Owning a VC boat anchor .... soul searching time

[Ductape]

So my 2008 Vermont Castings Defiant has reached critical mass. Starting having problems with the refractory deteriorating after just two heating seasons. Recently I noticed it running unusually hot, and discovered my damper housing has deformed, so that the bypass damper is now doing little.

My question is....... is there any safety problem I'm missing by thinking I can get a couple more seasons out of it by installing an old school damper in the pipe and running it with the bypass open (ala older airtight stove style). I realize the stove won't be as efficient, but since I don't think my secondary burn is doing much.... I can't imagine running it this way will be much different than the past few seasons.

I realize the 'right' thing to do would be to rebuild it with close to $1000 in parts, but I don't think I can ever justify that. When I started having problems with the refractory material, I went back to my dealer who submitted a warranty claim which was denied by VC, since I purchased the stove a few months before they went bankrupt.

No way a new $3000 stove is in the budget at this time. But perhaps at some point down the road? One thing is for sure..... it won't be a VC product. Too bad, cuz my 1977 Resolute Acclaim was a great stove.

 

[begreen]

Bummer. Running it in this condition will only accelerate its demise. If the stove is in good visual condition consider selling it or rebuilding.

FWIW, the 1979 Resolute was not the Acclaim at that time, just the Resolute. This was pre-EPA and it was an awesome stove.

 

[mellow]

I would list it on CL and buy an Englander 30NC to hold you till you can buy a better stove, might be able to find one on sale for under $700 here soon.

 

[Jags]

Using a pipe damper might assist with keeping the stove under control, but as you alluded to...it really is just a smoke dragon at that point.

Obviously a rebuild is the right way to fix this thing, but as mellow suggested, maybe get a utility stove replacement until you are prepared to move forwards with something more fancy. You will have the sale $$ from the current stove to help offset the utility stove, and the utility stove should retain a fair amount of value that you can put towards the final upgrade.

 

[Ductape]

Unfortunately, I don't see me getting much for this stove on CL with obvious cracks in the fire back and warped damper housing. Never mind the fountain that you cannot see. Scrap value, maybe?? It was $2600 stove in 2008 .... so sinking another $1000 in it this summer to get another few years out of it seems like throwing god money after bad.

Can anyone confirm or deny that the rebuild kits are made of the same faulty ceramic as the original parts? I assume they are.

I don't want to sound like a total downer..... I love the stove in concept. Big, beautiful, and heats our house well when its running properly. I love cooking our breakfast on it every morning. Unfortunately, reality is something else.

 

[Excavator]

I ran mine for 2 years with damaged warped damper upper fireback. Last year I bought the complete kit for 550 plus the new cat and I am now happey BURNER. I had no problems other than hot burns with warped parts but I too was not spending money to replace stove.
(broken link removed)

old parts

 

[begreen]

Word is that they have improved the refractory pieces. Rebuild and get a season out of it, then sell for ~ $1000 to recoup costs.We don't know how long the new pieces will last yet.

Sell now for $250 and cut your losses.

 

[Ductape]

Bummer. Running it in this condition will only accelerate its demise. If the stove is in good visual condition consider selling it or rebuilding.

FWIW, the 1979 Resolute was not the Acclaim at that time, just the Resolute. This was pre-EPA and it was an awesome stove.

Why would it's demise accelerate ? Is there something I'm not seeing ? I realize it would essentially be a 'smoke dragon' ...... but I would say that the stove has been that since 2011 or 12 when I noticed flakes from the fountain in the firebox. FWIW, it doesn't actually smoke any except a little when reloading .... until it gets back up to temp (like any other stove).

Our resolute had a 1977 cast date, and the owners manual called it the Resolute Acclaim... so sorry if I'm missing something. It was the reason I bought the Defiant. I'd gladly give back the $400 I got for it to have it back !!

 

[begreen]

My main concern would be warping the bypass unless it is beyond repair and needs replacement. Is this a catalytic Defiant or a downdraft model?

To the best of my recollection the original Resolute came out in 1979. 1979 was the casting date. We got ours that year. The Acclaim came out after EPA regs in 1988. It followed the Encore.

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/my-vc-resolute-says-model-w.140534/#post-1892832

 

[fire_man]

Bummer. Running it in this condition will only accelerate its demise. If the stove is in good visual condition consider selling it or rebuilding.

FWIW, the 1979 Resolute was not the Acclaim at that time, just the Resolute. This was pre-EPA and it was an awesome stove.

Yup it was. I sold my '79 VC Resolute years ago and the guy is still using it and loves it! It was built like a TANK.

 

[Diabel]

It sounds like this is one of the "everburn" downdraft stoves.
If you can still close the bypass and control the fire with the primary air, I don't see why not use it until the end of season. I would not use it 24/7 or load it full. If the refractory has failed you will not get an efficient burn out of it. Same if you use it with bypass open.

 

[kennyp2339]

Time to look on craigslist for a newer / different stove, I know it stinks but as one poster said, pick up a nc30 and then save for the dream stove.

 

[Ductape]

It sounds like this is one of the "everburn" downdraft stoves.
If you can still close the bypass and control the fire with the primary air, I don't see why not use it until the end of season. I would not use it 24/7 or load it full. If the refractory has failed you will not get an efficient burn out of it. Same if you use it with bypass open.

Yes, its a non-cat everburn stove...... I think 1610 is the model number. The bypass closes, but there is a decent gap between the bottom of the housing and the damper. So much air going through it barely slows anything down. I intend to close out the heating season with it as-is...... since I can control the fire with the air control. No way to get a decent long burn this way though. I've actually been running it for several years by filling the cracks in the fireback with furnace cement (after VC denied the warranty claim). Unfortunately, it doesn't last real long with all the heat / cool cycles. No doubt this is what deformed the bottom lip of the damper housing, as the prolonged cold stretch we've had this year left me no warm days to shut the stove down and re-goop the cracks with cement.


I checked with Woodmans on the rebuild kit a couple weeks ago. They quoted me roughly $800 (including shipping the parts to their store) for the rebuild kit, which includes the fireback, fountain, damper housing, and related gaskets. I'm not sure if I'll need a shoe or not..... I'll make that assessment when / if I tear it down. Obviously I will regasket the doors, griddle, rear collar, etc if I tear it down this summer.

I asked for opinions on running it next season with a traditional damper in the pipe to make sure there is not some safety issue I'm missing. Logic tells me that will work fine, albeit I may burn an extra half to full cord of firewood over the season. I'm actually fine with that as I generally stay two + seasons ahead with firewood. Not that the extra wood has no value, but I can justify it if needed till I sink money into the stove, or buy something else. I make my own firewwod.... I don't buy wood cut / split. Curious if anyone else has run one of the 'problem' VC stoves this way.

 

[fire_man]

I'm surprised you are even considering sinking that kind of $ into a stove not well supported by the manufacturer, with well published performance and reliability concerns.

I remember when the Neverburn VC stoves first came out this site steered me away. You might want to reconsider.

 

[Ductape]

I'm surprised you are even considering sinking that kind of $ into a stove not well supported by the manufacturer, with well published performance and reliability concerns.

I remember when the Neverburn VC stoves first came out this site steered me away. You might want to reconsider.

Well, I'm surprised too ! I guess what it comes down to is ........ what is the refractory material on the replacement parts ???? Is it the same old crap that will only last 2 - 3 years ? Or is it the newest material that may last many years. ? The reality is, I paid $2600 for the stove, so I'd invest the money and labor if I thought I would get another ten years or more on the rebuild. If the stove ran like new for many years I'd be happy with it. Its big, heats well, has a huge firebox that easily (used to) burns through the night, has top loading (which would be hard for me to live without), and the griddle which I actually cook on.

No way my wife will be happy with an inexpensive steel plate stove, since the stove is the first thing anyone sees when they walk into our house.

 

[begreen]

Based on past reports it seems like 3-5 yrs is more typical for a rebuild. I can't recall hearing about a rebuild for a downdraft lasting 10 yrs. FWIW, I liked top-loading and really thought I had to have it. Now I don't miss it at all. But if it is important and you want it in a new stove the Quad Isle Royale and the Jotul F50 Rangeley. the nice thing about the Rangeley is that although it's cast iron clad and looks good, it's a tough steel stove at heart.

As to your other question, my brother was too lazy to fix the bypass on his Vigilant and burned many cords of wood in it with the bypass open. It was a huge waste of wood, a dirty burner and he had to have a key damper in the flue to control the stove, but there you have it.

 

[Diabel]

I would put that 800 somewhere else.

 

[fire_man]

What is it about top loading that's so importan? Do you have door clearance issues or do you just prefer it?

 

[begreen]

I've found that having a square, big firebox and a large loading door is much more convenient and I rarely get burns anymore.

 

[fire_man]

I would never admit I burned my forehead looking inside my hot stove earlier this year

 

[Ductape]

I suppose a fair amount of it is personal preference. My Resolute was obviously a top loader also. I like that there is virtually no wasted space in the firebox..... I can fill it right to the top when I need a longer burn. As I said previously, I cook on it at least once a day. Having the griddle allows me to use stoneware, or a pot, without making a mess of the enamel.

 

[fire_man]

One problem I had with the VC Resolute top load: once or twice a year a split would get lodged towards the bottom of the firebox and not drop down causing the fire to go completely out. All the splits from the stuck one to the top just stopped burning. I must be the only one this ever happened to?!?

 

[begreen]

I suppose a fair amount of it is personal preference. My Resolute was obviously a top loader also. I like that there is virtually no wasted space in the firebox..... I can fill it right to the top when I need a longer burn. As I said previously, I cook on it at least once a day. Having the griddle allows me to use stoneware, or a pot, without making a mess of the enamel.

Lots of stoves will allow one to cook on top. I typically heat the coffee water for my wife on ours with the trivet swung out so that the kettle is directly on the stove top.

 

[ToltingColtAcres]

I had a VC Encore 1450 non-cat. Had the same problem w/ the refractory... it basically disintegrated. I didn't realize how bad until I disassembled the stove. I found part of the rear casting cracked from where the fountain assembly had completely disintegrated, allowing the rear of the stove to be exposed to high heat. See Defiant Encore ?1450? (non-cat) repair?

I opted not to repair (costs would have been > $1000 in parts) and instead invested in a Jotul F55, which I love almost as much as my girlfriend.

 

[Simonkenton]

I had a 1988 VC Resolute in a really nice 3 br log cabin that I built on Lake Sinclair in Georgia, burned it for 6 years, wound up selling it, and the house it was in, made some good money on that deal. What a great wood stove.
I have heard that lately, as you have stated, that the Vermont Castings wood stove is mostly good for a boat anchor. Very sad to see a once-great American company in such decline. Rest in Peace, Vermont Castings.

Will buy a big new stove this summer. If you spend 30 minutes on this site reading reviews, you would never buy a Vermont Castings. I will buy a Jotul Oslo.