Temperature comparisons of firebox inserts vs traditional open brick fireplace (wood)?

[Bahyx]

Are there any wood-burning metal firebox inserts that don't produce more heat than the traditional old-style brick open fireplaces?

We are planning to get a wood burning fireplace built here and the builder suggested I look into fireplace inserts or as he put it 'metal boxes' as they are much cheaper to install. From my very limited understanding of these they seem to be designed, through the use of firebacks and convection chambers, to produce much more heat than a regular old fashioned brick open fireplace. Is this correct? I'm asking because we are wanting the fireplace more for the ambiance and as a decorative feature rather than a heater (though we still want a wood-burning one not one that burns gas or ethanol). Are there any fireplace insert designs that don't produce any more heat than a regular fireplace, or even produce less?

I know it's not the green thing to do but I'm after a fireplace where you can sit by a big bright fire without getting too hot. I know the ethanol ones are great and can do this but I also need to be able to burn things in the fire. I read that the traditional open fireplaces have a very low efficiency rating and that most of the heat goes straight up the chimney (which is actually what I'm after). I just wanted to check that there aren't any fireboxes that are also like this, because it sounds like this would be a far less expensive option.

Cheers.

PS. I live in Australia so my options regarding the fireboxes are probably more limited.

 

[Sprinter]

From my very limited understanding of these they seem to be designed, through the use of firebacks and convection chambers, to produce much more heat than a regular old fashioned brick open fireplace. Is this correct?

Yes, that's true. The fact is that most folks want to use wood burning for heat, either supplemental or full time. To that point all stoves and inserts are designed with efficiency and heat output in mind. Open fireplaces can actually be negatively efficient, pulling more cold air in from the outside than the heat it produces.

You could look into "zero clearance" fireplaces as an alternative to masonry. A search on here or Google will turn up some examples.

BTW, there are many fine examples of freestanding stoves and high efficiency zero clearance fireplaces that are beautiful and provide lovely ambiance. You can have it both ways.

 

[Bahyx]

BTW, there are many fine examples of inserts and high efficiency zero clearance fireplaces that are beautiful and provide lovely ambiance. You can have it both ways.

Thanks man, it seems like it will have to be the old-style open fireplace then. The reason I don't want it too hot is because I live in Brisbane and much of the time here it's already ridiculously hot.

I did a quick google of 'zero clearance' and found: Zero clearance is a term used to describe a certain fireplace’s ability to be enclosed completely by combustible building material that can be positioned right up against the body of the fireplace. That is the back, top, bottom and sides. The front area is designed to radiate heat and therefore must be given adequate clearance to combustibles.

I could only find the term when it was talking about fireboxes, open fireplaces can't be zero clearance right? I did in fact ask the builder where we could have a brick open fireplace hearth with the flue/chimney of an insert/firebox (as that's where most of the cost would come from) and he said probably not due to regulations.

 

[Sprinter]

This is an example of what I was referring to: (broken link removed to http://www.renaissancefireplaces.com/en/photo-gallery)
Yes, they are also designed with efficiency and heat output in mind, as are most any modern wood burning appliance.

Here are some other ideas:
http://www.heatnglo.com/Browse/Fireplaces/Wood-Fireplaces.aspx#

http://www.heatilator.com/en/Browse/Fireplaces/Wood-Fireplaces.aspx#

Your contractor probably can show you other options available to you and other members here may be able to suggest other options as well. Stick around.

 

[webby3650]

What you are looking for is a Zero Clearance Fireplace. They are built into the framing of the house with a double wall air cooled chimney all the way out of the house. Once that is in you can cover the face with brick or tile, whatever you choose as long as it non-combustible in the area around the face of the fireplace. The chimney only requires a 2" clearance to combustibles. No stone is required on the chimney, can even be a flashing on the roof instead of a chase if you want to save some cash.

 

[Bahyx]

What you are looking for is a Zero Clearance Fireplace. They are built into the framing of the house with a double wall air cooled chimney all the way out of the house. Once that is in you can cover the face with brick or tile, whatever you choose as long as it non-combustible in the area around the face of the fireplace. The chimney only requires a 2" clearance to combustibles. No stone is required on the chimney, can even be a flashing on the roof instead of a chase if you want to save some cash.

Just to be clear, the hearth with these can be a regular open fireplace hearth and not just the firebox type? Because, if so, that would be great, the builder said building the chimney out of bricks would be the really expensive part.

 

[webby3650]

Thats right, they are completely open on the front. You need to put something non-combustible on the floor directly in front of it. You can also add doors if you want.

 

[Bahyx]

That is awesome, thank you very much man. I'm surprised none of the builders I've talked to mentioned this. We plan on having a sandstone mantle and it would be good to have doors to we can leave it unattended.

Cheers again.

 

[webby3650]

Just search the net for ideas. Don't look for inserts, search zero clearance woodburning fireplace instead.

 

[mellow]

Interesting, most hearth.com members are ripping these out and here we have someone looking to put one in, to bad you are so far away you could probably get a deal on a used ZC fireplace.

 

[Bahyx]

Interesting, most hearth.com members are ripping these out and here we have someone looking to put one in

Just curious, why don't they like them?

 

[mellow]

They want MORE heat.

 

[begreen]

There are lots of cheap contractor grade zc fireplaces on the market. Many are for show and a good fireview, but poor for heat.