Looking for a better solution

[BurningWood]

I am a renter and my landlord installed a wood stove in my fireplace fall 2016. I am realizing that although it's a solution, I'd really like (need?) a better solution. The stove I have is no longer listed on the manufacturer's website, but I did find it here.

The stove is appropriately sized for my house, which is about 900 sq ft, although about 1/3-1/2 of that is shut off most of the time. I do struggle with getting heat around corners and into a back bedroom but it's a problem I'm ok with and am actively working on fixing.

The stove has no fire brick. Therefore, I find it has to be constantly tended or it will go out. I'd like to have a stove with brick so that I can load it up before I go to bed and have heat through the night. I am finding that at some point during the night the house cools down enough that the central heat kicks on. I'd like to avoid that. I have several cords of good seasoned wood that I got for free so why should I pay for heat?

The stove has no air controls beyond a flue mounted damper (which I'm not sure is operating correctly 100% of the time). Therefore, I regulate the air by opening or blocking the two holes on the face of the stove with magnets as well as opening or blocking the space at the bottom of the door with a piece of foil. It's crude, but it works. It would be nice to have actual air controls. Along this line it would be nice to have a stove that has a door gasket as I feel that helps with controlling the airflow.

The stove has no legs in its current installation because apparently it would have been too tall. I was not home when it was installed so I am not sure exactly what the issue was. Due to its lack of legs it is sitting flush on the floor of the fireplace which means I have to get down on the floor every time I want to start a fire, feed the fire, check the fire, etc. This is difficult for me to do. I'd like to have a stove that I don't have to do gymnastics with.

The stove has no ash drawer, which results in obvious complications when it comes to keeping the stove clean. Usually I end up shoveling out as much as I can and then leaving it outside for a few days in a metal container before burying it in the woods. Rarely do I have coals left the day after a fire but better safe than sorry.

Interestingly the front of the stove hangs out of the fireplace over the floor. The majority of the flat loading area is what is hanging out. I see this as a fire hazard since sparks might fly out and land on the floor. I did have a fire resistant rug on the floor underneath/in front of the stove but my cats thought it was a great toy and quickly destroyed it. I think it would be better to have a stove that fits in the fireplace completely. I suspect the issue I'm having is because the stove has a narrow width and is quite deep. It is a N/S rather than an E/W.

I noted on an informational page associated with this forum "Code also requires the Damper area to be blocked off" and "The code calls for closing off the Damper area with a metal plate." There is a mention of NFPA but I am unable to find the specific code section that is relative to this (I did read through the 2016 edition of NFPA 211 as it pertains to fireplaces and stoves). There is no blocking plate installed, instead the stove is attached to a liner that appears to go through the damper and straight up the chimney. I'm guessing this is something I need to rectify.

I doubt there is any money available to me from the landlord for this endeavor so I'd like to know where to look for an inexpensive used stove that would work for this situation in addition to what stove to look for. Ideally I would try to sell the one I have to use that money towards another but I'm not sure anyone would want this stove.

I'm sure there is information needed that I didn't cover so please ask questions. I've included a picture of the current installation (below) and, yes, I know there should not be wood next to the stove but it is on its way in. Thank you for any help, advice, direction, etc. you can give.

 

[jetsam]

More info needed: Is that an old prefab fireplace that was partially ripped out? Is there a masonry fireplace behind it? Is it a masonry flue all the way up? What are the dimensions of the fireplace? What diameter is that liner?

As far as the stove goes, yes, that looks pretty bad. With a little more info we should be able to help you find an upgrade.

You should have a blockoff plate or your warm air is just going straight up the chimney whether or not the stove is burning.

 

[begreen]

Well the good news is that almost anything will be better. You are correct about the lack of hearth protection and it looks like you are trying to restrict the air intake. That's a common issue with these leaky stoves. Can you provide full dimensions for the fireplace including opening size, rear size and depth top and bottom?

 

[BurningWood]

More info needed: Is that an old prefab fireplace that was partially ripped out? Is there a masonry fireplace behind it? Is it a masonry flue all the way up?

It's a masonry fireplace that had (I think) a Heatilator installed in it. That's the rusty metal stuff on the back wall you can see. There used to be glass doors across the front, which were taken out. The chimney is completely interior to the house and has a 6" liner running the full length (you can see it directly attached to the stove in the picture).

What are the dimensions of the fireplace? What diameter is that liner?

The fireplace opening is 39.5" W x 33.25" H x 15.5" D (at its deepest point, basically in the middle). The width along the floor in the back is 30.5". There is an additional 12" of hearth outside the fireplace opening.

As far as the stove goes, yes, that looks pretty bad. With a little more info we should be able to help you find an upgrade.

I actually don't care so much about looks as I do about function. I'd like to actually be heating with wood rather than part wood and part central heat. Trying to find something inexpensive is going to be difficult, I think. My landlord paid just under $300 for this stove new - I'd love to find something at that price point (of course, free is always best, but I doubt that will happen here!).

You should have a blockoff plate or your warm air is just going straight up the chimney whether or not the stove is burning.

I know I should have a blockoff plate - the question is what is the code section that says it's required?

 

[BurningWood]

Well the good news is that almost anything will be better. You are correct about the lack of hearth protection and it looks like you are trying to restrict the air intake. That's a common issue with these leaky stoves.

If I did not have the magnets and the foil the stove would literally run away. I have a stovetop thermometer and it will easily (and quickly) spring up to 600+ if I don't cut the air down. That's bad news.

Can you provide full dimensions for the fireplace including opening size, rear size and depth top and bottom?

The fireplace opening is 39.5" W x 33.25" H x 15.5" D (at its deepest point, basically in the middle). The width along the floor in the back is 30.5". There is an additional 12" of hearth outside the fireplace opening.

 

[BurningWood]

Here is a picture looking up. Thought that might be helpful. Please let me know if other pictures would be useful, or if there is other information you need. Thanks for the help.

 

[Dustin]

Here is a picture looking up. Thought that might be helpful. Please let me know if other pictures would be useful, or if there is other information you need. Thanks for the help.

View attachment 222418

At least you have a liner! It should probably be insulated depending on your masonry chimney condition and airspace.

Looks just like an old heatilator fireplace (I have one) those are great at accepting free standing stoves as well as inserts

 

[begreen]

Looks like an Englander 13NC would fit in there.

 

[Tar12]

Looks like an Englander 13NC would fit in there.

Burningwood this is a excellent suggestion...the bottom line is that you are going to have to spend some money to get something that is useful... a quick internet search turned up the 13NC for $699 at Home Depot...there will be spring sales coming along shortly...

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Englander-1-800-sq-ft-Wood-Burning-Stove-13-NCH/100157775

 

[peakbagger]

The reason why the stove could be sold at all was it intentionally made to be leaky so that it could not be turned down. If you do get it to turn down its going to be a creosote maker. When there is an inevitable chimney fire, there could be push back on insurance as the appliance was not being operated as designed.

 

[jetsam]

I actually don't care so much about looks as I do about function.
I know I should have a blockoff plate - the question is what is the code section that says it's required?

Welll, when I said it looks bad, I didn't mean cosmetically. I meant that it looks like a terrible stove. I can't even tell pretty from ugly.

You may or may not have a building code that requires a blockoff plate- local codes vary. Don't even bother looking it up. You want one no matter what the code says. No stove can do a good job if all the heat it makes gets sucked right back up the chimney. (Given that the chimney is mostly interior this is not so bad, but the exterior section is still a big heat sink you don't want to feed... plus it might be leaky.)

Looks like the guys have you on the right track here!

 

[sportbikerider78]

That is the type of stove you put in a one room cabin, not a home.

 

[BurningWood]

Looks like an Englander 13NC would fit in there.

Burningwood this is a excellent suggestion...the bottom line is that you are going to have to spend some money to get something that is useful... a quick internet search turned up the 13NC for $699 at Home Depot...there will be spring sales coming along shortly...

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Englander-1-800-sq-ft-Wood-Burning-Stove-13-NCH/100157775

However, that stove is made for 1800 sq ft - my house is half that size. Don't I need a smaller stove? And the point about spring sales is on the mark, thanks for pointing that out to me. I just don't have a lot of money to work with so if I could find something used at half that price that would be a whole lot easier for me to accomplish. Suggestions on where to look? Craigslist within 150 miles only has old pre-EPA stoves listed.

 

[BurningWood]

The reason why the stove could be sold at all was it intentionally made to be leaky so that it could not be turned down. If you do get it to turn down its going to be a creosote maker. When there is an inevitable chimney fire, there could be push back on insurance as the appliance was not being operated as designed.

Interesting about the creosote. When the sweep was here at the beginning of the season it took him practically no time at all to clean the chimney and he remarked that it was quite clean.

 

[begreen]

Interesting about the creosote. When the sweep was here at the beginning of the season it took him practically no time at all to clean the chimney and he remarked that it was quite clean.

If the stove has dry fuel it may not produce much creosote. It's so leaky that the fire rarely has a chance to smolder. Usually overfiring is a more frequent issue.

 

[jwfirebird]

I had one, that's the thing, no way to slow it down so that and thin metal caused a bunch of cracks everywhere. not safe

 

[BurningWood]

If the stove has dry fuel it may not produce much creosote. It's so leaky that the fire rarely has a chance to smolder. Usually overfiring is a more frequent issue.

Yes, I am burning very good, dry wood. The concern about overfiring is why I am using magnets and foil to cut the air down. If I did not the temperature will easily and quickly soar to 600+ - bad news.

 

[BurningWood]

I had one, that's the thing, no way to slow it down so that and thin metal caused a bunch of cracks everywhere. not safe

Cracks? In the stove itself? I don't have any of those. But I did figure out how to slow it down by closing off the air with magnets (door holes) and foil (against the bottom edge of the door) in addition to closing the damper on the pipe. Last thing I want is an overfire.

 

[Tar12]

However, that stove is made for 1800 sq ft - my house is half that size. Don't I need a smaller stove? And the point about spring sales is on the mark, thanks for pointing that out to me. I just don't have a lot of money to work with so if I could find something used at half that price that would be a whole lot easier for me to accomplish. Suggestions on where to look? Craigslist within 150 miles only has old pre-EPA stoves listed.

Don't fill it full! Here is another option...going off of your demensions it would slide in there...barely

http://www.woodstovesreviews.com/stove-reviews/englander/17-vl.html

 

[begreen]

However, that stove is made for 1800 sq ft - my house is half that size. Don't I need a smaller stove? And the point about spring sales is on the mark, thanks for pointing that out to me. I just don't have a lot of money to work with so if I could find something used at half that price that would be a whole lot easier for me to accomplish. Suggestions on where to look? Craigslist within 150 miles only has old pre-EPA stoves listed.

It's rated 1200-1800 sq ft.. 1800 sq ft is the maximum, and the place would need to be pretty well insulated if it were in New England or Wisconsin. You don't need to fill the stovefull to burn a decent fire. But when temps drop below freezing you will be glad for the extra capacity. There are smaller stoves, like the Century S244 that would also work but with more frequent reloads.

 

[BurningWood]

Don't fill it full! Here is another option...going off of your demensions it would slide in there...barely

http://www.woodstovesreviews.com/stove-reviews/englander/17-vl.html

When I looked up the 13 that was recommended I saw that one as well. However, it has no ash drawer. So that won't work. But thanks for the idea!

 

[BurningWood]

It's rated 1200-1800 sq ft.. 1800 sq ft is the maximum, and the place would need to be pretty well insulated if it were in New England or Wisconsin. You don't need to fill the stovefull to burn a decent fire. But when temps drop below freezing you will be glad for the extra capacity. There are smaller stoves, like the Century S244 that would also work but with more frequent reloads.

Got it. Thanks. I just didn't want to end up with something too big and heat myself out of the house. Right now my stove room tends to stay very hot while the back bedroom is chilly. My hope is a better stove will help even that out. Do you have any recommendations for locating a used one? Or am I just stuck waiting and hoping for a sale to bring the price of a new one down?

 

[Mark8]

If this stove is not installed to code and is a fire hazard I personally would not sink one dime of your own money to fix it correctly. There are laws on the books to protect renters from slumlords that do things cheep and unsafe to save a dime. You need to be looking at the laws that protect renters, not at how to fix the property owners stove.

Know your rights and demand that the landlord provides safe and reliable heat to you.

 

[Tar12]

Hers is a review I found you might be interested in..Englander NC13

I am heating a 900 sq/ft cabin in NW Pa. in the Allegheny National forest. It is insulated but it can use more insulation. So far, It heats the whole cabin keeping the stove at around 400-450 degrees with the nights dipping into the low 30's. It drafts very well at 1720 ft altitude. No problems getting it started....just leave the door cracked for about 20 minutes. So far burn time has been about 5 hours on a fully loaded stove. I would think heating up to 1800 sq/ft would require keeping the stove at its maximum output of 550 degrees which probably isn't the best for everyday use. It takes 18" logs but it is tight in there .....16" logs is the better size to use. Ash tray dump is way to small...we just shovel it out the next day. Quality of the stove is good, no issues with broken bricks or glass. Ordered on line and picked up several days later from our local Home Depot. Read Less

 

[WiscWoody]

It looks like you have a cheap shop stove.... but it also looks like you have lots of help here. Good place to turn to!