Stove Installed - Clearance Wrong and Question

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sesro1978

sesro1978

Member
Dec 23, 2008
133
Vermont, USA
Hi-

My wife and I recently had a Jotul F100 installed by a local stove dealer (including a 23' chimney). The stove is located in a corner, in the living room. I noticed that the wall parallel to the stove was getting very hot, so I took a measurement and the stove is 1.5" under the stated clearance in the Jotul manual for the stove. The manual states a 17" clearance with double-wall connector for this stove, but it is installed with 15.5" of clearance.

I suspect the installer misread or was confused by the manual and installed the stove to the single-wall clearance, which is 15" - after talking with Jotul, I've since learned that this (to me) counterintuitive clearance is due to the fact that the stove drafts better with the double-wall connector. That's really neither here nor there as at the end of the day the stove is now in my house installed to the wrong side clearance (all other clearance measurements are ok).

I've been in touch with the dealer, and they have offered (after several phone calls/emails):

1) Move the stove over a few inches by using a 45 elbow - they will provide the elbow and installer. Wife quickly vetoed this as it looks ridiculous and and actually starts to really encroach on the required hearth pad dimension and clearance from the side of the stove to the edge of the hearth pad.

2) Provide a black heat-shield and spacers (at cost) - we do the install. Wife isn't happy with this option either as she doesn't necessarily like a large piece of black metal attached to our living room wall...and the fact that we are now paying for something that isn't our mistake.

After quite a bit of discussion, we are thinking about building our wall heat shield out of hardiebacker and tin ceiling tiles (copper colored), similar to this (spaced the requisite 1" off of the wall and floor):
https://goo.gl/images/NgM9KY

Now comes the question:
Is it unreasonable of me to ask that the dealer either provide some kind of partial refund on the incorrect install to help offset the cost of the materials for this and/or reimburse us the cost of building this?

Thanks for any insight here.
 
just wanted to be sure..
to confirm.. the one circled is you with a double wall pipe..
P12/13

1.png
 
I wouldnt use tin tiles. those arent rated for the heat output from a wood stove.

Can you 'simply' cut out the drywall, replace with cement backerboard instead and tile it with a simple ceramic tile?

and yes, dont hesitate. the installers should be paying for this. theyre the 'installers' which means they didnt pay attention which means they owe you.
 
Here are a couple of pictures of the stove as well as a (blurry) picture of the measurement from the wall beside the stove to the side of the stove.

IMG_0042.jpeg IMG_0030.jpeg IMG_0042 2.jpeg
 
Last edited by a moderator:
very nice setup.

honestly, they need to fix this at their expense. this is yours and your families safety at risk, and you tell them this. if they give you a difficult time and say they wont fix it right, tell them its not like you to do this, but youre filing a consumer complaint against the company if they wont make this right.

when it comes to family.. dont let them talk you into an 'easy' fix. Theyre trying to make it easy on themselves NOT you.

https://www.usa.gov/consumer-complaints

what does the contract look like? any specifics?
 
They should fix it at no cost to you. That is why you hired them in the first place. Even if the have to redo the chimney install. A nice stone veneer would look good though in that corner.
 
This is going to cost you money but if it were my house I would put up a properly built stone veneer in that corner a little taller than the stove. Right now the stove looks pretty well centered between the wall and door. If the stove slides over an 1”1/2 it is going to be closer to the door. Just my opinion for what it’s worth. I have a hard time dealing with things not being centered or balanced
 
RandyBoBandy said:
This is going to cost you money but if it were my house I would put up a properly built stone veneer in that corner a little taller than the stove. Right now the stove looks pretty well centered between the wall and door. If the stove slides over an 1”1/2 it is going to be closer to the door. Just my opinion for what it’s worth. I have a hard time dealing with things not being centered or balanced
Click to expand...

Exactly - we don't want to move the stove off-center. The 45 degree elbow proposed by the dealer would push the stove over 6".

Concerning the cost, I'd like to get the dealer to foot the bill for this since it's their mistake. We wouldn't be having this discussion with them if it weren't for this, but here we are.
 
Find a more expensive stove that fits the clearances and make them swap it Even Steven. Tell them its either that or move the chimney. Or its those or Judge Judy! They are the sophisticated party and bear the burden.
 
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What is “right” isn’t always what is best for you. Yes, the dealer/installer should cover this, but if they’re pushing back on this, then you have to decide how much grief you really want to create in your own life for a few dollars and the sake of being “right”.

I’d probably just settle for leaving them some very bad reviews in any place they advertise, including Yelp and Angie’s List, and then just get on with fixing it myself. I wouldn’t’ want to deal with the compromise of some installer’s fix, over doing it the way I see as best. The lack of solutions that please your wife is a separate problem, and the dealer’s involvement (or suggested compromises) are only going to aggravate that situation.

You could also notify the BBB and Jøtul North America, that they did not follow the manufacturers’ requirements, and have acknowledged doing so. That can help the next guy they deal with, to avoid the same.

@webby3650 or @bholler can give an installer’s perspective on this.
 
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Ashful said:
What is “right” isn’t always what is best for you. Yes, the dealer/installer should cover this, but if they’re pushing back on this, then you have to decide how much grief you really want to create in your own life for a few dollars and the sake of being “right”.

I’d probably just settle for leaving them some very bad reviews in any place they advertise, including Yelp and Angie’s List, and then just get on with fixing it myself. I wouldn’t’ want to deal with the compromise of some installer’s fix, over doing it the way I see as best. The lack of solutions that please your wife is a separate problem, and the dealer’s involvement (or suggested compromises) are only going to aggravate that situation.

You could also notify the BBB and Jøtul North America, that they did not follow the manufacturers’ requirements, and have acknowledged doing so. That can help the next guy they deal with, to avoid the same.
Click to expand...

All very good points @Ashful. I'm willing to give it one more go with the dealer as I want to give them every opportunity, but honestly I'm about at the end of my rope with this. It does make me upset that we are likely going need to shell out more money to cover the cost of correcting their mistake. It also doesn't feel good to me to have to leave negative reviews for these folks - I guess unfortunately in some cases, that is the best thing one can do - to help the next guy.
 
sesro1978 said:
Exactly - we don't want to move the stove off-center. The 45 degree elbow proposed by the dealer would push the stove over 6".

Concerning the cost, I'd like to get the dealer to foot the bill for this since it's their mistake. We wouldn't be having this discussion with them if it weren't for this, but here we are.
Click to expand...
I believe there should be some compensation yes. 45’s would be out of the question for me as well. That’s a hack solution to a problem that shouldn’t exist if the job was done right.
But let’s see what some of the pros have to say. I’m just an enthusiast wood burning homeowner such as yourself. The pros will be by soon.
 
sesro1978 said:
All very good points @Ashful. I'm willing to give it one more go with the dealer as I want to give them every opportunity, but honestly I'm about at the end of my rope with this. It does make me upset that we are likely going need to shell out more money to cover the cost of correcting their mistake.
Click to expand...
On that, I’d make a clear delineation. If the cost is to undo something they have done, in other words paying for something you are not receiving or keeping in the end, then the cost should be on them. If the cost is adding to something from which you are benefitting, a true install cost that was just previously unforeseen, then I could see paying for it. In that case, I might ask them to do it at their cost, as it was not in the quote, but I wouldn’t have a problem paying for it. After all, you are receiving and keeping that item or service, in the end.
 
Ludlow said:
Find a more expensive stove that fits the clearances and make them swap it Even Steven. They are the sophisticated party and bear the burden.
Click to expand...

I'd try this approach first. Good way to get a better stove. And it would be less work on all parties involved.
 
I thought of another option last night - if you look at the Jotul manual for the stove, the following clearances are listed for single-wall connector to unprotected surfaces:

Side (A) - 15" - we have 15.5"
Rear (B) - 11" - we have 14"
Corner (J) - 10" - we have 19"
Horizontal Installation (I'm guessing this is the section parallel to the ceiling) - 18" - we have ~24"

Would swapping out the double-wall we currently have with single-wall solve the problem or just introduce new issues? The stove pipe on the outside of the house is double wall.

I did bring this up at one point with the dealer and he suggested we were so much better off with the double-wall connector. Anyway, just a thought.
 
I was going to say that but didnt know if you had the backside clearances for it.
 
These stoves are quite radiant. The tin tiles on cement board might be fine if the wall shield is on 1" spacers, open at top and 1" off the hearth so that air can freely flow behind the shield. I would do both the side and rear walls for aesthetics and peace of mind.

How were you thinking of attaching the tin tiles to the cement board?
 
begreen said:
These stoves are quite radiant. The tin tiles on cement board might be fine if the wall shield is on 1" spacers, open at top and 1" off the hearth so that air can freely flow behind the shield. I would do both the side and rear walls for aesthetics and peace of mind.

How were you thinking of attaching the tin tiles to the cement board?
Click to expand...

If we go that route, we were not going to use adhesive for temperature reasons...unless there is an adhesive that could withstand the heat(?). I think a short screw of some kind would work...something that works with tin so as to avoid issues by using two dissimilar metals.
 
Yes, adhesive normally is out due to the temps, though perhaps a good silicone adhesive like GE Silicone II could work? I'm not sure how strong a bite a screw will get in 1/2" cement board though I wouldn't worry too much about a dielectric reaction in this case.
 
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