Thermo-damage to Porcelain Enamel, from Water-spills

[TruePatriot]

Hi all,

I'm trying to decide between getting a pretty, enameled stove or simpler, painted-steel one, which I can repaint after whatever I thawed out over it falls down onto it, or I spill water on it.

I (without permission) transplanted two posts by Elk and Gunner on the issue of water damage to porcelain, to jumpstart this new thread. (UncleRich, if I'm banned for this, you're my lifeline--shoot me a PM with your email addy--LOL j/k). Seriously, I hope I haven't broken a rule or offended anyone by "transplanting" these guys' comments.


From Elk:

Water can be boiled I agree with gunner but does one know what boiling watter does to enamal if it boils over the top. Unfortunately this happened to my prior Blue enamal stove.
My wife put in some pouporie ( sp) well it did not react well with the water and boiled over the boiling watter hits a 500 dregree enamal surface and there is an instant 300 degre difference instant shok to the enamal A day later cleaning off the surface and little like ice o pellets started comming off but they were enamal pellets Damn it ruined a good looking stove rendering it ugly. I purchased a new top which led tojust about a total rebuild of the stove. I would rathe boil water on a griggle top of painted castiron /steel stove. I will not make that mistake again.

From Gunner:

Good point elk. I don’t know what difference it would make but with the VC the stove body itself is enameled where the PE it is the outer shroud that is enameled. It doesn’t get near as hot but it still would not be good thing to have a boil over. Also the trivot area(PE version of a griddle) is not enameled it is nickel or gold or painted black.

So...has anyone "successfully spilled" cold water on a convection stove, like the Napolean 1900 or P.E. Summit "Classic" and got away with it?

I would also like to hear about anyone's spill-experiences with ANY enameled stoves, not just the convenction-jobs.

If anyone happens to know the surface temps at the time, or can supply an idea of their general surface temps, that would be helpful.

Was it cold water or boiling water?


Forget Spills--What About Wet-Mitten-Drip?

I already know my stove will be a "working stove" and by that I mean, I plan to possibly hang laundry by it, and thaw stuff out like frozen gloves, etc..., perhaps on a nearby rack. IOW, I am SURE I will drip water on this stove (while cooking?), or have a "boil over," even if I don't spill any on it, no matter how careful I am. Do even single drops of water do damage of any kind to porcelain enamel? Like leave permanent watermarks, or cause chipping?

Chips, Discoloring or Cracking?

I'm also interested in people's experiences with chipping, discoloration (from heat or ?) or cracking, generally. My g.f. seems to think that no matter how careful we are, the stove is going to get chipped up, or simply start "flaking off" and look bad, in 10 or 20 years, even if I don't drop anything onto it. I guess she's just thinking the continuous, normal variations in temps will damage the porcelain. What are your thoughts on this?

Thanks everyone.

Peter

 

[DriftWood]

Good question. Is there a difference between cast iron stoves that are porcelain enameled and steel stoves with porcelain enamel on them?

I have French, 40+ year old, cast iron pots that are enameled. Some look new in side and out, on some the out side looks great, the inside has worn thin to show dark iron. Most have chips at the edges of the lids. I know this is apples and oranges. Pots and pans are tossed into cupboards and bounce around much more than stoves do.

 

[elkimmeg]

If one lets a fire get away to the point they leave a door open or ash door open and the metal under the enamal getts too hot approaching cherry red the enamal will pot off one will see it chip off l leaving pot holes in the surface. Naturally cherry red does other things to any stove. Overfiring voids the warranty. Like any appliance used correctly the enamal is quite resilient under normal conditions Many like the ease of cleaning Yes it can Chip if banged. there are pros and cons that can be discussed and many times I do wonder if I would be better off witha painted stove The paint dulls too and if overfired it will peel and flake off or turn whitish I might caution you any metal will suffer shock if instantly exposed to a 400 degree difference steel stove could develope an instant rust spot cast iron as well lot of possibilities with thermo shock. If using you stove to coke with then it needs monitoring It can be done safetly but one must excersise precautions. or you can ruin a stove if the water hits spills over the top and hit the glass it will crack it for sure. As for mittens that's why I have the optional bread warmer and mittin racks

 

[begreen]

Our cranberry red enamel Jotul 602 often ran up over 700 degree and a few time pegged the thermometer. When it did, you could smell the stove baking and the enamel would turn dark. But after it cooled down, it was fine. After 20 years of yearly use, the stove still looks good. There are a few tiny chips, but it has less than I have over 20 years. I'm not sure what process they're using on the newer Jotuls, but the enameling is thinner and seems even tougher. Given how easy it makes to keep the stove looking like new, I wouldn't hesitate gettng another enameled stove. They stay looking great and don't get that ashen, dusty look that a painted stove gets in a couple years. A good enamel job does not need to be babied.

 

[restorer]

Enamel stoves need a more cautious owner. They are subject to shock damage, they are subject to thermal damage if over fired. They also need to be cleaned on the surface with care. You clean watermarks with a chemical, not brute force. Too much "scouring" and you will dull the sheen. Cold water spilled on a hot stove will damage cast and enameled surfaces. The enamel will show the damage sooner.

The question then becomes, how carefully can you use your stove. The heat on the enameled surface is not as nearly critical as the care you use in operating. The reference to enameled cookware is more valid than not. Over the years as a cast iron dealer I have sold lots of plated (chrome and nickel) and enameled roasters especially. Sold a large (14qt) roaster from the twenties that was used weekly by the same lady. Everything she had was nice. It was as clean a roaster as I have ever seen with uncrazed or chopped enamel. I have also seen 3 year old commercial enamel pans that I wouldn't buy to resell, chipped crazed and dinged all over.

I have seen enameled Belgian cook stoves with the fanciest artwork and plating on them that were mint and very lovingly used. But they were taken care of. If you buy a stove and treat it like your off road wood hauler, it won't look too good going to the prom, right?

 

[Gunner]

I think enamel is tuffer than painted steel, the advantage of the paint is it's easy to fix with a spray bomb.

The very simple solution is to take the steamer off the stove, fill it at the sink and return it to the stovetop. Also don't fill it to the point that it will boil over...problem solved.

Short of dumping large amounts of water ontop of the stove you will be fine.

 

[Roospike]

Think about it this way , the thickness of the steel will make a difference to how the Porcelain Enamel will hold up just like paint. Paint and Porcelain Enamel on thicker steel will not give like thinner steel. Have you ever bumped your car door or hood and it bounced back and gave a little with no problem ? How about your home cook stove in the kitchen or your washer and dryer that are Porcelain Enamel ? any chips are problems with this items ? I haven't seen too many. How about the old iron bath tub ? how many time have you seen a bathtub with chip out of the Porcelain Enamel ? I have seen a lot . Why ? thicker steel and heavier material that dont give a little when bumped.

Now I'm not going to tell you that Porcelain Enamel is going to be 100% safe one thinner steel but it will last a lot longer then on thicker steel items.

I paint a lot of thicknesses of steel and 9 times out of 10 the thinner steel will be problem free and the thicker steel item we paint can and will chip a lot more easier then thinner painted panel pieces.

As for water boiling over on your stove .......... I have a steamer on my stove ( see signature ) but dont put water in it . For humidity i use a humidifier as the stove stop steamers are nice to look at but dont do very well for the home and are also a PITA to keep clean for what little they do.

One point i thought about with Porcelain Enamel is IF the Porcelain Enamel does chip for any reason on my stove then all i would need to do is easily take off the Porcelain Enamel panel with a few screws and replace it with a new one and not have to spend a lot of $$ doing it and dont have to rebuild the stove body in the process to just change out one panel.

Just my .02¢