New build, new wood heat options....

[tlhfirelion]

we currently have an Absolute Steel Hybrid, tall. Great stove. We are also planning to move and will be building a slightly smaller and simpler home, ICF for the exterior walls, stick built garage. It will be absurdly insulated everywhere. Approx. 1400 sq ft living.

Now I wouldn’t mind another Woodstock soapstone stove. It’s been great, performs well, looks great, is efficient, etc. that said, if I can gain a little of the living room square footage lost by having a wood furnace, I’m looking into that now. A quick search on here reveals a myriad of issues with my plan to put it in the garage or a small room in the garage. I have a call into my insurance guy so that may answer itself.

I am not planning to use a standard ducted heating and cooling system. I will be using ductless mini splits and a separate fresh air system (ERV). That may also eliminate my plans for a garage or outside boiler as the cost and complexity may make it not worth it.

My main reason for using wood aside from comfort, is power outages. We are and will be out in the county and loss of power in the winter can leave us stranded for days. As far as I know most if not all furnaces need some sort of power so again, that may answer my questions.

What are you folks thinking might be the best option for me after reading all of the above? Thanks in advance for your assistance.

 

[begreen]

If wood, it probably will be a small stove. Heat loss calcs may show a wood stove will be too powerful. A decent small propane heater with a standing pilot may suffice for backup heat. Run the numbers for the primary heat and that should indicate the size of stove you would put in. Also factor in an ERV or HRV for a tightly sealed house. During a power outage crack open some windows.

 

[Rearscreen]

My brother just built an extremely tight small house in VT and put the mini split system in. He said that the heating part of it is useless and he's extremely happy he put the Fireview in as "backup". Cooling works fine.

 

[tlhfirelion]

If wood, it probably will be a small stove. Heat loss calcs may show a wood stove will be too powerful. A decent small propane heater with a standing pilot may suffice for backup heat. Run the numbers for the primary heat and that should indicate the size of stove you would put in. Also factor in an ERV or HRV for a tightly sealed house. During a power outage crack open some windows.

Yes an ERV is already part of the plan. What smaller stoves would you suggest I research? We won’t have any gas, all electric. Thank you for the reply.

 

[tlhfirelion]

My brother just built an extremely tight small house in VT and put the mini split system in. He said that the heating part of it is useless and he's extremely happy he put the Fireview in as "backup". Cooling works fine.

We’re building in NW Arkansas and the feedback from mini split users we know there is quite positive, both from a cooling/heating and efficiency standpoint. I would assume they would work better in the milder winters there compared to Vermont. I’m tempted to go with just AC but if we happen to leave for multiple days like we sometimes do, that could create a problem. The cost difference between the AC and heat pump versions of Mitsubishi, Fujitsu and Diakin wasn’t that drastic.

I did look into radiant heat and man, that is EXPENSIVE here. It cost as much as the bids for the stove, mini splits and ERV combined. It’s no longer on the table. Thank you for your reply.

 

[maple1]

A house that small with that little heat load would rule out furnace or boiler right away for me.

Small wood stove to supplement. begreen's got it nailed.

 

[DickRussell]

Ditto on that low heat requirement for a very well insulated new house. For a house that size, I would expect something like 12-14,000 BTU/hr when it's zero outside, but a very good calculation is needed. Be careful when using canned software for that, as assumptions made for building just to code typically result in a grossly high figure for a superinsulated house. For a woodstove in a small, very tight house, an OAK connected directly to the stove would be a good idea. Especially when the weather outside isn't particularly cold, you won't be running even a small stove around the clock. The heat output will be just too much. With a directly connected OAK, you'll be able to let the stove burn out overnight without worrying about an air vent leaking cold air into the house all night. Even with an OAK, you may find lighting a fire in the stove difficult in a tight house if you have the dryer or range hood operating. On mine, I have to have those off when lighting the fire. Once a good draft is established, the OAK feeds the stove nicely without backdrafting.

 

[tlhfirelion]

A house that small with that little heat load would rule out furnace or boiler right away for me.

Small wood stove to supplement. begreen's got it nailed.

I suspected that would be the case. The draw was having all the wood heating outside or in the garage. No more wood inside, more floor space, etc. oh well, was a nice dream.

 

[tlhfirelion]

Just to clarify, this is, we hope, our last home. We’re all sick of moving and I’m sick of building so I don’t want a cheap stove. That said, there is a limit and we don’t have long brutal winters like some of my northern brethren, so a Blaze King XXXL Super Bass-o-matic 76 may not be needed. Lol.

 

[Rearscreen]

I would assume they would work better in the milder winters there compared to Vermont

Yup totally different, in your location a much better heat prognosis for a heat pump. And yes, radiant heat would be expensive there as it's not normally done there.

 

[DuaeGuttae]

Just to clarify, this is, we hope, our last home. We’re all sick of moving and I’m sick of building so I don’t want a cheap stove. That said, there is a limit and we don’t have long brutal winters like some of my northern brethren, so a Blaze King XXXL Super Bass-o-matic 76 may not be needed. Lol.

The Woodstock Survival stove?

A Blaze King Super Bass-o-matic 76 would certainly be overkill, but you might want to consider one of their 20 or 30 series stoves. The folks on the BK thread had quite a good discussion with me about turn down rates as well as clearances (some were making the case that the 30 runs lower than the 20 and has tighter clearances so is all around better; others were arguing that a 20 will necessarily put off less heat because of surface area). I do not live in a super-insulated house, but we’re a good bit south of you, and I’m interested in Blaze King because of the ability to maintain a low burn rate. We also have the concern about back-up heat.

 

[Sailrmike]

Woodstock Keystone or Palladian might be a nice fit

 

[begreen]

Woodstock Keystone or Palladian might be a nice fit

That is what first came to mind for me, but we need to know what the heat loss calcs say. ICF home can be heated with remarkably little energy, unless the weather outside is very cold. During milder weather the heat from appliances, bodies and lighting can suffice. In NW Arkansas a good quality mini-split from Mitsubishi, Daikin, or Fujitsu should easily heat the house.

Is a propane stove opposed because of concerns about having gas in the house?

 

[jetsam]

Just to clarify, this is, we hope, our last home. We’re all sick of moving and I’m sick of building so I don’t want a cheap stove. That said, there is a limit and we don’t have long brutal winters like some of my northern brethren, so a Blaze King XXXL Super Bass-o-matic 76 may not be needed. Lol.

 

[tlhfirelion]

That is what first came to mind for me, but we need to know what the heat loss calcs say. ICF home can be heated with remarkably little energy, unless the weather outside is very cold. During milder weather the heat from appliances, bodies and lighting can suffice. In NW Arkansas a good quality mini-split from Mitsubishi, Daikin, or Fujitsu should easily heat the house.

Is a propane stove opposed because of concerns about having gas in the house?

No, just don’t want to deal with gas appliances or gas in general.

 

[tlhfirelion]

View attachment 225358

I don’t know what that is, I have no need for it, but I do want to know more about it. What’s it called?

 

[Nateums]

You're on the right track with the ductless minisplit. HVAC can really rip you off on the install, though.

The thermostatically controlled catalytic woodstoves that claim 8-10k relatively consistent BTU output is probably something to consider. Burn tube secondaries is probably the opposite of what you want.

We are in upstate NY, I built our house with R20 slab, R40 walls, R60 attic. Throughout this awful March/April Highs in the 30s lows in the teens and we are building one fire every 24-36 hours in a Kitchen Queen 380. In Arkansas we'd probably burn 1/2 a cord all winter.

 

[jetsam]

I don’t know what that is, I have no need for it, but I do want to know more about it. What’s it called?

It's a big ole outdoor boiler that takes 12' logs. My wife is super strict about her fussy old 'no excavators in the living room' rule or I'd definitely have one.

 

[Mainely Saws]

Just wondering if having a power outage while away for a number of days or a week during cold temps is a concern that needs to be addressed ?

 

[tlhfirelion]

Hello everyone. Our build got delayed until this next spring so I’m revisiting this thread. IF we go with an indoor stove, we will most certainly get another Woodstock soapstone stove. We really like our current one.

That said, I think both the wife and I would prefer an outdoor stove. Well, we don’t need an outside boiler and won’t burn that much wood, so we thought about a furnace. The world of outside heaters of any kind is relatively new to me. I envision a fire chief type device but one that’s attached tot outside of the house and we load it as needed, keeping all wood and associated mess outside. I searched online and found Hyprotherm outdoor wood furnace. It looks like a small wood boiler but has no water jacket. This is more in line with what I envision. They’re only a couple hours from me. http://outdoorwoodfurnaceboiler.com/FORCED-AIR-OUTSIDE-WOOD-BURNING-FURNACE.htm?redirect=false

Are there better options? Any other brands I should look at? Our home won’t have a basement so it seems it’s either outdoor or indoor installs will be the best option.

Thanks!

 

[blades]

wood stove - no power requirement- everything else need power. If power outages are a concern nough said.

 

[jetsam]

Just wondering if having a power outage while away for a number of days or a week during cold temps is a concern that needs to be addressed ?

Definitely. I need 120v for both hot showers and blithering at people on the internet, so I have a generator.

Some people do have stoves that require a fan to put out good heat (we're talking about inserts here). They are well advised to have a backup plan. A low draw application like that can for example run off a car battery and a small inverter for a long time.

If you have a freestanding stove, I wouldn't worry about it too much.

 

[jetsam]

Hello everyone. Our build got delayed until this next spring so I’m revisiting this thread. IF we go with an indoor stove, we will most certainly get another Woodstock soapstone stove. We really like our current one.

That said, I think both the wife and I would prefer an outdoor stove. Well, we don’t need an outside boiler and won’t burn that much wood, so we thought about a furnace. The world of outside heaters of any kind is relatively new to me. I envision a fire chief type device but one that’s attached tot outside of the house and we load it as needed, keeping all wood and associated mess outside. I searched online and found Hyprotherm outdoor wood furnace. It looks like a small wood boiler but has no water jacket. This is more in line with what I envision. They’re only a couple hours from me. http://outdoorwoodfurnaceboiler.com/FORCED-AIR-OUTSIDE-WOOD-BURNING-FURNACE.htm?redirect=false

Are there better options? Any other brands I should look at? Our home won’t have a basement so it seems it’s either outdoor or indoor installs will be the best option.

Thanks!

You should probably start a new thread in the boiler forum- a lot of the furnace/boiler people don't read the stove forum and vice versa.

From what I've seen, expect your wood usage to increase a lot, but like you said, all the mess stays outside, and the heat is more even.

 

[begreen]

I strongly recommend you keep things simple and the original objectives in sight. That is wood heat comfort and power outage heat. A small Woodstock like the Palladian or Keystone would suffice and not need a lot of tending.

 

[tlhfirelion]

I strongly recommend you keep things simple and the original objectives in sight. That is wood heat comfort and power outage heat. A small Woodstock like the Palladian or Keystone would suffice and not need a lot of tending.

I know you’re right, I’m just trying to make a square peg fit in a round hole. If I just had the right woodworking tools.....

The only thing I don’t like about our Woodstock absolute steel high is the Catalytic combuster that needs replacement at some point. I wish someone else made a high style like the absolute hybrid. Any suggestions or do I just need to accept my fate? Lol. Thanks for the replies.