Newbie... Questions on temperature

[begreen]

Discussion moved to its own thread.

I don't get good secondary flames going until my stovetop reach at least 600-650 on my summit and run it all day well over 700

Where are the temps being measured? Under the trivet or on top of it? I've noted on our Alderlea and on my friend's Summit that secondary combustion starts well before 600F actual stove top temp, especially on a cold startup.

FWIW, running the stove well over 700F every time is possible, but may shorten the life of some firebox components like the baffle.

 

[diverscale]

Where are the temps being measured? Under the trivet or on top of it? I've noted on our Alderlea and on my friend's Summit that secondary combustion starts well before 600F actual stove top temp, especially on a cold startup.

FWIW, running the stove well over 700F every time is possible, but may shorten the life of some firebox components like the baffle.

I meant "good and full" secondaries which will remain even when turning down the draft and get no smoke out of chimney. I do get secondaries before that, just not as efficient ones.

I measure at the hottest average spot observed with my laser thermo which is adjacent to flue, just front of it. Hell there is no way I'd heat my home not going over 700

 

[Woody Stover]

there is no way I'd heat my home not going over 700

Tough to do from the basement..

 

[begreen]

Tough to do from the basement..

Yes, this is when a wood furnace can be a more practical alternative.

 

[diverscale]

Tough to do from the basement..

This, and the constant sub zero (sub -20 celcius) we are getting here. We are getting one hell of a winter and we like it warm and cozy in here.

Most of the time my summit is cruising at 700-750, and that is using my laser thermometer and finding the hottest spot. My stovetop thermo sometimes indicate 600 and if I look around with the laser thermo I can find a 700 zone.

Anyway, I still think the guy is not getting the stove hot enough before backing off the draft, and I would not fear to try it over 700 to see of his problem resolves itself.

 

[begreen]

Thanks, that explains the difference. I measure stove top temp about 6" in front and to the left or right of the flue collar. You are measuring the hottest point. The reading will be hotter right at the flue collar. It's too warm here to burn or I would do a quick comparison for you with our stove.

 

[diverscale]

Thanks, that explains the difference. I measure stove top temp about 6" in front and to the left or right of the flue collar. You are measuring the hottest point. The reading will be hotter right at the flue collar. It's too warm here to burn or I would do a quick comparison for you with our stove.

Just started a fire and got reliable and full secondaries at 500-525 deg. Hottest measured point on stovetop with the help of some papers added. Really thought I needed 600

 

[Woody Stover]

It's too warm here to burn or I would do a quick comparison for you with our stove.

Leave your clothes in the other room.

 

[begreen]

I started tracking secondary combustion this year and was surprised one day with a cold start to see good secondary combustion in a starting fire when the stove top was only 250º. I attribute this to the pumice stone insulated firebox getting up to 1100º well before the massive stove body gets hot. The flue temp was already up to 500º. That's why I tend to follow the flue (probe) temp and visuals more than stove top temp.

 

[begreen]

Leave your clothes in the other room.

Nah, stove is in the living room. I'm taking this opportunity to clean out ash. I burned cherry for a few days and boy what a difference in ash buildup. It made more than a month's burning of doug fir.

 

[Woody Stover]

Nah, stove is in the living room.

Walking around the living room naked, that's living. How many oil, gas or electron burners can do that without getting unsightly goose bumps?

I burned cherry for a few days and boy what a difference in ash buildup. It made more than a month's burning of doug fir.

I haven't really kept track, looking at how much ash I get out of a full load of Cherry. I mostly just use a split or two on the front of a load of hard-starting woods like White Oak or Black Locust. Maybe Cherry will ash more but you sure can't beat the aroma outside.

 

[diverscale]

Thanks, that explains the difference. I measure stove top temp about 6" in front and to the left or right of the flue collar. You are measuring the hottest point. The reading will be hotter right at the flue collar. It's too warm here to burn or I would do a quick comparison for you with our stove.

Just a FYI

As of this fire right now, starting with a bed of coal and a fully loaded firebox, stovetop temperature 6inch behind from the flue is 670 deg, and hottest temperature I could find was a 850 deg spot when scanning around, hence why I use my laser for now since the stove is somewhat new for me. When I'll get used to it and get to know its temper, I'll stop the laser thermometer paranoia and use only the stovetop thermometer.

 

[begreen]

No harm, it's all good knowledge. 850F is pushing overfire territory. If you see a dull glow in that area with the lights turned off, the stove is too hot.

If the flue collar area is getting much hotter than the stove pipe it could be that draft is too strong and flue temps are high. That's wasted heat. Do you have a flue thermometer on the connector pipe?

 

[diverscale]

No harm, it's all good knowledge. 850F is pushing overfire territory. If you see a dull glow in that area with the lights turned off, the stove is too hot.

If the flue collar area is getting much hotter than the stove pipe it could be that draft is too strong and flue temps are high. That's wasted heat. Do you have a flue thermometer on the connector pipe?

Flue temp is 450, and with everything stabilized (heat moved through the stovetop plate) 6" down is 700 and maximum measured is 750

 

[begreen]

That sounds better. On a full reload our stove top will hit 700F+ at times. Depends on the wood species, how tightly packed, size of splits, etc. What's the peak flue temp you are seeing on startup? (Is this with a probe thermometer?)

 

[diverscale]

That sounds better. On a full reload our stove top will hit 700F+ at times. What's the peak flue temp you are seeing on startup? (Is this with a probe thermometer?)

it is using my laser on the flue. I should get a probe thermometer, been postponing that for years. With my observations, I think that when your stovetop hit 700, you could have an hot spot hitting over 800 and you don't know it.

I like the idea of following flue temp over stovetop. Been a fan of stovetop for my reload procedure though

 

[begreen]

Never ran this stove, or any non-cat, but 450 seems crazy low, compared to the temps I see most non-cat guys posting. Isn’t 650F more typical?

Not that low if the blower is going. That can drop the temp by 100º or more.

 

[diverscale]

Sorry to highjack thread, but been searching and cannot find a suitable answer.

been searching over at amazon.ca and the flue probe thermometers are over 100$ there, plus shipping. Anyone has a suggestion of a specific probe that I could search for and maybe find a better deal?

 

[Jan Pijpelink]

Sorry to highjack thread, but been searching and cannot find a suitable answer.

been searching over at amazon.ca and the flue probe thermometers are over 100$ there, plus shipping. Anyone has a suggestion of a specific probe that I could search for and maybe find a better deal?

look here https://www.sandhillwholesale.com/thermometers-c-1_21_200.html

https://www.rockfordchimneysupply.com/probe-thermometer.php

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000LZDVAU/?tag=hearthamazon-20

 

[diverscale]

look here https://www.sandhillwholesale.com/thermometers-c-1_21_200.html

https://www.rockfordchimneysupply.com/probe-thermometer.php

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000LZDVAU/?tag=hearthamazon-20

Good god that was fast. Thank you!!

 

[diverscale]

look here https://www.sandhillwholesale.com/thermometers-c-1_21_200.html

https://www.rockfordchimneysupply.com/probe-thermometer.php

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000LZDVAU/?tag=hearthamazon-20

Ordered. Since it fits in the newbie subject of this post, and I am a total newbie with probes, what probe temp I should aim for during startup and what temp should I aim for during the main burn cycle?

 

[Jan Pijpelink]

View attachment 222400

Ordered. Since it fits in the newbie subject of this post, and I am a total newbie with probes, what probe temp I should aim for during startup and what temp should I aim for during the main burn cycle?

Well, I am not an expert, but I keep my stove top between 400 and 600. I reduce the air intake above 500, so the secondaries take over. The experts on this site might have other advise.

 

[begreen]

Sorry to highjack thread, but been searching and cannot find a suitable answer.

been searching over at amazon.ca and the flue probe thermometers are over 100$ there, plus shipping. Anyone has a suggestion of a specific probe that I could search for and maybe find a better deal?

The Drolet probe thermometer AC07840 isn't bad. $14 US
(broken link removed to https://www.drolet.ca/en/accessories-and-venting-products/accessories/meters/)

Just to verify - there is double-wall stove pipe on the Summit, right? A probe thermometer is for double wall stove pipe only.

This is important and why I asked about how the temp on the stove pipe was being read. If it was 450F on single wall, that is very hot.

 

[diverscale]

The Drolet probe thermometer AC07840 isn't bad. $14 US
(broken link removed to https://www.drolet.ca/en/accessories-and-venting-products/accessories/meters/)

Just to verify - there is double-wall stove pipe on the Summit, right? A probe thermometer is for double wall stove pipe only.

This is important and why I asked about how the temp on the stove pipe was being read. If it was 450F on single wall, that is very hot.

There is a double wall pipe, though installed in 1992, after observing newer double wall design, mine might not insulate as well as modern designs, my insurances were ok my current ones though.
Thanks for the flue thermo suggestion.

 

[begreen]

If you were reading 450º on double-wall the flue was extremely hot. A probe thermometer will help a lot.