Resolute rebuild

[72Rover]

What I thought was going to be a simple part replacement looks like it's going to turn into a rebuild. Can anyone say "shipfitter's disease"?

One of the folks on these pages has offered to sell me the flue collar and associated blanking plate, but in cleaning the stove up real well, I discovered a hairline crack in the fireback. Crap....

A search of the various parts suppliers describe the flue collar and fireback as either "NLA" or the more ominous sounding "DEAD" in their parts lists. So I might as well carry the fireback to the welding place as well. Looking at an exploded parts diagram, it appears that the fireback is held in place by the right-hand insert which itself is secured by a single machine screw. Does the left side insert need to come out as well?

 

[defiant3]

Yep, it sure does. Silly question, if you're going to the trouble of removing all that stuff, why not replace it with the updated fireback kit? Welding really won't help. The fireback becomes warped then won't support the damper anymore. The crack is sort of a red herring. It's the warping that kills those things.

 

[72Rover]

I've considered the two-part fireback "upgrade" kit...cheapest I've found is like $286...and I wasn't sure the bloody thing would fit. There also didn't seem to be that much 'chatter' on the subject regarding the ease of fitting or results/improvements afterwards - like significantly better burns. With an excellent draft, when the stove is 'dialed in' and being fed three year old oak, no smoke is visible coming out the stack: just the visible wiggle of heat vapors.

I'm resigning myself to a total disassembly. On the plus side, it's been warm so far this winter.... Had to turn on the A/C just before Christmas.

 

[defiant3]

Well, it's not actually a performance improvement that makes fireback replacement advantageous. The damper is totally supported by the fireback itself in those older Res.'s, and when they get warped enough the damper refuses to behave properly. SO, if the fireback is out anyway, I was just thinking that an upgrade would prevent that from happening altogether. Total disassembly is not necessary to make that happen either, unless you want to of course.

Or it can wait, but the point is I wouldn't even bother welding the fireback at all. Woukd look kind of cool though. Like "Franken-stove".

 

[72Rover]

Thanks...disassembly thus far has been somewhat problematical in that every fitting has to be drilled out. Did the blokes at VC use tungsten steel or grade 8 hardware? Now I'm used to dealing with old iron...my 1972 Land-Rover is still running strong, but this job keeps expanding. Once I drill out the old stuff, I'll retap to 1/4x20 or maybe go oversized to 5/16" to get to clean metal. I'm tempted to use HeliCoil stainless threaded inserts.... Too much?

On a positive note, I just received a new-looking flue collar and blanking plate from one of the folks on these pages. The shop hadn't gotten around to welding up my originals. The metal on the replacements is noticeably thicker, but then the original has seen 80 cords go up the flue in 35 years.

I note your comment on the damper position. When the lever is fully closed, the damper itself 'relaxes' and falls back 1/4" from vertical/closed.

Cheers

 

[72Rover]

The project continues...but sadly without progress.... Every fitting has to be drilled out, as every trick I know for removing imbeded fasteners has failed. Repeated heat/quench with penetrant (a home-made, 50/50 mix of acetone and ATF which has been scientifically proven to beat anything else commercially available) hasn't worked on those stubs that can be grabbed with vice-grips. I really don't know what VC used for hardware, but even the best cobalt bits will merely dimple the surface before ceasing to cut. Yeah, I'm using cutting oil.... This is a bit of a fiddly job as the bits will *easily* cut the cast iron.
Last resort is to source some tungsten carbide bits...or a plasma cutter....

 

[defiant3]

The flue collar bolts are in fact really hard. I don't know if they're grade 8 or what, but I always dread the job of drilling them out. I find the fancy expensive bits necessary for the pilot hole,(usually 5/16 as 1/8 seem to break) but then I can chase them with reg. high speed bits to 7/32 which I know is slightly small, but allows for any deviation from me using the hand drill. In the press I go with 15/64. Without piloting the holes I used to find the drill wanted to "wander" on me. Can't have that now can we.

 

[72Rover]

Thanks...I had already 'downsized' to 3/16" cobalt bits without much success. I'm trying the 'candle trick' right now: warm up the parts and allow a candle stub rubbed on the parts to 'draw' the wax in. Not sure if this old-skool trick will help when acetone and ATF didn't. Next up is titanium nitride coated carbide bits. Crickey, they're bloody expensive....

Probably going to HAVE to use HeliCoils afterwards....

 

[72Rover]

Well, forget about the carbide bits.... These are very hard but very brittle and only intended for use in a mill. Drill press use isn't recommended while use in a hand drill is right out. The "cobalt" bit purchased at the local hardware store might have just been 'washed' with a coating to give it a pretty gold color, 'cause it quit cutting right quick. Purchased several gen-u-wine, 'murrican-made cobalt bits from an industrial supplier, so we'll see....

 

[72Rover]

Well, the saga continues. I have tried de-tempering the bits, but the propane torch can't get 'em hot enough. I may buy a MAPP gas rig.... Cobalt bits sourced from different suppliers have failed. The Milwaukee one from the corner hardware store could only dimple the bolt before ceasing to cut - even using cutting oil. Ditto for the supposedly gen-u-wine, 'murrican-made, M-42 cobalt steel bits from a century-old industrial supplier. I might as well have chucked a Twizzler in the drill for all the good it did.

So...someone on another board suggested a RescueBit. These double-ended, carbide tools are intended to cut hardened steel, as well as broken screw extractors and EZ Outs. Unlike traditional carbide bits, which are intended to be used in a rigid set-up like an end mill but not recommended for drill presses and especially hand drills because they are so brittle, the RescueBit is intended for free-hand work. Indeed, one is supposed to move the bit about in a circular fashion to erode the broken hardware away. Pricey, without a doubt: they start at about $45. But if it works.... We'll see...just ordered one.

 

[72Rover]

Success!...sort of.... Took me over an hour to 'erode' away one fitting...and that was the "comfortable" one where I had a good seat, easy/vertical access and plenty of light. Followed directions on the RescueBit literature to use light pressure and slow speed - in this case, as slow as the Dremel would go - but it still took *forever* and I've got *five* more to go. Being a cheap SOB (read: retired and on a fixed income) I didn't want to break this $55 tool. The literature sez the RescueBit can be used "a few" times. Is that six? Dunno.... You gotta be careful, as these things cut cast iron like buttah.

Cheers

 

[72Rover]

Well, let's bring this back to the top....

First off, forget the bloody "RescueBit"...the damn thing worked - ONCE. That's $55 down the drain. But I did find an industrial jobber here in town that sold true, 'murrican-made cobalt bits for a couple of bucks apiece. Bought a fist-full....cheap enough to use once and pitch. (Maybe I'll buy a Drill Doctor one day....)

Which brings me back to the cracked fireback. Since this is a first gen Resolute I from 1980, the one piece fireback is NLA. Several places list a two-piece kit for a Resolute III, but is this really compatible? Also, the price range is, well extreme: one place has the two parts for $88 + $36; another wants $392 for a "kit".

So, can anyone confirm or deny that the Res III two-piece fireback will fit a Res I?

Cheers

 

[defiant3]

Res III kit will work smartly! Sadly, there is much confusion about V.C. parts, and you may not get what you need from many suppliers. Woodmans Parts Plus is reliable. Maybe not the cheapest, but you'll get the right thing the first time

 

[defiant3]

Part number 5864

 

[72Rover]

Res III kit will work smartly! Sadly, there is much confusion about V.C. parts, and you may not get what you need from many suppliers. Woodmans Parts Plus is reliable. Maybe not the cheapest, but you'll get the right thing the first time

Thanks...I was a little taken aback by the exceptionally wide spread of prices on the supposedly-correct parts.

...and thanks to Defiant's help, here is the URL for the "how to" for the replacement of the fireback from Version 1 to V. 3.

(broken link removed)

BTW, the kit is $303. Thanks again....

Cheers