Newbie looking for advice on a new build

[Dutchie84]

Hi guys, this is my first post and I just want to say thanks for all the info on here. I have done a ton of reading.

I am starting to build a house next spring and want a gasser with storage. what is the best way to hook it up? What are the pros and cons of each?

Thanks





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[maple1]

I would use an indoor boiler, in the shed beside your storage tank, and pressurize everything.

Lots of propane tanks in Moncton NB at Tri-Province.

Said without knowing anything about your situation or house etc..

Actually, even though I have a nice gassifier & storage, I would be hard pressed to do it all over again if I was building new today, I think. New construction gives lots of chance for building something that doesn't need much heat to start with - say, maybe a mini-split system or two & a stove to supplement with. Just talking a house, that is.

 

[hobbyheater]

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Have you looked at the Garn ?

 

[Dutchie84]

I haven't really considered a Garn. Are they open or closed?

Maple1 I was expecting that response from you about the mini splits. I have seen you post that before. A little more info. We are looking at building a 2500+\- sq ft house, plus basement and attached garage. I would also like to build a shop down the road. I just bought 25 acres of wood land to put it on so I got lots of fuel. I have a wood stove in my house now for the past 10 years and had one in my parents house for the 20 years before that and I'm kinda getting sick of the mess and bugs in the house. I also like the idea and benefits of in floor radiant heat. And on top of that my wife real hates the look of mini splits and I can't say I disagree with her. Happy wife happy life.

Aside from needing to use a brass circulator and top up the water level every now and then what are the downsides to an open boiler and storage like in the pictures. I plan on having a closed system in the house.

 

[warno]

Not sure why I forgot about Garn when I read this the first time. On a new build, I would be seriously considering one.

 

[huffdawg]

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Have you looked at the Garn ?

Garn are open

 

[Dutchie84]

Are there any Garn distributors in eastern Canada? The only one I found online was in BC.

 

[huffdawg]

If you can't find one out there . You could get it shipped to a shipping warehouse close to the border. They would drop it on a trailer for you. You would save on brokerage fees .. Also no duty because made in North America. The price of the greenback really hurts right now though.

 

[maple1]

I haven't really considered a Garn. Are they open or closed?

Maple1 I was expecting that response from you about the mini splits. I have seen you post that before. A little more info. We are looking at building a 2500+\- sq ft house, plus basement and attached garage. I would also like to build a shop down the road. I just bought 25 acres of wood land to put it on so I got lots of fuel. I have a wood stove in my house now for the past 10 years and had one in my parents house for the 20 years before that and I'm kinda getting sick of the mess and bugs in the house. I also like the idea and benefits of in floor radiant heat. And on top of that my wife real hates the look of mini splits and I can't say I disagree with her. Happy wife happy life.

Aside from needing to use a brass circulator and top up the water level every now and then what are the downsides to an open boiler and storage like in the pictures. I plan on having a closed system in the house.

Regular water analysis & treatment - think most do it annually. So the more water you have (either boiler & storage tied together, or a large all in one like a Garn), the more treatment stuff you will need for it. No idea how much that stuff costs. Think that's another example of being on the wrong side of the border - maybe.

 

[Dutchie84]

So if I went with the design with the 2 coil HX would I still have to treat the water? It would be just sitting there not moving. I'm thinking of a stainless steel tank with home made copper hx.

 

[maple1]

Some have used old stainless milk tanks like that. Insulated them best they could.

Another option could be a lined wood box type of tank. TomInMaine on here makes & sells those setups - I think his company is American Solartechnics. You could also build the wood part & get a liner from him - lots of flexibility there in getting storage into a tight space.

Anything not stainless, or with the right kind of plastic liner, will be open to corrosion. If it's not the right kind of plastic liner, it will deteriorate from the heat. And neither should require treatment - I don't think.

 

[92rslt1]

Are gassifiers mandated in canada now? Why even run storage? I see a lot of people like the added perks of having that comfort zone of knowing all that heat is in there, however running non storage myself I never considered the need for storage since it works so well without it. Just curious is all.

 

[maple1]

Efficiency gains.

 

[Nofossil]

Are gassifiers mandated in canada now? Why even run storage? I see a lot of people like the added perks of having that comfort zone of knowing all that heat is in there, however running non storage myself I never considered the need for storage since it works so well without it. Just curious is all.

For me, storage is more about convenience. I can do a really efficient flat-out fire when it suits my schedule (within limits, of course) and the house stays at a comfortable temp all the time. I go a couple days between fires in milder weather.

If I had it to do over, I think I'd add a connected boiler room off the back of the garage with 2000 gallons of pressurized storage - 4 x 500 gallon propane tanks. We have the boiler room in the basement now. It's nice to tend the fire without going outside, but the dust would be better elsewhere.

 

[Dutchie84]

For me, storage is more about convenience. I can do a really efficient flat-out fire when it suits my schedule (within limits, of course) and the house stays at a comfortable temp all the time. I go a couple days between fires in milder weather.

If I had it to do over, I think I'd add a connected boiler room off the back of the garage with 2000 gallons of pressurized storage - 4 x 500 gallon propane tanks. We have the boiler room in the basement now. It's nice to tend the fire without going outside, but the dust would be better elsewhere.

Nofossil is your storage pressurized now? I could do pressurized storage out in a shed instead I guess. Unpressurized just seemed easier to me for some reason. Is there any drawbacks to having pressurized storage in a separate building then the house? Other then the obvious fact that the heat that comes off of them will be more or less wasted heat. I just don't like the idea of having large tanks in my basement that I wont be able to replace with out major work to the house (no walk out planned) if they ever needed replacement.

 

[Woodfarmer1]

With the recent problems with the garn anode rods and an open system that I have to spend $200 a year in chemicals, at the moment I cannot recommend it.
I thought I did my due diligence when replacing my empyre, but I really didn't find too much information on the topic of water treatment in an open system.

 

[Dutchie84]

Ok, so after all the great opinions, now I'm leaning towards a closed indoor boiler installed in a insulated boiler shed, with storage. This will probably open a can of worms but what boilers would you recommend? Up until now I have only been looking at open boilers.

Maple1 I saw somewhere on here that you were from northern NS if you don't mind me asking where about? I'm from Antigonish but live in Milford(next to shubie) now. Is there a dealer for the boiler that you went with in NS? And why did you choose them, was it just because it didn't require power for a fan?

 

[maple1]

I'm in Cumberland.

The only dealer for mine is in Pennsylvania (Smokeless Heat). I sent a bank draft, he freighted the boiler - the boiler got here before he got my bank draft, awesome service.

I went with this one for simplicity sake, mainly. I think it was also fairly priced, compared to what else was out there - and I really liked the overall design, particularly the maintenance/cleaning related aspect of that. And natural draft appealed to me.

Not sure what is available locally. There used to be a guy in NB advertising Econoburns on kijiji - not sure if he's still in operation or not. But if so, an Econoburn wouldn't be a bad choice at all for a shed boiler, IMO - as far as I have read, they are a solid boiler. I couldn't find anything at all locally when I was looking - except for Empyre (being sold by someone in the Valley), who have since apparently gone out of business. Good luck, either way.