Recent Home Purchase, need some advice on stove plan

[WNY Tony]

Hi All - My wife and I recently purchased a house, and we would like to buy a wood stove or wood stove insert to help heat the house. A little about the house. 30 year old house, 3100 square foot colonial. The existing fireplace is on the first floor in our great room, which has a vaulted ceiling (with ceiling fan) and is partially open to our kitchen and four season room. Our family spends most of our time in those three rooms. The rest of the first floor consists of an office, dining room, living room, and laundry room that are a little further away from the fireplace. There is a two story foyer and open hallway upstairs that looks down on the foyer, and this foyer shares an adjacent wall with the great room. There are four bedrooms upstairs. The primary heat source is forced air electric via heat pump and electric resistance furnace for when it is really cold. This is the heat source primarily because the town I live in has a municipal electric company with great rates so it is common to see this. Rates have gradually increases over the years, and it is not as great of a deal as it once was. I'd prefer to have a second source of heat and offset some of the cost during winter heating season. I have access to as much free hardwood as I am willing to cut. OK, so enough background, here are my questions:

1. I'd like to assist the heat in getting circulated in the house. My furnace fan can be set to run continuously on low to move air even when it is not calling for heat, but my cold air return is at ground level in the great room. I am thinking of trying to locate that return higher up on the wall to capture that heat to move throughout the house. The second thing I was thinking is to install a small fan through the wall that is in between my great room and the two story foyer to help move air to the upstairs hallway. Do you think either of these strategies will be effective or am I going to be fighting a losing battle to get this heat spread throughout my house? Basically, I am looking for suggestions on how to produce as many BTU's out of this wood insert and distribute it without cooking us out of our primary living space where the stove is.

2. I'd really like to operate this stove as much as possible, and long burn times are certainly a method of accomplishing this. I've read quite a bit on the cat vs. non-cat stove debate, and clearly understand the benefits of a cat stove on long (but lower heat) burns. My concern is that if I go too low on the burn temps I am not going to get enough heat to really make much difference on a house of this size and configuration. So if I am trying to get true 8-10 hour burns of medium heat, does that eliminate most of the cat benefits, and should I just be trying to shop for the biggest insert I can fit with a decent secondary burn system and call it a day?

3. I have always burned wood, but am also considering a pellet insert if it offers enough benefit over a traditional wood insert. If we placed heat output and ease of use higher than the ambiance of a traditional fire, should we look at pellets as an option? I can cut as much wood as I need, and it is free, but I could easily sell this firewood to buy pellets if the benefits are there.

Thanks in advance for any guidance you can provide!

 

[EatenByLimestone]

Start cutting your wood now, and get it stacked. It won't be ready to burn this year. While deciding on a stove, work on insulation and air sealing, which will help regardless of your heating source.

Even a small stove can make a huge dent in a heating bill. I think either burn system will do you right, so it comes down to the stove your wife likes.

 

[Poindexter]

The trouble with pellets is they dont grow on trees. You cant harvest them yourself, you have to buy them.

If you have two nearby pellet makers in competition, ok, pellets are a contender. If you only have one regional pellet producer your stove is slave to that one factory and that one factory is slave to the electric company. Just saying.

Otherwise any of freestander, insert or pellet will have similar benefits for you. The trouble here, that many others have is most houses built lately only have one stairwell.

If you had a much older home with one stairwell at each end you could set up a convective loop...

The challenge for you is going to be getting the hot air that collects upstairs back into circulation.

 

[HisTreeNut]

A couple of questions....
Where in WNY are you? Depending on if your in ski country and get a lot of lake effect snow, or near the lakes getting a lot of wind will make a difference (I grew up near Arcade).
Definitely want to get the largest firebox you can...3.0 cubic feet or bigger due to the size of the house you have. You can build smaller fires in large stoves, but its harder to make big fires in small stoves, if you know what I mean.
How well insulated is your house? Making sure the house is pretty tight...windows, doors, etc. That can make a huge difference in heating.
I am not sure that recirculation of the air will work well...most folks don't seem to have a lot of luck with that...EDIT Using the furnace to recirculate warmer air. You can lose a lot of heat thru the ductwork.
Any particular stove you seem to like? Having a freestanding stove vs an insert will make a bit of a difference in the amount of heat you get There's a lot of good stoves out there...and folks will chime in about theirs.
I have a Buck Stove I like pretty well...they are made local to where I live & I could set it up as a free stander or insert. The wifey liked the insert so that's how ours is set up.
Anyhoo...good luck & welcome to the forums!

 

[begreen]

Great rooms with cathedral ceilings can be big heat traps, so your concern about heat circulation is valid. Using the furnace fan will use some electricity. There will be heat losses to the ductwork. How much depends on how well insulated the supplies and returns are and how cold an area the ductwork runs through.

 

[WNY Tony]

Hi all, great responses so far. To answer some of the questions asked, I live near Lake Ontario and get 100+ inches of lake effect snow each year, but we are zone 6 in terms of temps so we are a little warmer due to the lake too. The house appears to tight and well insulated. I have been leaning toward a Jotul c550 rockland or a Pacific Energy Summit, but don't want to regret not getting a cat stove. If I get something like this with 3 cubic foot firebox or larger, is it safe to say with good wood I can expect an 8-10 hour burn?

In terms of air circulation, it sounds like my concerns are valid and that I should consider both strategies I mentioned to help. I am not concerned about the electricity it takes to run my furnace fan or other fans to move heat. Any other successful strategies that folks have had?

 

[Easy Livin’ 3000]

Hi All - My wife and I recently purchased a house, and we would like to buy a wood stove or wood stove insert to help heat the house. A little about the house. 30 year old house, 3100 square foot colonial. The existing fireplace is on the first floor in our great room, which has a vaulted ceiling (with ceiling fan) and is partially open to our kitchen and four season room. Our family spends most of our time in those three rooms. The rest of the first floor consists of an office, dining room, living room, and laundry room that are a little further away from the fireplace. There is a two story foyer and open hallway upstairs that looks down on the foyer, and this foyer shares an adjacent wall with the great room. There are four bedrooms upstairs. The primary heat source is forced air electric via heat pump and electric resistance furnace for when it is really cold. This is the heat source primarily because the town I live in has a municipal electric company with great rates so it is common to see this. Rates have gradually increases over the years, and it is not as great of a deal as it once was. I'd prefer to have a second source of heat and offset some of the cost during winter heating season. I have access to as much free hardwood as I am willing to cut. OK, so enough background, here are my questions:

1. I'd like to assist the heat in getting circulated in the house. My furnace fan can be set to run continuously on low to move air even when it is not calling for heat, but my cold air return is at ground level in the great room. I am thinking of trying to locate that return higher up on the wall to capture that heat to move throughout the house. The second thing I was thinking is to install a small fan through the wall that is in between my great room and the two story foyer to help move air to the upstairs hallway. Do you think either of these strategies will be effective or am I going to be fighting a losing battle to get this heat spread throughout my house? Basically, I am looking for suggestions on how to produce as many BTU's out of this wood insert and distribute it without cooking us out of our primary living space where the stove is.

2. I'd really like to operate this stove as much as possible, and long burn times are certainly a method of accomplishing this. I've read quite a bit on the cat vs. non-cat stove debate, and clearly understand the benefits of a cat stove on long (but lower heat) burns. My concern is that if I go too low on the burn temps I am not going to get enough heat to really make much difference on a house of this size and configuration. So if I am trying to get true 8-10 hour burns of medium heat, does that eliminate most of the cat benefits, and should I just be trying to shop for the biggest insert I can fit with a decent secondary burn system and call it a day?

3. I have always burned wood, but am also considering a pellet insert if it offers enough benefit over a traditional wood insert. If we placed heat output and ease of use higher than the ambiance of a traditional fire, should we look at pellets as an option? I can cut as much wood as I need, and it is free, but I could easily sell this firewood to buy pellets if the benefits are there.

Thanks in advance for any guidance you can provide!

By the time you have prepared the firewood for sale, sell it, go to town to buy the pellets, haul and store them, load them into the hopper, your net effort will actually be lots more than just burning the wood. Also, lots of moving parts in a pellet stove and electricity required.

My neighbor put in a pellet stove when they moved in a few years back. I'd recommended they install a wood burner, as they have almost unlimited access to good firewood. They have to drive about 1.5 hours round-trip to get the pellets and have to relocate when the power went out. Better for me because now they give me their firewood. And, I don't remind him that I'd recommended the woodburner when he complains about the trips to buy the pellets, their storage issues, and having to relocate when the power goes out.

Plus, a wood fire is way better ambiance!

 

[begreen]

I have been leaning toward a Jotul c550 rockland or a Pacific Energy Summit, but don't want to regret not getting a cat stove. If I get something like this with 3 cubic foot firebox or larger, is it safe to say with good wood I can expect an 8-10 hour burn?

The Summit's firebox is almost twice the size of the C550 and has a square configuration. If longer burn times are the goal, get the Summit. If you are looking for pretty, in between is the Enviro Boston 1700 or the Hampton HI300.

 

[EatenByLimestone]

The T6 is a pretty version of the Summit!

 

[WNY Tony]

By the time you have prepared the firewood for sale, sell it, go to town to buy the pellets, haul and store them, load them into the hopper, your net effort will actually be lots more than just burning the wood. Also, lots of moving parts in a pellet stove and electricity required.

I appreciate the perspective. I grew up with wood stoves and I sense that this is the path I should take, I am probably more asking the questions to eliminate any regret since the cost of these stoves is higher than I originally thought.

The Summit's firebox is almost twice the size of the C550 and has a square configuration. If longer burn times are the goal, get the Summit. If you are looking for pretty, in between is the Enviro Boston 1700 or the Hampton HI300.

Wow, I did not realize that there was a big difference in size between the two stoves I mentioned in terms of firebox size. I am not that hung up on how pretty the stove is (although we tend to shy away from the really contemporary ones), I would want the largest firebox I can find in a quality stove/insert. Any suggestions on what would be a wood insert with a giant firebox that offers the square configurations to help load north/south? Thanks again!

 

[begreen]

The Kuma Sequoia is larger, but has a cat and requires an 8" liner. The big Bucks are available in cat or non cat, but also require an 8" liner.

Other 6" liner big ~3.0 non-cat inserts are made by Regency, Lopi, Quadrafire and Osburn.

 

[Dobish]

I would propose a bigger firebox with a cat. I see no reason why you would not want one, you can always burn without the cat engaged if you really want to! Once the house is up to temp, especially if it is well insulated, you will appreciate the lower heat output. Also, if you are not there all day and want to keep the furnace from kicking on, that is a great way to help out.

I would be hesitant to run the furnace and distribute the heat all day, maybe just every few hours for a few minutes? Small fans can make a big difference. We put a small ecoMax fan on our stove, and it helps circulate the hit much better than just having the stove itself. If you can add fans to circulate the heat around the upstairs, or a big ceiling fan run in reverse, this should help move the air.

With the setup that you have, i would still expect that there will be some cold spots in the bedrooms, etc. You don't want those too warm anyway

don't go with pellets, especially if you have firewood.

 

[begreen]

Burning with the cat not engaged is not recommended and may do damage if done for an extended period. The exception being some VC stoves. On other cat stoves it also would defeat the reasons for buying a cat stove (longer burn at low setting) and would be hugely fuel wasteful + polluting.

 

[Dobish]

Burning with the cat not engaged is not recommended and may do damage if done for an extended period. The exception being some VC stoves. On other cat stoves it also would defeat the reasons for buying a cat stove (longer burn at low setting) and would be hugely fuel wasteful + polluting.

True, having one of those VC stoves that its allowed, I forget about this fact. You should buy a VC stove

 

[Easy Livin’ 3000]

I appreciate the perspective. I grew up with wood stoves and I sense that this is the path I should take, I am probably more asking the questions to eliminate any regret since the cost of these stoves is higher than I originally thought.




Wow, I did not realize that there was a big difference in size between the two stoves I mentioned in terms of firebox size. I am not that hung up on how pretty the stove is (although we tend to shy away from the really contemporary ones), I would want the largest firebox I can find in a quality stove/insert. Any suggestions on what would be a wood insert with a giant firebox that offers the square configurations to help load north/south? Thanks again!

If you grew up with firewood, it'll be a big enough adjustment dealing with the modern stoves required dry wood, I suspect the pellet stove would hardly bring any of the "warm" reminiscent feelings from your memory. So there's even a psychological/emotional reason to go with wood.

I don't have any stove recommendations for you, but I look forward to reading what you decide upon. They are pretty expensive, but I won't be without one if I have any control over my circumstances.

 

[begreen]

Have had both pellet and wood stoves. Pellet is nice and convenient. It can run on a digital thermostat just like a furnace so you wake up to a warm house while using less fuel overnight. But that is the caveat. A pellet stove is a small wood furnace. They are noisy compared to a quiet wood stove and the fire is not that attractive. They have a lot more parts and require more maintenance + power. After 5 yrs. we went back to wood for the above reasons.

 

[Easy Livin’ 3000]

Have had both pellet and wood stoves. Pellet is nice and convenient. It can run on a digital thermostat just like a furnace so you wake up to a warm house while using less fuel overnight. But that is the caveat. A pellet stove is a small wood furnace. They are noisy compared to a quiet wood stove and the fire is not that attractive. They have a lot more parts and require more maintenance + power. After 5 yrs. we went back to wood for the above reasons.

This is valuable experience to share, hits the nail right on the head.

 

[Hogwildz]

I load my Summit every 2x a day, or every 12 hours roughly. Heats 2600sf just fine. At 0 or rare sub zero wind chill nights, I may load a load or smaller load of soft wood to span the time between loads. You should have no problem getting 8-10hours out of a load of good dry oak. In the shoulder season, burn soft woods for similar burn times, or oak for 14-16hr times between loads.