Since wood prices greatly vary by region, what are your guesses as to how much less delivered logs should cost as compared to cut and split wood? 1/3? I'm just wondering what would be a fair price for logs in my region.
Raw logs to cut and split wood price ratio?
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kennyp2339
Minister of Fire
I think for you it would be between $300 -500 for a 6 - 8 cord tri axle log load, just like in Jersey people are paying to remove problem tree's and the tree companies rather get some money to deliver rather then pay to discard.
When I use to order log loads I would wait till a storm would blow through, got some good deals that way, now with the ash borer here, I have so many tree's infected within my property envelop, there's no need to order logs, I prob have close to 50 cords at my finger tips
When I use to order log loads I would wait till a storm would blow through, got some good deals that way, now with the ash borer here, I have so many tree's infected within my property envelop, there's no need to order logs, I prob have close to 50 cords at my finger tips
In my region most of the tree companys' work is limbing up redwoods to give sunlight or turning them into standing sticks and topped to give even more shade until they sprout out once more into fuzzy tall trees. That just produces a lot of useless limbs that are chipped. The only harvested hardwoods are tanoak being removed by the lumber companies to make space for doug fir or redwood. Most of those go towards biomass, but I'm hoping to find a way to have some of those delivered, perhaps. I do like, however, what another person posted about just calling around to all the tree companies and perhaps you'll get lucky.
Around here, I think the cost of split/logs is less than I thought. Of course, is it a real cord, what kind of wood is it, what length are the splits?
Caw
Minister of Fire
I think I may have been the guy youre talking about posting about local tree companies. I just wrote out a long reply to a post about it!
So where I live I've found the pricing as follows. Each price is from a different guy :
1 cord fully seasoned - $300 + $50 delivery. Have to get lucky to find a good dealer. Took me a little while and some rejected deliveries to get one.
1 cord green - $250 + $50 delivery. Tons of guys selling green.
5 cords logs - $400 delivered
2 cords logs - $100 delivered
Both log deliveries are different tree services the next town over. All the wood is 100% hardwood but where I live hardwoods are the dominant species so its pretty common.
I think in general if you're getting logs for $100 a cord or better delivered you're doing pretty well. If good wood is scarce expect to pay a little more. Its very regional as you pointed out.
The real value in wood burning is doing as much yourself as possible. Buying already processed logs should be a last resort if you're in a bind.
You can always pull over at local tree private or commercial jobs and ask about the wood. Scrounge local utility cuts. Craigslist. Local builders clearing lots etc. Lots of ways to score wood without paying a premium. For my money though log length delivery is best. Saves a lot of work for not much extra $. Tree guys make some money and you save tons of time and effort.
So where I live I've found the pricing as follows. Each price is from a different guy :
1 cord fully seasoned - $300 + $50 delivery. Have to get lucky to find a good dealer. Took me a little while and some rejected deliveries to get one.
1 cord green - $250 + $50 delivery. Tons of guys selling green.
5 cords logs - $400 delivered
2 cords logs - $100 delivered
Both log deliveries are different tree services the next town over. All the wood is 100% hardwood but where I live hardwoods are the dominant species so its pretty common.
I think in general if you're getting logs for $100 a cord or better delivered you're doing pretty well. If good wood is scarce expect to pay a little more. Its very regional as you pointed out.
The real value in wood burning is doing as much yourself as possible. Buying already processed logs should be a last resort if you're in a bind.
You can always pull over at local tree private or commercial jobs and ask about the wood. Scrounge local utility cuts. Craigslist. Local builders clearing lots etc. Lots of ways to score wood without paying a premium. For my money though log length delivery is best. Saves a lot of work for not much extra $. Tree guys make some money and you save tons of time and effort.
Woodsplitter67
Minister of Fire
I would look at the pricing of seasoned wood.. log lenth should be less than 25% delivered. So for say 6 cords@ 250 per cord split and delivered =1500 you should pay less or around 500 bucks delivered. Log lenth is the way to go..the pricing will vary... for 250 per cord you may get mixed.. base you pricing for a mixed load... for 300 per cord it may be all hardwoods so you adjust your pricing for that.. Log lenth is somewhat based on cord pricing.. You will need to make sure you don't get alot of odd sticks also.. like big crotches..or 50 inch rounds.. that would suck..
Caw
Minister of Fire
Definitely specify a maximum size based on your saw. Most guys will be understanding of that. Trying to tackle a 32" round with an 18" saw, while technically doable, is a mega PITA. I ask for nothing bigger than 24" and he's usually good about it. I get the occasional 24-28" but mostly good sized ones. For me 16-18" is a real nice sweet spot.
The economics vary with the alternative disposal method. In dense urban areas getting rid of logs is aproblem. In most cases they have to pay to go to a landfill or some intermediate processor. To a tree service, they make their money cutting and trimming trees and they want the easiest cheapest way to get rid of the wood. Some have the real estate to haul it back to the shop and reprocess but too many smaller outfits they do not have a good nearby option so having a homeowner down the road with an accessible lot with cash in hand is a nice way to make a few bucks instead of paying out to a landfill or recycler. Move out from the urban areas to less urban and getting rid of wood is easier. Most tree services charge less is they can leave the wood there and even if they need to chip it onto the ground that is less time and trouble for them. Of course the trade off to urban wood is foreign objects in the trees. Running into metal sucks but if the price is right I expect most people who get urban wood are willing to make the tradeoff. I find up in the woods that its bit harder to get loads of firewood. The guys who haul want the least amount of hassle and are paid to drive, they generally do not want to deal with home owner unless its friend of relative..
I did some work out west once at a biomass plant that burned softwood sawmill (I think redwood) residuals and tan oak. The sawmill residuals was miserable stuff that did not move around well, it was like matted dog fur. The tan oak was great stuff. They didnt pay for it, local forestry operations had to get rid of it as if they left it on the logging sites it could become fuel and tended to clog up streams so they hauled it to this plant. Sadly CA pulled their incentives a few years ago and not sure if they are running.
I did some work out west once at a biomass plant that burned softwood sawmill (I think redwood) residuals and tan oak. The sawmill residuals was miserable stuff that did not move around well, it was like matted dog fur. The tan oak was great stuff. They didnt pay for it, local forestry operations had to get rid of it as if they left it on the logging sites it could become fuel and tended to clog up streams so they hauled it to this plant. Sadly CA pulled their incentives a few years ago and not sure if they are running.
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Caw
Minister of Fire
I've definitely had the most success dealing with smaller mom/pop type operations. Just like you described, dropping it off in my driveway is easy and some extra $$ for them. The bigger guys all tend to have deals with mills or their own firewood processors.
Which biomass plant was this? Or which location? We have one in occasional operation out here (Samoa) and another shut down for air quality (Blue Lake).
Samoa. Neat place to visit, when I stood on the firing deck I could look down across the dunes and see surfers. Unless things have changed that area of Northern CA had very minimal connections with the rest of the power grid leaving them vulnerable. It made sense to support the local power plants but I think like many things in CA all the decisions were made down south.The salt spray from the ocean raised havoc with the structural steel and grating. Still, a lot more pleasant crawling around a boiler outdoors in the sun (fog in the AM).
I may have been one of those surfers you could see. The new thing they are exploring is off-shore wind, which we have a lot of, but the seas are rough and then there's the salt... Now if I could get access to some of that tan oak the lumber companies don't like.... (Unfortunately sudden oak death is starting to make its way into the area which may have unknown effects on tan oak vs. redwood/fir competition, wildlife and wildfire.)
Solarguy3500
Feeling the Heat
I was reading the local classified ads the other day and saw an ad for log length firewood. The ad said it was a mix of maple, ash and locust that was cut in the last five months, so the maple and locust would need a few years to season. It said it was 6.5 cords for $650 delivered within 20 miles.
Poindexter
Minister of Fire
Poindexter
Minister of Fire
I haven't priced seasoned. The local power plant is using "excess" steam to run a firewood kiln. They are buying logs on the open market and selling seasoned splits. Previous noted price for delivered splits is greener than the lettuce at Kroger.
You are always reliable for giving detail. Regarding standing timber, I just read my local national forest will be providing the U.S. Capitol Christmas tree this year. The article said it'll be a big task and made possible ”with cash and in-kind contributions from companies large and small..”
To come at it from another perspective, A tractor trailer box truck of green chipped tops from a logging operation goes for $30 a ton delivered (but not unloaded). Unless its self unloaded (very rare) the way the box gets emptied is the entire box gets tipped in the air and the chips slide out the back. Still that means that a logger finds it worth it to use the fuel required to chip the tops then drive to the customers site and the drive back to the yard. Chips are going to have lot leaves and twigs,pulpwood on the other hand competes directly with firewood and I think they are in the $50 a ton range delivered but not unloaded in 8 foot logs in truckload quantities. The usual delivered range a trucker will drive with pulp is less than 50 miles. Smaller logging contractors have trucks with knuckleboom cranes on board so they can self unload which means smaller loads and higher fuel costs but more flexibility on where the wood can go. If you see a logging yard with a self unloader truck hauling wood its a lot better chance of buying a load. One thing most loggers do not want is someone picking up wood on the yard due to liability. The other hint is be very wary of buying "clean up wood". Most loggers build winter roads laying down tops on the temporary logging roads, these get loaded with dirt and may get hauled at the end of the job. That wood is miserable stuff and anyone trying to cut it will go through lots of chains.
Solarguy3500
Feeling the Heat
Saw an ad in the local classified ad paper that was advertising 7 - 7.5 cords of log length mixed hardwood for $750. It also said that if you're willing to take logs over 24" diameter, they will sell the load for $300. Wondering if I'd end up with a truckload of 5' diameter monsters that I can't easily work with (I don't have a tractor) I called the number in the ad.
Turns out it's a local tree service and the guy said they don't have anything bigger than about 26" logs right now, so I'm thinking this might be a good deal. I can handle 26" stuff just fine, so for a little more than $300 I can get a nice load of logs. The guy said he will call me back tomorrow because I'm a little further away from them and he has to figure out how much extra he'd have to charge for the distance, but he said it probably wouldn't be much.
Turns out it's a local tree service and the guy said they don't have anything bigger than about 26" logs right now, so I'm thinking this might be a good deal. I can handle 26" stuff just fine, so for a little more than $300 I can get a nice load of logs. The guy said he will call me back tomorrow because I'm a little further away from them and he has to figure out how much extra he'd have to charge for the distance, but he said it probably wouldn't be much.
Caw
Minister of Fire
Get a handheld metal detector if its urban wood or just buy a few spare chains and use safety gear. It you see any stains on the butt be real careful. Oak is particularly good for staining.
Solarguy3500
Feeling the Heat
Caw
Minister of Fire
Makes my 440e and it's 18" look puny! I tell my log guy nothing over 24" and he's generally pretty good. Sometimes I get a 26-28" mixed in but that's why I say 24". I can handle those 28" but if I say a limit of 28" I might get some 32" which would be very annoying.
It's actually the weight of the logs/rounds that's the issue more than the cuts for me. It's very difficult/dangerous to move a 30" x 12' log by oneself nevermind when its precariously sitting on other logs. Then a 17" round weighs a metric f-ton. For me the sweet spot is like 16". Nice big rounds that the saw can handle in one pass and they aren't prohibitively heavy.
It's actually the weight of the logs/rounds that's the issue more than the cuts for me. It's very difficult/dangerous to move a 30" x 12' log by oneself nevermind when its precariously sitting on other logs. Then a 17" round weighs a metric f-ton. For me the sweet spot is like 16". Nice big rounds that the saw can handle in one pass and they aren't prohibitively heavy.
Woodsplitter67
Minister of Fire
It's a really good deal.. thats like 50 bucks a cord. you can't go wrong with that.. at that price.. its almost no worth going in the woods and pulling it out yourself....
Caw
Minister of Fire
I get my logs for $400 / 5 cords about 2 hours east of @Solarguy3500 and even at $80 a cord that's how I feel.
For starters I don't have the land to go in and harvest but even if I did I think at that price it's worth my own safety and time to just have the logs delivered.
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