Suggestions/Insights for heating with wood in South Texas

[DuaeGuttae]

Our family moved this fall from Virginia to Texas. One thing that we knew we would miss was our fireplace insert since our new home has no masonry fireplace. We figured that we’d take our first winter here to build up our woodpile and consider whether we’d even want a stove. We think that the answer to that question will be yes, and so we’ve been discussing what to do (and how long to buck the wood that we’ve been cutting).

Average winter temperatures here seem to have a high in the low 60’s and a low in the mid 30’s. We have had a freeze or two this fall, and we even got a few inches of snow recently. My kids were ecstatic as we had all thought we would not ever see it here. The locals tell me that the last accumulation was in the 1980’s. When the sun comes out, it can get warm in the afternoon, but there can be a fair amount of cloud cover and wind. I have quite frankly been surprised at how chilly we’ve felt in our home on these cooler days. (We know there are insulation and air sealing projects in our future, too.) Tomorrow is supposed to be rainy and in the 40’s, and I’m missing my wood stove.

What I’m interested in hearing advice or suggestions on is whether to go with a freestanding stove or whether there is an insert that will work in our situation. We have a Majestic brand factory fireplace with a stone hearth on the north side of the house. It’s located on one end of a very large open area where we spend most of our time as a family (kitchen, dining room, family room, and the kids’ school and craft room). The other end of the room has a large staircase that goes to an upstairs master bedroom and office. (The second story is only partial). I understand that there are inserts that are approved for this type of fireplace. One thing I’m not sure about is the height of our opening. It’s 20” to the top of the doors, but then there is a vertical metal plate that goes up another four inches. Then there is a horizontal metal plate imbedded into the stone itself. I’m not clear on whether we’d be restricted to the 20” opening or not.

Another option is to put a freestanding stove on a center wall in the living room. It would have to have a pretty tall chimney because it would be in a single story but right next to the partial second story. The advantage is that it is a freestanding stove, and it would help heat a cooler part of the house (including the kids’ bedrooms). The disadvantage is that it’s not where we congregate, though perhaps the kids would change their habits if we had a stove there.

And then my dear husband has suggested that perhaps we should choose both options because it would be hard to move heat.

I should also mention that the house has been constructed for a hot climate. Most of the house has ten foot ceilings, though they rise to twelve plus in the formal living room. There is open space where heat could flow, but there are some challenges to heat distribution. I made some sketches of the two main areas downstairs to give an idea. I hope they’re legible. The square footage of the open kitchen area is upwards of 700 square feet. I think the living room/kids’ bedrooms part of the house is over 800.




I’d be glad to answer any questions and would love to hear people’s thoughts about our wood heat options for a shoulder-season winter. Thanks!

 

[Sodbuster]

In south Texas, why??? If you miss a fire, get a fire pit.

 

[DuaeGuttae]

Because it’s chilly, not cold, but chilly. We’d like a warm spot in the house where we can bask. We also want to have heat if the power goes out during ice storms. Our street kept power during the recent snow thankfully, but the surrounding area was out overnight. (We did have three not very big trees uproot, others break and lose branches.)

One of our NG furnaces broke in October on the second night of low 30’s temperatures. It was below 60 in the kids’ rooms when we discovered the problem.

We also have a lot of wood that we don’t want piled around the property. Neat stacks are a different matter. We have chainsaws and a logsplitter and a place to season the wood. We just don’t have a stove.

But yes, it is South Texas, so I think it might warrant special consideration. We hadn’t been sure we would even want a stove, but now that we’ve faced some cold and can expect power failures, we’re thinking it’s likely. That’s why I’m here asking for advice.

 

[Sodbuster]

I'd look at an Englander NC-30, least expensive of stoves, high heat output, meaning you could chug it along during shoulder season. Would serve your purpose of keeping the house warm during power outages, and is easy on fuel. In your climate the lower the cost the faster the payoff.

 

[Jan Pijpelink]

I was in Houston last week. At 7 AM it was 35F. Not typical TX.

 

[Hogwildz]

20" height is going to be tough to fit anything in there. Might have to do some demo work to get something to fit, or a stove in front of the fireplace with a thimble/T up higher into the chimney.

 

[begreen]

Maybe do some demo work on the hearth to lower it in order to accommodate a rear exit stove vented to a liner up the chimney?

 

[Woody Stover]

Maybe do some demo work on the hearth to lower it in order to accommodate a rear exit stove vented to a liner up the chimney?

This is a nice clean look. I would consider some of the steel tube stoves (welded seams) that have rear venting like the Jotul F45, 50, 55, or the Woodstock steel hybrids if you are interested in a cat. If you aren't averse to having a stove with seams that are gasketed or cemented and may need maintenance down the road (up to and including a re-build,) that opens up many choices in cast iron and stone stoves that rear-vent..Jotul, Hearthstone Manchester or stoners, Woodstock Fireview, Keystone, PH to mention just a few. But I would definitely go with a free-standing stove for the comfort of radiant heat if you spend a lot of time in the stove room as opposed to an insert. I'm not a big fan of fan noise either..
I don't think that with the high ceilings that you will be at as much risk of roasting yourselves out with a tube stove.

 

[DuaeGuttae]

I was in Houston last week. At 7 AM it was 35F. Not typical TX.

Last week was not typical here either in that we had some snow. 35 degrees F would not be unusual in our area, though it varies. We are up in the Hill Country a bit. The temperatures swing a lot.

Here’s a picture of the day after our snow.

 

[Simonkenton]

South Texas, huh? Well if you were down near Laredo your only wood would be mesquite. Are you up near San Antonio? I know there are some oak trees in that area.

 

[DuaeGuttae]

20" height is going to be tough to fit anything in there. Might have to do some demo work to get something to fit, or a stove in front of the fireplace with a thimble/T up higher into the chimney.

Maybe do some demo work on the hearth to lower it in order to accommodate a rear exit stove vented to a liner up the chimney?

This is a nice clean look. I would consider some of the steel tube stoves (welded seams) that have rear venting like the Jotul F45, 50, 55, or the Woodstock steel hybrids if you are interested in a cat. If you aren't averse to having a stove with seams that are gasketed or cemented and may need maintenance down the road (up to and including a re-build,) that opens up many choices in cast iron and stone stoves that rear-vent..Jotul, Hearthstone Manchester or stoners, Woodstock Fireview, Keystone, PH to mention just a few. But I would definitely go with a free-standing stove for the comfort of radiant heat if you spend a lot of time in the stove room as opposed to an insert. I'm not a big fan of fan noise either..
I don't think that with the high ceilings that you will be at as much risk of roasting yourselves out with a tube stove.

Thanks for the thoughts. I will say that my husband is not keen on the idea of demolishing the hearth as he thinks it would turn into a bigger project than we would want trying to keep a nice, uniform look with what’s already in place.

Do I gather from this that no one votes for a freestanding stove in the other part of the house? Because it’s not the focal point? Because of the need for such a high chimney out of the single story?

My husband definitely prefers the idea of a “plug and play” insert. We’d love to hear some suggestions if we are limited to 20”.

Thanks for the thoughts so far. I appreciate your weighing in, though I’m sure many are getting chuckles over our desire to have a stove at all.

 

[DuaeGuttae]

South Texas, huh? Well if you were down near Laredo your only wood would be mesquite. Are you up near San Antonio? I know there are some oak trees in that area.

Not that far South. About three hours north of there up in the hills. Our property is covered in oak, mostly Live Oak (Quercus fusiformis), but we also have Red Oak (several of which are dead and need to come down), and at least one other variety of white. The remnants of a very large branch are sitting in our back walk until my husband can sharpen his chains and buck them. We also have way too much “Texas Cedar” (Ashe Juniper), and we need to do a bunch of trimming and clearing to improve the health of the trees.

We have seen mesquite in the area, but I don’t think we have any. I know it’s used to smoke meat, but that’s about all I know.

 

[begreen]

Problem with plug and play is that the Majestic may not allow for an insert installation. Do you have the model number? It should be on the door frame somewhere. A freestander in another location might be a very good solution, especially if well located.

 

[Hogwildz]

I was under the assumption you wanted to work with the fireplace.
A freestanding elsewhere or in front of the fireplace is a great alternative, with less work & opens up more choices.

 

[Simonkenton]

Well I am glad you are up in the "oak district."
If you want to see some mesquite, drive down to Laredo. You won't have to use your imagination, there are no trees native to the area. You can go for miles, down I35, and see nothing but mesquite. Some mesquite bushes are 5 feet tall, a really big one is 25 feet high.

Yes it is used for smoking meat and I use it all the time.

 

[Woody Stover]

my husband is not keen on the idea of demolishing the hearth as he thinks it would turn into a bigger project than we would want trying to keep a nice, uniform look with what’s already in place.
Do I gather from this that no one votes for a freestanding stove in the other part of the house?

Ideally, you want the stove where you are hanging out most of the time. They are primarily area heaters, and feeling that radiation within sight of the stove is nice. But since you are in a milder climate, having the stove in another room, then moving the heat out may work. That is less than ideal though, and might roast that room out pretty badly. If that living room is big, maybe you can put a stove on another wall and it won't be in the way.
I've never done that kind of work, but for someone with skill and experience, it may be no big deal demoing one of those manufactured fireplaces. Is that hearth just a stone facing on a framed-in structure? A stove would certainly look good there but hubby is right, it would change the look. You would have to come up with something that would look good if you start tearing things up..

We have seen mesquite in the area, but I don’t think we have any. I know it’s used to smoke meat, but that’s about all I know.

I think Mesquite is pretty good. Got any other high-output woods in the area that you know of...Bodark, Pinon..?

 

[Sodbuster]

Thanks for the thoughts. I will say that my husband is not keen on the idea of demolishing the hearth as he thinks it would turn into a bigger project than we would want trying to keep a nice, uniform look with what’s already in place.

Do I gather from this that no one votes for a freestanding stove in the other part of the house? Because it’s not the focal point? Because of the need for such a high chimney out of the single story?

I did take a look at the Englander NC30, if I had the clearance I would have gone for it. Very popular and cost effective at $799 on sale. Creativity can put it almost anywhere including your existing FP, although that would be messy.

 

[DuaeGuttae]

Sorry, Sodbuster, that I didn’t acknowledge you earlier. I was trying just to ask the three who had suggested demolishing the hearth why they were pushing that instead of the freestander. I had thought I had made our two options clear in the original post, but it probably got lost in too much detail.

I will definitely look into the NC-30, but the impression that I’ve had is that it’s a 3 cubic foot heating beast that likes full loads rather than partial. We do want the stove for power outages, but we’d also want to be able to run it the way people who live with real winters do during their shoulder seasons. I’m here for all ideas, though, and I will definitely research it.

Thanks.

 

[DuaeGuttae]

Problem with plug and play is that the Majestic may not allow for an insert installation. Do you have the model number? It should be on the door frame somewhere. A freestander in another location might be a very good solution, especially if well located.

Evidently I was wrong about it’s being a Majestic. I thought that’s what the inspector told me, but I’ve been reading manuals and trying to figure out this strange beast of pre-fab fireplace, and I may have gotten mixed up.

The label says “Superior” and it has a number, but I’m really not sure what I’m looking for. I did my best to get a picture.



It also does have the language that one should not use a fireplace insert “not specified by the manufacturer” on it. Does this mean by Superior or by an insert manufacturer such as Lopi, Pacific Energy, or Blaze King?

On the freestanding stove, we would put it on the wall of the living room that is next to the kitchen. (The third picture on the first post is a sketch. I failed to mark stove location, though.) That’s near the center of the house, but it is isolated from our main living area, and is only one story next to the two-story structure. I would be very open to hearing thoughts about that.

 

[DuaeGuttae]

I was under the assumption you wanted to work with the fireplace.
A freestanding elsewhere or in front of the fireplace is a great alternative, with less work & opens up more choices.

My original post was supposed to be asking for folks’ advice about an insert in the family room versus a freestander in the living room. I must have buried the main point in too many words. Sorry about that.

One real problem is that we don’t really know whether we have the option of working with the fireplace, and we’re trying to do some good solid research before paying someone to come out. My husband would like an insert. I’m torn.

People in Texas build half of everything out of stone. It’s just sad to me that the fireplaces aren’t masonry. I think the realtor thought I was crazy when we were house shopping, and I would make a strike against a house if it didn’t have a masonry fireplace. (The house we ended up with is lovely and got checks on almost every single one of our other priorities, which did have to take precedence over the fireplace.)

 

[DuaeGuttae]

Well I am glad you are up in the "oak district."
If you want to see some mesquite, drive down to Laredo. You won't have to use your imagination, there are no trees native to the area. You can go for miles, down I35, and see nothing but mesquite. Some mesquite bushes are 5 feet tall, a really big one is 25 feet high.

Yes it is used for smoking meat and I use it all the time.

One house we looked at had pretty much nothing but mesquite. It was in a different area that was outside of hill country. It was amazing what driving just thirty miles could do. We preferred the hills.

Some of our neighbors have mesquite and just yesterday my five year old picked up one of the seed pods and said proudly, “a pea holder.” I laughed, and my two older children didn’t know why I found it funny.

 

[Woody Stover]

My original post was supposed to be asking for folks’ advice about an insert in the family room versus a freestander in the living room.

Do both! More fire is never a bad thing.

 

[DuaeGuttae]

Ideally, you want the stove where you are hanging out most of the time. They are primarily area heaters, and feeling that radiation within sight of the stove is nice. But since you are in a milder climate, having the stove in another room, then moving the heat out may work. That is less than ideal though, and might roast that room out pretty badly. If that living room is big, maybe you can put a stove on another wall and it won't be in the way.
I've never done that kind of work, but for someone with skill and experience, it may be no big deal demoing one of those manufactured fireplaces. Is that hearth just a stone facing on a framed-in structure? A stove would certainly look good there but hubby is right, it would change the look. You would have to come up with something that would look good if you start tearing things up..
I think Mesquite is pretty good. Got any other high-output woods in the area that you know of...Bodark, Pinon..?

We had an insert in the basement of our last home, and we all gravitated there in the winter because of it. I think that’s why my husband wants to do the same in the area where we already spend time. My kids definitely miss it, as do I.

The family room is so open that there’s really only one other wall, and I don’t think it would work because of what’s above it. That’s why we thought we’d have to put a freestander in the “formal” living room.

Osage orange and Texas Madrone are native, but I haven’t seen any. Apparently Cedar Elm is common in the area. We’d burn oak and cedar because that’s what we have in abundance with some scattered Texas Persimmon and Texas Mountain Laurel (a tree with lots of poisonous red nuts—I had to tell my kids to assume that everything in Texas was poisonous until we learned otherwise.). I tried posting one of my mystery trees in the wood shed forum a while back and still couldn’t identify despite some great help. It’s a whole different world down here.

 

[Woody Stover]

You can run the non-blower stove when he is gone.

 

[DuaeGuttae]

Do both! More fire is never a bad thing.

That’s what I thought everyone on this forum would say. My husband did suggest it if we could stomach the cost. It wouldn’t pay us back purely monetarily in our climate, but we’d keep the house more comfortable, and we value bringing up our kids to work with us in the out of doors doing something that contributes to the well-being of the family.