New low emission stove choice help

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bholler

Chimney sweep
Staff member
Jan 14, 2014
25,667
central pa
We need to remember that the gph emissions rating of an appliance does not indicate the amount of visible smoke or odor it can or will produce.
I completely understand that.
 
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aqua

Member
Mar 27, 2013
29
california
We need to remember that the gph emissions rating of an appliance does not indicate the amount of visible smoke or odor it can or will produce.
I completely understand that.
I understand and can also say that I’ve witnessed less smoke and odor from modern stoves ran well.

Below, my alcove. Tiles with air space behind. Been running safe for 20 years.

ED159C02-714A-462A-9092-CBB68EBBFB51.jpeg
 

bholler

Chimney sweep
Staff member
Jan 14, 2014
25,667
central pa
I understand and can also say that I’ve witnessed less smoke and odor from modern stoves ran well.

Below, my alcove. Tiles with air space behind. Been running safe for 20 years.

View attachment 281639
Do you know about the process of pyrolysis? Just because it worked this long without incident doesn't mean it will continue to
 
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begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
89,791
South Puget Sound, WA
Is the air gap behind the tiled surfaces ventilated, that is open at least 1" at the bottom and top so that air can circulate freely behind it? What was used for the air gap spacers?
 

aqua

Member
Mar 27, 2013
29
california
Do you know about the process of pyrolysis? Just because it worked this long without incident doesn't mean it will continue to
Yes, I know about pyrolysis.
I’ve been living with wood heat in alternative structures for 45 years.
i do the best I can, so I can sleep safely at night.
 

aqua

Member
Mar 27, 2013
29
california
Is the air gap behind the tiled surfaces ventilated, that is open at least 1" at the bottom and top so that air can circulate freely behind it? What was used for the air gap spacers?
It’s vented through the back with aluminum pipe pieces for spacers.
it wouldn’t pass our local California codes ( neither would my house) but my stove has full sized bricks on the inside that keeps the sides from getting hot. I’ve done a few legal hearths. This isn’t one of them but i deem it safe.
I’m a builder and welder by trade. I have inteligente and good working sense.
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
89,791
South Puget Sound, WA
Woodstock survival hybrid might work nicely in there
I would not put a stove in there that does not have full side and rear shielding like the Kent does. Call Woodstock and ask what they think.

It’s vented through the back with aluminum pipe pieces for spacers.
it wouldn’t pass our local California codes ( neither would my house) but my stove has full sized bricks on the inside that keeps the sides from getting hot. I’ve done a few legal hearths. This isn’t one of them but i deem it safe.
I’m a builder and welder by trade. I have inteligente and good working sense.
If the enclosure studs are metal and there are no combustibles involved, then it would be safe. If framed with wood studs, then it is less so.
 
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aqua

Member
Mar 27, 2013
29
california
I would not put a stove in there that does not have full side and rear shielding like the Kent does. Call Woodstock and ask what they think.


If the enclosure studs are metal and there are no combustibles involved, then it would be safe. If framed with wood studs, then it is less so.
My Kent only has rear shielding.
 

begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
89,791
South Puget Sound, WA
My Kent only has rear shielding.
I thought the Sherwood had a metal side cabinet with an air gap from the actual stove body, similar to the PE Super. If so, that acts as a side shield.
 

aqua

Member
Mar 27, 2013
29
california
I thought the Sherwood had a metal side cabinet with an air gap from the actual stove body, similar to the PE Super. If so, that acts as a side shield.
No that’s maybe the tile fire you’re thinking of? The Sherwood is single wall 3/16”. Top has interior baffle. I bricked the insides and bed which raised the box temps and lowered side temps and smoke output.
I have built shields for stoves and pipes. The most notable, in my sauna which has an old pot bellied that runs red hot. Simple stainless sheet metal reflectors with standoffs keeps the tile surround warm to the touch, not even hot.
The Sherwood is a great stove( I have 2) I just want to be respectful of my neighbors. The prevailing winds do blow my exhaust right to their house. Our stove is our only heat.
 

Todd

Minister of Fire
Nov 19, 2005
9,414
NW Wisconsin
Look into the Jøtul F45, looks like it may fit your space.
 
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begreen

Mooderator
Staff member
Nov 18, 2005
89,791
South Puget Sound, WA
No that’s maybe the tile fire you’re thinking of? The Sherwood is single wall 3/16”. Top has interior baffle. I bricked the insides and bed which raised the box temps and lowered side temps and smoke output.
Yes, must have been the Tile Fire. In that case, a stove like the PE Super or T5 or the Jotul F45 will be an improvement wrt reduced, side heat radiance. In cat stoves, the Regency 1500 and the BK Chinook and Ashford also have side cladding.
 
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aqua

Member
Mar 27, 2013
29
california
Yes, must have been the Tile Fire. In that case, a stove like the PE Super or T5 or the Jotul F45 will be an improvement wrt reduced, side heat radiance. In cat stoves, the Regency 1500 and the BK Chinook and Ashford also have side cladding.
The Regency has been on my list as a strong contender. I like the front controls and warranty.
 

Hoytman

Feeling the Heat
Jan 6, 2020
356
Ohio
I would invite my neighbor to the house and explain to him what you’re trying to do. Take him outside your home and explain the prevailing winds to him as well. Be sure and tell him your stove is older and that it’s your only heat source. Then tell him you’re planning to update your stove to a newer unit that is more efficient and modern in every way, be it a wood stove or a pellet stove. Tell him you’re making every change you can, but you can only do so much.

Compare emissions numbers from a wood stove big enough to heat your home. Do the same for a pellet stove. Even if their emissions numbers match...them look at the size of the exhaust and ask yourself which stove has the smaller exhaust. Which ever has the smallest exhaust means it’s breathing a lot less for the area being heated. At that point look at chimney height as well. It is highly doubtful raising your chimney will appease your neighbors. Now you looked at everything you can to change the situation. The rest is up to the weather and the burden of your neighbor. There is only so much you can do. A pellet stove may not be an option for whatever reason. Perhaps consider planting some fur trees along a property line to help break up the air flow going to your neighbors. That may just help as much as anything.
 
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kennyp2339

Minister of Fire
Feb 16, 2014
5,975
07462
Englander stove line with side shields?
 

aqua

Member
Mar 27, 2013
29
california
I would invite my neighbor to the house and explain to him what you’re trying to do. Take him outside your home and explain the prevailing winds to him as well. Be sure and tell him your stove is older and that it’s your only heat source. Then tell him you’re planning to update your stove to a newer unit that is more efficient and modern in every way, be it a wood stove or a pellet stove. Tell him you’re making every change you can, but you can only do so much.

Compare emissions numbers from a wood stove big enough to heat your home. Do the same for a pellet stove. Even if their emissions numbers match...them look at the size of the exhaust and ask yourself which stove has the smaller exhaust. Which ever has the smallest exhaust means it’s breathing a lot less for the area being heated. At that point look at chimney height as well. It is highly doubtful raising your chimney will appease your neighbors. Now you looked at everything you can to change the situation. The rest is up to the weather and the burden of your neighbor. There is only so much you can do. A pellet stove may not be an option for whatever reason. Perhaps consider planting some fur trees along a property line to help break up the air flow going to your neighbors. That may just help as much as anything.
We’re already good friends. I’ve done so much homework on the issue and talked it over with them as well.they’ve even offered to pitch in some $$. …good neighbors.
The problem is prevailing winds and a swale behind their house that creates an odd turbulence that make the smoke drop to their porch instead of just drifting by overhead.
i love my exisiting stove, and after all of my “research” it seems that a new 2021 cat stove would be cleanest replacement and I’m willing accept the possibility, more efficient with wood. I burn all night so the cat once again makes the most sense.
The problem is the price and finding the right fit for my space.
 

Highbeam

Minister of Fire
Dec 28, 2006
19,176
Mt. Rainier Foothills, WA
We’re already good friends. I’ve done so much homework on the issue and talked it over with them as well.they’ve even offered to pitch in some $$. …good neighbors.
The problem is prevailing winds and a swale behind their house that creates an odd turbulence that make the smoke drop to their porch instead of just drifting by overhead.
i love my exisiting stove, and after all of my “research” it seems that a new 2021 cat stove would be cleanest replacement and I’m willing accept the possibility, more efficient with wood. I burn all night so the cat once again makes the most sense.
The problem is the price and finding the right fit for my space.

I sure like my cat stove for the long and low 24 hour burns. Very controllable and more than enough heat for my old house. For skinny, the woodstock company makes some good ones.

I also like the idea above of planting some trees/bushes to help with the direct path of smoke to your neighbor. The leyland cypress I planted along my back fenceline grow three feet per year and quickly become an effective screen and would slow or stop the smoke path. If nothing else, the turbulence from the trees would mix it up to dilute it some.
 
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ABMax24

Minister of Fire
Sep 18, 2019
1,091
Grande Prairie, Alberta, Canada
Is it possible the flue could be extended a little to keep the smoke out of the turbulence on the downwind side of the house, and allow it to rise up and away?
 

Todd

Minister of Fire
Nov 19, 2005
9,414
NW Wisconsin
We’re already good friends. I’ve done so much homework on the issue and talked it over with them as well.they’ve even offered to pitch in some $$. …good neighbors.
The problem is prevailing winds and a swale behind their house that creates an odd turbulence that make the smoke drop to their porch instead of just drifting by overhead.
i love my exisiting stove, and after all of my “research” it seems that a new 2021 cat stove would be cleanest replacement and I’m willing accept the possibility, more efficient with wood. I burn all night so the cat once again makes the most sense.
The problem is the price and finding the right fit for my space.
yes, cat stoves burn a little cleaner on an overall average burn cycle but during start ups and reloading you need to bypass for 15-30 min until the cat is up to temp and you will see quite a bit of smoke, more so than a non cat. Maybe the hybrid stoves have eliminated this bypass smoke, jury is still out?

Also these EPA GPH numbers are an overall average of 3 different test burns in low, Med, and high. Many non cats burn under 1 GPH in the lower settings which is where most people burn at.