Newbie needs opinions on wood insert

[tora]

I'm really glad I found this forum! Thanks to y'all for sharing your expertise.

I'm planning on buying a wood insert for my double-sided fireplace (planning to cover the back of the insert with a black metal sheet; will probably put candles on that side). Not heating the entire house with it, just trying to cut down on oil use. Would like clean burning (seems like they all are now), large viewing area, traditional look (Victorian style house), and no operating problems!

My fireplace opening is 29 1/2" wide and 28" high (since it's double sided the walls go straight through). Here are the inserts I'm looking at:

Jotul Kennebec - recommended by good-name local dealer. Don't like the double door and would prefer larger viewing area, but like cast iron

Vermont Castings Montpelier - very much like the look, but very worried now after reading some threads on this site. The Montpelier is fairly new - there is a current thread on it and the experiences seem to be mixed. One person was concerned about the hinges not being thick enough to handle the weight of the door - seems like a big red flag

Pacific Energy - a dealer in the next town said this one has had the fewest problems of all the models they sell. Looks decent enough, but it's made of steel - in-town dealer said cast iron gives off "softer" heat, which is better...? Not sure which Pacific model is appropriate for me, specifications on the Pacific site are unclear to this newbie

Harmon - know nothing about this brand, dealer in next town also carries it. Looks OK, I think it would fit

Any opinions on these or other recommended brands would be appreciated, thanks

 

[Hogwildz]

All are good insert. Not going to knock VC, but they have been having problems.
You may also want to look at the Hampton inserts, Very classy, very nice. http://www.hampton-fire.com/Wood/Inserts/
BTW, candles on the back side, prolly will melt.

 

[weatherguy]

Whats the distance between the two openings? The reason I ask is because I have a see through fireplace and I dont have enough clearance betwen the lintel and the flue to exhaust a wood stove. I can put a pellet stove because they exhaust out the back. My solution is to put my pellet stove in the see through and block one side with metal like you and put a woodstove in my fireplace in my lower level family room

 

[Hogwildz]

Whats the distance between the two openings? The reason I ask is because I have a see through fireplace and I dont have enough clearance betwen the lintel and the flue to exhaust a wood stove. I can put a pellet stove because they exhaust out the back. My solution is to put my pellet stove in the see through and block one side with metal like you and put a woodstove in my fireplace in my lower level family room

Depending on where the old chimney flue is compared to where your stove outlet is, there are a couple options to offset the outlet to reach the flue.

 

[woody22]

just my 2cents for now, i finally after 6 months of aggrevation had my montpelier removed yes it is a nice looking unit and had alot of things that made us all happy except for not providing heat. Which is a pretty big deal. So I would be one of the ones who has not been happy with the unit and am glad to see it go. I also did not like trying to deal with Vermont Casting. I had to replace it with a Hampton 300. Have not used it yet , I hope it will be better would have really just liked my money back but that was not an option.

 

[weatherguy]

Depending on where the old chimney flue is compared to where your stove outlet is, there are a couple options to offset the outlet to reach the flue.

I have 14 inches from the front of the lintel to where the flue starts, its angled from there. What options would I have? Id rather put the wood stove in the fireplace in the living room area.
My opening is small, its 24" x 30".

 

[Hogwildz]

Depending on where the old chimney flue is compared to where your stove outlet is, there are a couple options to offset the outlet to reach the flue.

I have 14 inches from the front of the lintel to where the flue starts, its angled from there. What options would I have? Id rather put the wood stove in the fireplace in the living room area.
My opening is small, its 24" x 30".

You could slide a freestanding stove back in there and set it so the flue is right above or close to the outlet of the stove.
You could use an insert, and depending on how much room you have above it either use an elbow say like a 30 degree to a flex liner.
Or you could use an offset on either set up. (broken link removed to http://www.chimneylinerdepot.com/store/comersus_viewItem.asp?idProduct=64)

is it 24" wide or tall x 30" wide or tall? Some photos would be real helpful.

 

[weatherguy]

thanks for the info, Ill take some pics and start another thread later, I dont want to hijack this thread any more than I already have.
I cant do a freestanding, you'll know why when you see the pics.

 

[mcollect]

We had a double sided fireplace and the better half wanted a wood burner that produced real heat. One that did not reduce the room temps. We went with a Jotul and could not be happier. So far this year we have not had to use any petro fuel. It takes a long time to learn how to get it right, but now we are totally happy with our choice.
Our weekend home is finally warm, never was before we had the insert and she loves the sight of the flames. We added a screen to the other side and it looks fine. I would love to know what others with double sided have done to make theirs look good?

 

[tora]

Hogwildz, weatherguy

On mine I'm estimating the front of the lintel to the flue is about 21 inches on the side where I want to put the insert (from lintel to lintel is about 48"). I assumed that was more than enough for the inserts I was looking at...?

My first idea actually was to look for a double-sided stove. Hunter in the UK makes one but no dealers in the US, I assume because it doesn't meet EPA emission standards.

But the more I thought about it, the more I thought that a stove wouldn't be the best option anyway because with what we have (a stone mantle) the stove would have to sit completely inside the fireplace, thus not warming the air in the room as well.

For inserts, is there a big enough difference between cast iron (Jotul) and steel (Pacific) to warrant it as a choice criterion?

 

[Islander08]

The RSF Oracle is a double sided EPA-style (although not certified in the 2-sided version as I recall) fireplace.

Not sure if that could be an option...

 

[johnn]

Don`t really have first hand with any of the models you are looking at, however i have been doing lots of research. A local dealer pushed real hard for the Blaze King Princess, (catalytic i believe). I would look hard at the Harmon if it was in my budget. There are a couple threads on the extended burn times, but you must get a large box to help in that area. Less wood and loading is a good thing for myself seeing how I am a full time employee.

 

[oconnor]

I am a big fan of the Kennebec - I like the fact that it can be installed to protrude into the room. The cast iron doors are nice to look at, and I find I get good enough heat to keep the room at temp without the blower. The firebox is small, so I don't get long burn times.

The "Cast Iron" difference is mostly marketing from where I sit - in an insert, the only cast iron you get is the doors.

That said, I would go for a stove if you can, or one of the double sided fireplaces mentioned above - we couldn't fit a stove into our fireplace, and the double sided idea would look truly sweet if you could make it work.

 

[tora]

Thanks for the replies. Right now I'm leaning toward Jotul Kennebec or Winterwarm, or Lopi Declaration. Today I was quoted $3500 for the Declaration (ouch!) and $2200 for the Winterport. I could go for the Kennebec but we have a marble mantle surround - my wife doesn't want the protrusion to take away from that, but I like the idea of getting more heat.

One guess on who'll probably win on that one...

 

[jimmol]

Which model of winterwarm?
I have the small insert, bought it when others were saying "VC has problems." That was 6 years ago. I think they will always have problems but the small insert works fine for smaller fireplaces. I have marble and white quarts on my fireplace.

 

[tora]

Oops, mixed up my inserts. I meant the Jotul Winterport. For Vermont Castings, I had been looking at the Montpelier but a local dealer said he used to carry VC but doesn't now because of problems for customers.

Thanks for the input. I bet your Winterwarm looks good with the marble. I really like the look of the Montpelier...

 

[labrador]

We have a double sided fireplace, 38" deep, 35" wide and 30" high. We bought the Jotul 550 Fockland. Better to go with a larger firebox than to find out you're not getting enough heat. It is a flush wall unit, the surround and the door radiate some heat, but the double fans really pudh out the heat. Insert depends on size of fireplace and how much square footage you want ot heat. Also insulation in the house , how much, in walls and ceiling.

 

[tora]

Labrador,

I wish the Rockland was an option, but our fireplace is only 29 1/2" wide, and the Rockland needs 32" or 33" I think.

Thanks for the input!

 

[Dix]

Labrador,

I wish the Rockland was an option, but our fireplace is only 29 1/2" wide, and the Rockland needs 32" or 33" I think.

Thanks for the input!

I think you need the best bang for your buck, that's what I did as I concluded my research. That, and the warranty.

Food for thought. I think your wife might like the idea of more heat with an extended door, once she realizes the beauty of it

Welcome to the forums !

 

[jadm]

I have the Jotul Rockland which is flush. Can't remember what dimensions are anymore.

The 450 does extend out and you would get more heat out of it because of that and it is really nice to look at. Can't imagine that it would detract from the marble - might even enhance it.

You might check out the photo section here of all of the stoves/insert installs. Many ideas and your wife might be more open to the 450 after seeing how attractive installs can be.

Good luck!

 

[weatherguy]

I have the Jotul Rockland which is flush.

Are you happy with the heat output with that unit? How much sf are you heating?

 

[jadm]

I have the Jotul Rockland which is flush.

Are you happy with the heat output with that unit? How much sf are you heating?

Insert I had prior to this one had a much smaller firebox and struggled to keep room in mid 70 range that I like it on days below 40*. Lots of coal build up which, by mid afternoon I had to scoop out to load more wood. Too much waste.

It did stick out onto the heart and I did get quite a bit of radiant heat because of that. Was nice to be able to burn with the blower off and still get warmth.

House is 1800 sq.ft. ranch. Not an open floor plan at all. Insert is located in the front of the house and keeps our front room, kitchen and dining room in the mid 70's easily. I guess that the area is about 800 sq. ft. I can build a fire in the a.m. and, if it is 35* or higher, I let it burn and then still have enough heat to get through the afternoon without reloading until evening.

It has no trouble keeping us in the mid 70's with temps. below 35*. In fact, it burns better in the colder temps. Radiates the internal heat for hours too due to it's mass. Blowers are necessary though. Very little heat radiates from the surround.

I love that this insert can handle high temps. I usually burned our old insert at about 450* and got nervous when it edged towards 500* . With this insert I don't even turn the blowers on until it reaches 500* and it's cruising temp. seems to be in the mid 600* up to low 700*. Really throws out the heat at those temps.

If I reloaded on a regular basis we would over heat. I am guessing that if we had an open floor plan it would keep it toasty.

There are others here who have the Rockland too and are heating areas larger than I do. Can't recall any of them being disappointed.