New to me insert, help me ID it

[fried_daddy]

I just moved into my new to me house. It has a very heavy fireplace insert located in the downstairs part of the house. I just had the chimney sweep guy come by for a cleaning and inspection and everything looked good once he got clear down to the brick. The guy got a total of seven 5 gallon buckets of stuff out from sweeping the chimney and cleaning behind the insert. He said it looks like it hasn't been cleaned in at least 4-5 years.

I am looking for information on what make/model this insert is and how to use it most efficiently.

I have ordered a new fiberglass seal to go between the insert and the brick face of the fireplace, so I will have to pull it again to install that properly. I have also ordered new rope seals for the door and a few different sizes of seals to see if I can get lucky and have one of them fit the glass.

I have searched high and low on the internet trying to find information on this insert and the only markings I saw on the insert itself was cast into the iron inside the door.
"ABF" - cast inside the door on the bottom lip
"CPF" - looks like it may actually be a tag inside the door on the bottom lip
"ABF-2" - cast into the door opening on the right hand(hinge) side of the door

I'm working on getting pictures uploaded.

 

[fried_daddy]

Pictures attached!

 

[bholler]

Didn't your sweep tell you that you need to connect that stove to a liner? If not you need a new one he is not looking out for your safety

 

[fried_daddy]

Didn't your sweep tell you that you need to connect that stove to a liner? If not you need a new one he is not looking out for your safety

He didn't mention anything about a liner. I may try another company next time. I looked up the chimney to inspect it after it was cleaned and there is a clay liner that is inside of it.

How do you determine that the chimney or liner size is correct for this insert?
Is being connected to the liner a life or death issue?
How do they connect liners to the rectangle vents on the top of the stove?
Was a liner supposed to be installed originally whenever the previous owner installed this stove?

 

[bholler]

He didn't mention anything about a liner. I may try another company next time. I looked up the chimney to inspect it after it was cleaned and there is a clay liner that is inside of it.

How do you determine that the chimney or liner size is correct for this insert?
Is being connected to the liner a life or death issue?
How do they connect liners to the rectangle vents on the top of the stove?
Was a liner supposed to be installed originally whenever the previous owner installed this stove?

The problem is that there is no connection between the stove and the clay liner. And no good way to make a connection. The only way to make it a safe code compliant system is to fun a stainless liner from the top of the stove to the top of the chimney. What you have now is referred to as a slammer install and it is not code compliant and can be dangerous in several ways.

1. Because of the lack of a connection and the fact that the fireplace liner is usually oversized for the stove the fluegasses expand allot as they exit the stove. This cools them and usually leads to substantial creosote buildup.

2. With that creosote buildup an increased risk of chimney fire is present. And with this type of install if you have a fire it will be very intense because you will have no way to limit the air coming in around the stove.

3. Because of the air leakage the draft will stall easily and most commonly at the end of the fire when co is being produced leading to a possibly very dangerous situation

 

[bholler]

He didn't mention anything about a liner. I may try another company next time. I looked up the chimney to inspect it after it was cleaned and there is a clay liner that is inside of it.

How do you determine that the chimney or liner size is correct for this insert?
Is being connected to the liner a life or death issue?
How do they connect liners to the rectangle vents on the top of the stove?
Was a liner supposed to be installed originally whenever the previous owner installed this stove?

And no when the stove was made and installed originally that type of install was common and acceptable. But we have since learned of the many potential problems and it has not been allowed for 20 years or so. Now in most cases there is absolutely nothing saying you cant use it other than insurance companies. But it is not safe. And honestly most reputable sweeps including us will not work on systems like yours anymore due to liability.

 

[fried_daddy]

The problem is that there is no connection between the stove and the clay liner. And no good way to make a connection. The only way to make it a safe code compliant system is to fun a stainless liner from the top of the stove to the top of the chimney. What you have now is referred to as a slammer install and it is not code compliant and can be dangerous in several ways.

1. Because of the lack of a connection and the fact that the fireplace liner is usually oversized for the stove the fluegasses expand allot as they exit the stove. This cools them and usually leads to substantial creosote buildup.

2. With that creosote buildup an increased risk of chimney fire is present. And with this type of install if you have a fire it will be very intense because you will have no way to limit the air coming in around the stove.

3. Because of the air leakage the draft will stall easily and most commonly at the end of the fire when co is being produced leading to a possibly very dangerous situation

Thanks for sharing all of this information. The previous owner used this all the time but I guess they were just lucky to have avoided any situations. I may still run a couple of fires (less than 10 over this winter) since the chimney and all areas were swept clean because I've been waiting for the opportunity to have my own wood burning fireplace for a long time. I can start planning now to get money saved up for the big insert replacement purchase for next year then I'll be able to use my new insert everyday.

Does this old insert have any resale value or is it better to just carry it to the scrap yard when I'm done with it?

So I'm taking these points from this:
1. I need to get a stainless steel liner installed from the top of the chimney, connecting down to the stove. I see these for sale for prices between $500 and $900 depending on the length and size. I'm unsure of what size to get or how to do the connection from round tubing to the large ~3"x20" rectangle vent on if I even attempt to connect it to this stove.

2. I probably need to remove this "slammer" and purchase a modern insert that has the proper circular connection points on top for the stainless steel liner to connect directly to.

 

[RobbieB]

I would just get a new insert and have it installed. Your flue is now cleaned and ready for a new SS liner. The fireplace looks to be in good condition also.

 

[begreen]

+1 Besides being safer, a modern insert connected to a liner is going to burn much cleaner, use much less fuel and it will provide you with more pleasure of a clean glass and fireview. Your insurance company should like it better too.

If you decide to get a new insert and need some more assistance, start a new thread in the main hearth forum.

 

[fried_daddy]

I would just get a new insert and have it installed. Your flue is now cleaned and ready for a new SS liner. The fireplace looks to be in good condition also.

The fireplace was in good condition. I am now saving up for a new insert.

+1 Besides being safer, a modern insert connected to a liner is going to burn much cleaner, use much less fuel and it will provide you with more pleasure of a clean glass and fireview. Your insurance company should like it better too.

If you decide to get a new insert and need some more assistance, start a new thread in the main hearth forum.

I will go there and start a new thread. It will be at least 6-9 months out before I get the replacement for this slammer. I just hope that new inserts aren't built in the "throw away and replace me" quality like alot of other new things manufactured in today's time.

 

[begreen]

See if there is a stove changeout program in NC that is still active. That might make it easier.
(broken link removed to http://www.lung.org/local-content/north-carolina/documents/Woodstove-Step-by-Step-Guide.pdf)

 

[fried_daddy]

See if there is a stove changeout program in NC that is still active. That might make it easier.
(broken link removed to http://www.lung.org/local-content/north-carolina/documents/Woodstove-Step-by-Step-Guide.pdf)

Thanks for sharing this information. When researching to get to my purchase I'll make sure to check for any changeout or rebate programs that are available.