Now I am really Confused....

[sblat]

I have been researching new stoves online for quite some time. I thought that I had it narrowed down to a PE Summit and a Napoleon 1900. I live in an about 2100 sq 80 yr old fairly drafty house in Mighigan. Now looking at the stoves in the shop, I feel like I am back to square 1. I was quoted almost $3500 on the Summit, which blew my mind, maybe I am just that nieve. Then seeing the Napoleon 1900 in person, it is f-ing huge. Not sure that I can stand that monstrocity in my family room.

The shop did have a napoleon 1400 with nickol legs and door that was very sharpe for $1700 that I would consider if some one would tell me that it could heat my house. I need an all night burn, and I am just not sure that the 1400 will keep up with my heating needs. I think it will do better than my current stove, which is an old VC Resolute III. But if I am going to spend that money, it better be for the long haul, and able to get the job done.

Also, another shop does have 2 show room models that peaked my interest. They have a green PE Classic for about $1400 and a PE Alderlea T5 for about $1700. These are both used in the shop for this season and both have had under 20 fires in them. PLEASE HElP

Steve

 

[certified106]

Buy the T5 now! Thats a great price, as I have been looking at them and getting prices quite a bit higher than that.

 

[sblat]

Will the T5 be able to heat my 2100sq pretty well? Just want to make sure that I don't under do it. Is the burn time good on these units? I guess I don't do know much about them at all. Thanks for all the help everyone, I would have never thought that choosing the right wood stove would be such a long process. But it is a big decision and one I want to get right. If I don't my wife will never let me make another major decision again

Steve

 

[KTLM]

I think one of the moderators here has a T5. It seems to me that he is very happy with it. Maybe he will offer some info. if you give it time.

 

[Mt Ski Bum]

I agree w/ certified- that's a great price! It should heat 2k square feet fine. The Summit is actually one size larger & rated for 3k square feet, so it might be too big for the area you're trying to heat.

 

[MF1529]

I purchased a PE Summit Classic a month ago and I paid $2200. The classic has panels on the side and top for a convection effect. The PE Summit was around $1900. These prices were with a 10% off sale. I would tell the dealer that quoted you $3500 to stuff it and never return there. I replaced a Hearthstone Mansfield with the Summit. I have been thrilled with it. It is bullet proof and throws out tons of heat. As I'm writing this it's 7 degrees out and my 1700 sqft house is hanging right at 72 with no effort at all. I don't have a prolblem with too much heat. I'd rather too much than not enough. Good luck

 

[Jimbob]

The total for our Summit was $1452, after taxes. At ~ $3500, they are really trying to rip you off, unless they were including the stovepipe, chimney and installation!
Our Summit is black, with black door, pedestal, and ash system.

 

[begreen]

Based on the house description and location I would go for the Summit. Something is wrong with the quote. Find out why the price is so high. Were they also adding in a flue installation? If so, it might not be so bad. You should be able to get a Summit in your area for about $2200. If not order it.

(broken link removed to http://www.chimneysweeponline.com/pacsumm.htm)

 

[greythorn3]

wow that summet looks almost exactly like a englander 30nch, are they made by the same people and just rebranded?

 

[sblat]

Thanks for all the thoughts. I am going into that shop today to figure out what gives with that quote. I specifically asked if that was for the stove only and he said yes. I told him that I could get it online for around $2000 inlcuding shipping. I am going to give it one more shot, because it seems that the PE are well better made than the Napoleons.

If the price on the Summit is still really high, what does everyone think about the T5? Will that heat my house ok, or will I be frustrated next winter because it can't keep up? Thanks

 

[madison]

Will the T5 be able to heat my 2100sq pretty well? Just want to make sure that I don't under do it. Is the burn time good on these units? I guess I don't do know much about them at all. Thanks for all the help everyone, I would have never thought that choosing the right wood stove would be such a long process. But it is a big decision and one I want to get right. If I don't my wife will never let me make another major decision again

Steve

No, based on your description of a "drafty house in Michigan." And spousal pressure. And most females that I know like the home warmer vs colder. And if you are in the upper Peninsula of MI, definately NO!

Regarding the pricing, are you certain that the quoted $3700 is for the stove alone? Or is that delivered, installed etc. And visa versa, it sounds like the price for the T5 maybe without install etc. ie you bring your pickup truck and take it home yourself.

Make sure you are comparing apples to apples, and don't make the mistake of saving a few $$ now then realize that you were going to try to heat your home with the furnace off -- with a stove way undersized. You will be disappointed and in hot water with the wife if that is your expectation.

Cozy fire in the living room, the T5 would be great. Whole drafty house in Michigan, never.

 

[sblat]

That's exactly what I have been thinking! I would like to heat the whole house with this purchase. I do pretty well with my Resolute III right now, and that stove is fairly undersized for my house. The stove guy told me $3500 for stove only. He said he could not even come close to buying the stove alone for what I said I could get it for online. I am headed there when I get done teaching for the day and clear some things up. If he can't get me the right price on the Summit I will get it online. I would much rather get it from a local shop, but not if there are going to bend me over like that.

 

[snowleopard]

A description of the construction and layout of the house would be helpful in answering this question, and where the stove would be located in it. You mentioned that the house is fairly drafty. What do you have for insulation in floor, walls, and roof? What are your windows like?

Here's where I'm going with that: you could put in a big stove, and keep it cranking with a lot of wood, and keep the place warm-ish. Or you could put in a smaller stove, and use the price difference between them to beef up insulation, seal cracks, maybe replace some leaky windows. This is going to save you in wood (either money or labor) every year, and allow you to run your stove at a more moderate temp, and have cozier corners and a happier family. And your wife will recognize that she has married one smart fella.

What's the microclimate like (the site where the house is located)? Tucked under a ridgetop and shielded from winds, southern exposure with lots of solar gain? Also, will you be using any secondary heat sources?

I'm heating a 2000sf house in Alaska with nothing but a parlor stove (Hearthstone Heritage) and it keeps the place wonderfully cozy. (Didn't plan it that way--got it for backup heat, and the boiler failed this winter--but it's working.)

It's a big decision--not just the money for the stove, but wanting to make sure that it's going to work out as planned. (There are plenty of examples on this site of what can go wrong.) So you're wise to be asking these questions and taking the time to make the right choice. It will be worth it in the end

 

[WhitePine]

The shop did have a napoleon 1400 with nickol legs and door that was very sharpe for $1700 that I would consider if some one would tell me that it could heat my house. I need an all night burn, and I am just not sure that the 1400 will keep up with my heating needs. I think it will do better than my current stove, which is an old VC Resolute III. But if I am going to spend that money, it better be for the long haul, and able to get the job done.

We have a Napoleon 1400. It even has the nickel legs and door. It can heat our 2000 sf house no problem, but..........

We are in Tennessee, not Michigan. 6 above is the coldest we have personally ever seen here.

Our house in new, tight, with a huge amount of thermal mass. We don't need overnight burns and have never done one.

Based on what I know about Michigan and the description of your house, I would say the 1400 probably wouldn't make it.

 

[sblat]

The house is 2100 sf cape cod. The location of the stove is in a large addition with 12' ceilings. The house is fairly open, and I currently do pretty well getting the heat from the stove room to the kitchen, dining room and front living room. The back two bedrooms and bathroom down a hall tend to stay fairly cold right now, but do-able. In my current stove I can get 500 degree temps for about 2-3 hrs max , then it crashes from there, and I need to reload after 5 hrs if not before if I'm lucky. I do have a propane furnace that runs first thing in the morning and a little in the afternoon. I would like to do away with the propane as much as possible.

 

[snowleopard]

That was quick! I edited to add more questions, and see you've answered the first ones already. So it's a one-story house?

 

[Jags]

wow that summet looks almost exactly like a englander 30nch, are they made by the same people and just rebranded?

He,he he - somebody is gonna get kicked off the island.

PE (Pacific Energy) - Summit
Englander - 30

 

[Dakotas Dad]

I am thinking, honestly, spend money on getting your drafty house condition taken care of. Insulation of the envelope is way more important to comfort than stove size in my opinion. Once your stove no longer has to be sized to heat the front yard too, you won't need as much stove, but more importantly, you won't need as much wood.. which BTW, you should already be stacking..

 

[sblat]

The windows in the house are ok, but I do use a window wrap on them in the winter, and the big windows in the stove room have magnetic insulating windows that go on in the winter. Wall insuation is almost non existant in the origanol 1500 sq foot part of the house. The stove room (an addition) has decent wall insulation, but not the rest. I would have to pull of the siding and punch holes in every bay to reinsulate. I plan on doing that in the next year or 2 when we take down aluminum siding and put up vinyl. The house is a cape cod, so there is a 2nd floor to the house, but we really don't use that room right now, but might some time down the road. When we have used it, opening the door to go up there lets enough heat up there for use. I could use more insulation in the walls and attic up stairs that I will intend to this summer.

If I tighten things up a bit with the house, will the T5 work ok? I am thinking so, since I do pretty well when we are home and burning my old VC. With added extended burn times and overnight burns even with the T5 i am thinking I will be able to almost eliminate by propane furnace all together. I will always have it there if I need it. Or am I under shooting it?

 

[MF1529]

The T5 certainly is a nice looking stove, but if you have to ask if it will work ok why not go with something you know will work like the Summit or T6. My home is a log home, and I would consider it drafty. I have been through 3 stoves in 5 years and I am finally pleased with the big Summit, and I hope it will last forever. Having spent significant cash on a VC and Hearthstone prior I can say from experience it is very frustrating to not get the expected heat from a new stove. Here in northern Vermont we've seen temps as low as -26 f this winter and they were frequently in single digits. The Summit was adequately sized for the single temps. I didn't have it for the -26 night. When the temps reach the 20 and 30's I fill the stove less and burn the coals down longer. From what I see on the weather channel the U.P. is similar in temps. IMO it is better to have some extra stove for the cold periods.

Does anyone know what the standards are for rating a stove to a homes sqft. To clarify the Summit is rated to heat a 2000- 3000 sqft home with a max output of 97,000 btu's, but what outside temp are these ratings based on. I'm sure there are also insulation standards and other specifications involved but there must be an external(outdoor) temp standard involved in the ratings. I ask because if the stoves are rated to heat a residence when the outside temps are 32 f then it would be necessary to have a larger stove if temps are frequently below the rated temp in the owners location.

 

[sblat]

I am heading to the stove shop later this afternoon, I will post back on what the guys there tell me about the Summit pricing. I am hoping he mistakenly quoted me on the Summit plus installation.

On a seperate note, my dream for my new stove might have to get put on the back burner. I dropped my car off at the shop for an oil change and to check out a few issues, the guy just got back to me with almost $750 in repairs. I can't seem to catch a break. I knew there was a reason that I usually lease cars. Hopefully I can find the money some where. Other wise I will have to burn the VC one more season and spend money this year to tighten up to the house more. I'll keep you posted after I get back from the stove shop.

 

[MF1529]

Just one more thing for you to consider. There is a 2011 tax credit from the feds pertaining to efficient stoves. It is 10% back up to $300. From what I read the money is just tacked onto your return during tax filing. Good luck with the car. I hope the repairs aren't anywhere near $750. It's always something...........

 

[sblat]

Car= $700

Just got back from the stove shop and called another with I feel like is some pretty good prices. The one shop wants to sell me the T5. I really like the looks of that stove. It is used and has been burned about 20 times this season. It comes with the ash dump (which seems pretty useless, and a blower with it. He said he could get it to me for $1550 out the door. His price on a Summit was about $2100.

One the other hand, I called another shop about a the Summit and they quoted me $1537 for the bare bones black pedestal Summit, which I was really suprised to hear. I am also having him give me a price on a T6 just to see if he will get me a good price.

With all of this, I think the T5 is still my leader in the clubhouse. It gets good long burns, which is an upgrade from my current stove. It also looks great, which will help my sell to the wife. We also spend 75% of our time at home in that stove room and don't want to get baked out, which I am worried about with the larger Summit or T6. Just too many darn decisions....

 

[begreen]

Get the Summit before he changes his mind. That's an awesome price. It won't cook you out of the room unless you stoke it like a locomotive fireman. You'll like the big fire view and it will give you long burns. - That said, you have to live with the stove for many years. It sounds like visually you like the look of cast iron. If he can cut you as sweet a deal on a T6, start up the truck and bring help. It's a heavy stove!

 

[sblat]

They quoted me about $2100 For the t6. I am going to have the wife check them both out with me and make the decision. I am thinking I like the looks of the t5 better then the summit. If there are more t5 users out there will you let me know how your stove works, and how many square feet you heat with it?