldn't be a row of holes but they would rather be in a circle, kinda. Been meaning to ask a fab guy here about something like this, but haven't gotten around to it.

Curious about the same thing....

 

[shoeboxlen]

I have not adjusted the settings on the boiler. I think there is probably a bit of performance to be gained there but I find the tuning to be a bit intimidating. The plate has not degraded here either and I think it will save a nozzle for sure or at the very least seriously extend its usable life.

 

[stee6043]

I too would be interested to see some shots of this plate. I can imagine there is certainly some advantage to retaining more coals in the upper chamber but I would have a really hard time believing you're decreasing your wood consumption by a third. If that were true I think you have some other issues with your system. For what it's worth the wood that falls through still burns. It just doesn't contribute to the gasification process. But those btu's aren't necessarily lost down in the lower chamber since that's where the energy from the upper chamber ends up regardless. Just my two cents. Looking forward to hearing a bit more on this.

 

[goodwood]

I made a flat plate [1/4 in] with a 1 inch wide slot and laid it over the top of my nozzle, during the first fire it got so hot it was glowing red,I was worried it would damage the nozzle,it was so hot so I removed it and put in the firebrick overlay,i don't know if the plate could crack the nozzle, but it looked like it could do some damage

 

[timberr]

I went the fire brick overlay method, I narrowed the opening to 3/4" and I have noticed many of the same benefits, the biggest being no charcoal falling through the nozzle. I spent $42 on fire bricks. Replacement isn't as easy as the plate, takes about 1 hr. to cut blocks to size.

Food for thought.

 

[JTWALL]

I too would be interested to see some shots of this plate. I can imagine there is certainly some advantage to retaining more coals in the upper chamber but I would have a really hard time believing you're decreasing your wood consumption by a third. If that were true I think you have some other issues with your system. For what it's worth the wood that falls through still burns. It just doesn't contribute to the gasification process. But those btu's aren't necessarily lost down in the lower chamber since that's where the energy from the upper chamber ends up regardless. Just my two cents. Looking forward to hearing a bit more on this.

While it is true heat can be generated from fuel that has dropped into the lower chamber, I believe it the BTU output to be much lower than if properly gasified. Before I installed the nozzle plate, there was always a large amount of unburned fuel in the lower chamber waiting for me each day. I almost always emptied what was in the lower chamber each day; now I go a week since there is almost nothing there.

 

[JTWALL]

I made a flat plate [1/4 in] with a 1 inch wide slot and laid it over the top of my nozzle, during the first fire it got so hot it was glowing red,I was worried it would damage the nozzle,it was so hot so I removed it and put in the firebrick overlay,i don't know if the plate could crack the nozzle, but it looked like it could do some damage

To be honest, I have not looked under the nozzle plate since I installed it a month ago...I will do that tomorrow. And after thinking about it a little, I guess I would like the plate to get as hot as possible. In doing so, the gasses going by will be more likely to ignite, which is exactly what I want. I will let you know what I find.

 

[McKraut]

To be honest, I have not looked under the nozzle plate since I installed it a month ago...I will do that tomorrow. And after thinking about it a little, I guess I would like the plate to get as hot as possible. In doing so, the gasses going by will be more likely to ignite, which is exactly what I want. I will let you know what I find.

Keep us posted on this. I too would be surprised if it made a significant decrease in wood utilization. With regards to the coals that fall through, I always shovel out the bottom and throw it into a 55 gallon drum with a homemade wire basket (made of 1/2" wire mesh) across the top. The ash falls to the bottom and the coals go right back into the burn chamber.
Let us know how things look when you pull the plate.

Bob

 

[JTWALL]

Keep us posted on this. I too would be surprised if it made a significant decrease in wood utilization. With regards to the coals that fall through, I always shovel out the bottom and throw it into a 55 gallon drum with a homemade wire basket (made of 1/2" wire mesh) across the top. The ash falls to the bottom and the coals go right back into the burn chamber.
Let us know how things look when you pull the plate.

Bob

LOL...Sifting ashes?...one less thing for me to do! ;-)

 

[Nofossil]

Interesting thread and interesting idea. The proper material is probably Inconel, but that would cost near as much as the boiler itself. I'm inspired to see if I can find a scrap big enough to play with.

I think I may have found one advantage of my old EKO with the flat floor in the primary chamber - I've never got unburned wood in the bottom chamber. Only a very small number of coals fall through and they burn almost immediately. I do end up with unburned coals in th top chamber, though. Most of the ashes that I have to empty are from the top chamber, not the bottom.

 

[JTWALL]

Interesting thread and interesting idea. The proper material is probably Inconel, but that would cost near as much as the boiler itself. I'm inspired to see if I can find a scrap big enough to play with.

I think I may have found one advantage of my old EKO with the flat floor in the primary chamber - I've never got unburned wood in the bottom chamber. Only a very small number of coals fall through and they burn almost immediately. I do end up with unburned coals in th top chamber, though. Most of the ashes that I have to empty are from the top chamber, not the bottom.

I like your live control panel - neat! Is that real time or updated at specific intervals? The 304 stainless seems more than adequate for this task. Regards.

 

[JTWALL]

I made a flat plate [1/4 in] with a 1 inch wide slot and laid it over the top of my nozzle, during the first fire it got so hot it was glowing red,I was worried it would damage the nozzle,it was so hot so I removed it and put in the firebrick overlay,i don't know if the plate could crack the nozzle, but it looked like it could do some damage

As promised, I shut down my boiler today to inspect the nozzle plate components and the new ceramic nozzle I installed in early September. I am pleased to say that all components are in perfect working order. The ceramic nozzle looks brand new (no cracks, no chips, or no peeling). I also measured the total ash accumulated over the past 3 weeks of operation. I simply took the ashes and dumped them into a 2.5 gallon plastic bucket. Since some ashes were still quite hot, I had to make it fast. I did not compact the ashes, they were simply dumped in the bucket and measured. Total ash for 21 days was 7 quarts. Not bad. As to whether it is using less firewood is difficult to quantify since my solar hot water system is connected in parallel. Even on a cold day, if it sunny, the boiler sleeps. Regards.

 

[Nofossil]

I like your live control panel - neat! Is that real time or updated at specific intervals? The 304 stainless seems more than adequate for this task. Regards.

The control panel is updated at user-defined intervals. Since the controller only reads its inputs twice a second, there's no point in updating any faster. I think I have the external display (in my signature) updating one every second or two. For a wood boiler, what does real-time really mean?

I'm an ex-aerospace engineer. I can't help going directly to the most expensive solution. Inconel is truly amazing stuff. I worked at a place once that kept a molten salt bath in an Inconel container.

 

[JTWALL]

The control panel is updated at user-defined intervals. Since the controller only reads its inputs twice a second, there's no point in updating any faster. I think I have the external display (in my signature) updating one every second or two. For a wood boiler, what does real-time really mean?

I'm an ex-aerospace engineer. I can't help going directly to the most expensive solution. Inconel is truly amazing stuff. I worked at a place once that kept a molten salt bath in an Inconel container.

I tend to subscribe to the "kiss" theory. Retired also...I worked at a major defense contractor for almost 9 years...home of DEEP pockets. The waste I saw was sickening.

 

[McKraut]

LOL...Sifting ashes?...one less thing for me to do! ;-)

When you put it that way it does sound dumb!! But, I can't stand to waste stuff and I see those beautiful black nuggets as BTUs just waiting to keep me warm.

 

[ewdudley]

When you put it that way it does sound dumb!! But, I can't stand to waste stuff and I see those beautiful black nuggets as BTUs just waiting to keep me warm.

Not just the BTUs, many agree that the best way to start a new fire with near instant gasification is to have a quarter peck of charcoal to start with.

 

[McKraut]

As promised, I shut down my boiler today to inspect the nozzle plate components and the new ceramic nozzle I installed in early September. I am pleased to say that all components are in perfect working order. The ceramic nozzle looks brand new (no cracks, no chips, or no peeling). I also measured the total ash accumulated over the past 3 weeks of operation. I simply took the ashes and dumped them into a 2.5 gallon plastic bucket. Since some ashes were still quite hot, I had to make it fast. I did not compact the ashes, they were simply dumped in the bucket and measured. Total ash for 21 days was 7 quarts. Not bad. As to whether it is using less firewood is difficult to quantify since my solar hot water system is connected in parallel. Even on a cold day, if it sunny, the boiler sleeps. Regards.

I must have missed something. I thought your insert was 1/4" steel. I thought the ceramic piece had failed.

Bob

 

[weiland13]

I can confirm the longevity of a 304 stainless plate. I made one over a year ago in my eko 40. It is 1/4" thick with a 3/4" slot. So far it has done well. It has opened up a little and now measures nearly 7/8". I also removed the lower chamber blocks last year. I fabricated a piece from stainless and installed it around the same time last year. This is also doing well. I was going to make it from a nickel alloy (I have access to many materials) but decided to make it from something cheaper to experiment. Like others have found, these materials can and have performed well.

 

[JTWALL]

When you put it that way it does sound dumb!! But, I can't stand to waste stuff and I see those beautiful black nuggets as BTUs just waiting to keep me warm.

Dumb? No sir, not dumb just labor intensive. What is dumb are products sold that make you do things like that. I commend you for your diligence. Me? I sift compost worms out when harvesting worm castings. They go right back in the composter to continue their work! I like your bye line: "I make the living. She makes it worth living." You're lucky, I never found anyone like that! Keep warm. Regards.